To think scrapping tuition fees is a terrible idea

[bumbleymummy]

Just that really. Corbin saying he's going to scrap fees from September. Bloody stupid idea and something else that we can't afford to pay for.

It's a bit unfair on my daughter , who has just finished university, should be back dated,

All the people endlessly repeating "they get a loan, how can they not afford to go?" - you do know the maintenance loan is means tested? So a family earning £40k p.a. (two parents, £20k each), their child is entitled to receive a loan of £6615 p.a.
Except that this isn't actually enough to cover accommodation at some universities, let alone food, books, travel.
If your parents have other children/high housing costs, how are they supposed to find the rest?

My loan was means tested too and I didn't get enough to live on as well as pay fees. I got a job and that paid my living expenses.

Me too, I worked through my entire degree, as my parents made none of the contribution they had been assessed to make. It cost me at least one class.
Also, low-paid, service /hospitality jobs are all filled by people from new EU countries now. Supermarkets are filled with older non-retirees. Where are these jobs that students should get?

It doesn't devalue tertiary education and make everyone go to university whether they're suited to it or not. We HAD free tuition. It didn't do this!

We had free tuition for the brightest 10%. Now we have 40-50% at university with no where near that many graduate jobs. Tertiary education is already devalued. Start making it free again and it will be a 3 year holiday for even more people.

bubbleymummy - were you paying the £9000 fees ? Was it before accommodation costs went rocketing up ?
If we could not afford to help my son, he would need to find a job that fitted around his uni work and paid about £700 a month. There is no way he could be sure of finding a job like that once he got to uni, so he would not have had the option of going. Once you commit to go, you are committed to paying the fee's and accommodation, even if you cant find a well paid part-time job.

No, as I said earlier, my loan was about 3,500 a year for 5 years. My rent in a shared house was about 250 per month and then I had food/utility bills/books/travel on top of that. Minimum wage was a hell of a lot lower than it is now and I worked 2 (and for a while 3) different jobs to pay for it. I worked very long hours at the weekend and over the summer.

My fees were around 1200 pa

So your total loan was £15k? It's a fraction of £45k your course would cost now before even considering living costs.
Breathtaking.
Plus, if you did a five year course, presumably you are pretty well remunerated now?

It was s bit over 15k plus interest so it was around 20k in total when I finished. Yes, I am aware it costs more now. It also doesn't have to be paid back until students start earning more (my repayments started when I earned 15k) and it gets written off after a certain number of years. Mine does not.

Does this mean the permanent student can stay foc in the education system their whole adult life just bouncing from one course to another?

But this morning, bumbleymummy, you said your loan's "not that big a deal"?
So it probably wouldn't need writing off, would it?
This whole thread is starting to sound like "it's not faaaaiiiiir".

Madwoman- no, that's never been the case, even when there were grants-in-aid your LA paid three years fees for you only. My DH did a four year undergraduate degree, and had to go and be interviewed by the LA as to why he thought they should pay another year, and why hadn't he finished yet?

I think the number of students attending university should be reduced, many end up employed in jobs that do not require a degree. The ones who go should be more generously funded

It hasn't been a big deal. I've just been chipping away at it over the years and, as I said earlier, it hasn't stopped me from getting other loans or a mortgage etc. I'm just pointing out some of the differences. I'm (probably) earning more than I would have done without the degree - even with the repayments - so overall it's been worth it.

As I said earlier, I think the current system could definitely be improved (and several suggestions have been made) but I think scrapping all fees is going too far - for the reasons already discussed.

bubblemummy - I really don't think you can compare you situation with todays students. My sons fees are £9000, but going up in Sep. His halls for his first year were £144 per week! My niece who is just 3 years older than my son can't believe how much more debt he will be in.

Yes, I agree that the increase in fees is steep. (Although my hall fees were also ridiculously high - hence moving out to a shared house) but, as I said earlier, there's a difference between reducing the fees and scrapping them completely.

As others have pointed out, with the higher threshold for repayments starting and the debt being written off after a certain number of years, most of the loans won't be paid back. It needs to be changed - but not in the way Corbyn has suggested just to get the young vote

Although I would love it if the fee's were stopped altogether, I also think £3,000 would be OK. What I think they need to sort out is that all students should be able to get a decent maintenance loan that would cover accommodation, food etc, so no student has to be dependent on their family to support them. Also the interest on the student loans should be a reasonable rate.
I was surprised that someone earlier said that you did not need a degree to become an accountant. I did not know that you could still go down a non degree route for professions like that, given that so many basic admin jobs require a degree these days. Can you still progress up the career ladder without a degree?

I was surprised that someone earlier said that you did not need a degree to become an accountant. ............ Can you still progress up the career ladder without a degree?

Yes, once you're a qualified accountant, it doesn't matter whether you went to uni or not - the accountancy qualification itself is degree equivalent. For example, the ACCA qualification is equivalent to a masters degree. You basically do all the studying/exams alongside your job whilst on a training contract. Getting an accountancy degree at uni, doesn't make you an accountant - you still have to get a few years of relevant supervised work experience and still have to do the further studying/exams to become a qualified accountant - the only difference is that if you went to uni, your degree will give you a few exemptions from the lower papers of the accountancy qualification.

I know a few people wgi would have suited that route of entry much better. Is it widely available or are there only a few firms that offer it?

Is it widely available or are there only a few firms that offer it?

Very widely available, in smaller accountancy practices in every town and city throughout the country. The larger prestigious firms tend not to be as keen and tend to prefer the graduate entry route, but some, such as KPMG do have a non graduate entry scheme.

Thanks bunny 😊 Good to know

All the people endlessly repeating "they get a loan, how can they not afford to go?" - you do know the maintenance loan is means tested?

Yes, and from what I can gather, they aren't what they want to get rid of, just the tuition fee's themselves; and there would probably be hell on if they did. For what it's worth though I do believe the maintenance loans are a joke, considering the parents have nothing to do with paying back the loans, why are their incomes taken into account when the money is first dished out? Everyone should get the same regardless of their parents income.

But many use the loans to pay the massive tuition fees, hence the link.

A few of the posters on this thread are being completely disingenuous if the conservatives would have proposed this idea theyd be fawning all over it

Just adding to what Badbadbunny said on accountancy. I trained with one of the "Big 4" in the City almost 30 years ago. There were non-graduate entrants then and they are still part of the mix today. It really doesn't make a difference to future career progression, even here. In fact when I was recruited they were more interested in my A Level equivalent results than my degree. Also worth noting that having an accountancy degree as opposed to anything else is not necessarily an advantage. I was researching on behalf of my DC recently and if anything the firms are promoting the non-graduate route more than they did in my day.

The Big 4 also offer a whole range of short taster internships for school leavers and undergraduates.