Telling my Tory voting mother that she should pay for my daughter to go to university.

[sociallyacceptable]

My DD is very bright and could go to university if she doesn't arse about trying to be cool like I did. She is now 12.
My mum often talks about what she might do at university when she is older. I have been considering discouraging her from going because of the cost, we cannot afford to fund it ourselves unfortunately and she will have huge debt. It's kind of light hearted but I feel like telling my Tory voting mother that she should pay for her to go as she is not interested in voting to change this.

[Sionella]

You chose to have a child. It's your responsibility to feed and clothe and educate her, nobody else's - sorry.

[peppatax]

I have been considering discouraging her from going because of the cost, we cannot afford to fund it ourselves unfortunately and she will have huge debt.

Haven't RTFT but this sort of attitude is exactly why the next generation is stuffed.

[pottered]

i agree world, same with medical doctors going abroad, we should be giving funding on the basis of a certain amount of years staying in the UK after that. Yes, I used to whisper 'investment banking' in my DH's ear as a joke when he was doing his PhD - his first post PhD job offers paid less than entry level secondary school maths teaching.

[titchy]

Student debt is taken into account when applying for a mortgage.

No - the REPAYMENTS are taken into account, not the balance.

More bloody scaremongering.

[PersianCatLady]

I cannot afford for my DS to go to uni and live there because his loan would only just cover his accommodation costs.

As I want him to have every opportunity in life, he will go to uni but he will stay living at home so that he can pay for own living costs out of his loan and be able to concentrate on his studies.

He will also work part time to be able to pay for the overseas residential parts of his course.

It is not ideal but he is more than happy to do it this way.

[pottered]

it's not ever been vastly different - i worked part-time and holidays through-out my degree to help with living costs (and the job gave me free accommodation).

It's easier to work during degrees for subjects with low teaching hours though.

[Bluntness100]

Is it bluntness? Any evidence for that or is it just because you say so?

Why don't you take five mins and have a look at the repayment plans and make a decision yourself? Student debt is designed to be manageable, and repayments escalate as your salary does to ensure it remains manageable.

[howthelightgetsin]

Look I'm not diminishing the size of the loans people take out, but it is effectively a graduate tax... so not sure why people wouldn't want their kids to go based on the loan?

[WorldsacpeLove]

@Perper - I disagree with your comment about it being an option for everyone (point 2)- I know many young parents who can't afford to go to university even with the costs of grants and maintenance without a considerable amount of financial support from someone else.

I also know that grants and maintenance do not cover the costs of fees, living and course essentials in London in many cases.

[PersianCatLady]

Low income families do have to pay,

My son is entitled to the maximum support for uni but he will still need (in the first year) to borrow £9250 for the fees and around £7000 for the maintenance loan.

Obviously the subsequent two years will cost about the same.

However, he will only have to start repaying when he earns over £21000 and the rate is quite reasonable.

It is a shame that the system is like this but rather than think of it as a debt, I have told him to think of it as a taxation on his salary for the education he received.

The course he will be doing involves a lot of work experience and industry connections. 93.2% of graduates on the course are employed 6 months after graduating, so I think that it will give him a better start to the world of work than not going to uni.

[Whileweareonthesubject]

I never had the chance to go to university, neither did dh. I think I would have done well, if I'd had the chance in the first place. DH and I decided when our dcs were born, that we would do whatever it took to give them the chance to go, it they wanted to. Even when fees were brought in, too late for us to make any meaningful financial contribution, we did whatever we could to support them on their studies and to follow their choice of education /school etc - things neither dh nor I had. DC 1 went and pays back loans from salary. DC2 chose to work. Both are doing well. But, DC2 will reach a point where further study is necessary in order to continue climbing the career ladder.

I do think some provision should be made to rebate at least some of the loan where the student goes into something like medicine/teaching. Maybe linked to staying in the profession for a certain number of years.

[howthelightgetsin]

Of course repayment is manageable because it's a percentage of your income over a threshold. If you don't earn much you barely pay. If you are made redundant you stop paying. It's not like taking a car loan out which is a much worse proposition - but yet I doubt people are discouraging their children from using finance to fund cars in the same way they do to use student loans.

[Sionella]

Persian - I think you and your DS are taking exactly the right approach. Wish I'd done that when I did my masters. I put myself about £20k into debt because I wanted to live in London. My mother was right, as always!

[PushingThru]

"I think the OP's point is not who introduced them but the fact that Labour are going to abolish them if they get into power."

This. I really do think the Tories could confiscate and sacrifice people's first borns & a thick rump of cap doffing cunts in this country would still vote for them. Look what they've done to the country since 2010. If you vote for them you should be fucking ashamed.

[DistanceCall]

Yes, because working as a saleswoman in a shop or as a waitress is going to enable your daughter to buy a house (which you seem to think is the be-all and end-all of life) SO quickly.

[Bluntness100]

.. so not sure why people wouldn't want their kids to go based on the loan

So my daughter is studying law. She loves it and wants to be a solicitor. She is a straight a student from a level to gcse. What should I have said. No darling it's far too expensive. Don't do what you want to do with your life. Do something you don't really enjoy. Spend your life being fucking miserable in a low paid job. Avoid the debt. That's a much better way.

Seriously?

[WorldsacpeLove]

Persian, just so you know in 2015 93.2% of UK domicile full-time first degree leavers were in employment and/or further study six months after graduating, so his future university is about average in terms of gaining employment within 6 months. Please don't let him drop down a gear with thoughts that that is a good employment rate and likely to guarantee employment.

[PersianCatLady]

The new loans going out will have to be paid back once you are earning £17,000 or has no one noticed this ?
That is completely wrong.

That was the system for loans taken out before 2012.

The current system (Plan 2) is £21,000.

www.gov.uk/repaying-your-student-loan

[whoputthecatout]

OP - it's easy to berate the older generation for getting their university education for free, but you're ignoring the fact that back in the day when us over 50s went, only about 8% of young people got into university. It's now knocking on 50% and there isn't a limitless purse to fund whoever wants to do a degree.

This.

The solution for a lot of my (much older) generation, with A levels that qualified them for a place, but no places to go to, was to work after A levels then study in the evenings and weekends for an external degree.

[PersianCatLady]

Persian - I think you and your DS are taking exactly the right approach
Thank you.

This might also sound selfish but as it has always been just the two of us, financially things haven't been easy but if he was to leave home, my household expenses wouldn't suddenly halve.

Therefore him staying here works for both of us at the moment but you never know, things might change.

[pottered]

the other thing about free tuition is the opportunity cost - it isn't free. It's also not clear that 50% of children going to university for free is the best use of the money - what about spending the money on primary, secondary and non-graduate routes into jobs so that students that didn't fancy the debt could have better alternatives?

[Justanotherlurker]

Don't worry if labour get in and reverse the tuition fees then Universities will inevitably restrict course and reduce the percentage of those who go to uni.

So your DD may not even get the chance to go anyway

[Fairenuff]

OP both my dcs got part time jobs when they were 14 and started saving. My dd is currently finishing her second year at university and I haven't had to subsidise her at all. She has taken out the loans and uses her savings and wages from current part time job to top up. It can be done but they need to have some financial sense in order to budget etc.

On the flip side, it doesn't seem fair to those already at university, or recently left to abolish the fees.

[kirinm]

It is a debt. It impacts on how much you can borrow for a mortgage and reduces your income monthly. How is it not a debt?

Labour may have introduced fees but not to £9k a year which by anyone's standards is ridiculously high. It's such a bullshit argument. In any event, it's a different labour government who are promising to cut fees. Are the Tories? Hmmmm, no they are not and what they actually want is no upper limit on fees.

OP, I too expect my mother to think about the future of her grandchildren when she votes (thankfully she is not a Tory). I think about how my vote will impact future generations but not everyone does as can be seen by this thread and lots of other election related thread at the moment.

[PersianCatLady]

Persian, just so you know in 2015 93.2% of UK domicile full-time first degree leavers were in employment and/or further study six months
How odd that the figures are exactly the same.

This 93.2% I mentioned is for graduates from this degree being in paid employment after 6 months.