Tories going to axe free school meals

[cannotbelievethistoday]

So I have 2 children in private school.

Labour want to put VAT on private school fees, and extend free school meals to all primary children.

Tories are going to remove infant free school meals.

Bloody hell. And still people will vote Tory.

(My 2 kids are in private school - I totally agree with labour on this one)

Conservatives are saying that removal of these extra benefits to society is necessary to balance the books while simultaneously giving multi million pound companies and the wealthier section of society tax breaks that amount to extra income. How, in anyone's logic can that be practical??

Well it's not practical. We know that. Tory Debt keeps growing. Ideology?

/Their measure, not mine.

Great post Merigold

"I can afford to pay the VAT, as can all the parents in my children's classes."

You do not know the financial circumstances of every child in two classes - not all in private schools are wealthy - many on full of partial bursarys, others working 24/7 and just managing to pay.
I think
This is a stealth boast about how much money you have op / and yet how you care for the poor!
Two of mine are on funds assisted places and the portion we do have to pay is paid for with a lot of effort and hard work. You do not know everyone's financial circumstances and your post is crass.

Quite, Rufus, I started asking this on about page 17, only a couple of people have even picked up it since. I pity our headteacher this morning, faced with trying to plan for this new burden when he has only just finished a round of staff cuts.

@jamiexeed74*,*@oliviapoperules
I was saying debt went to 733 at start of banking crisis, yes it was nearly 1tn in 2010
Debt:
Start of banking crisis 08/09 - 733bn, 09/10 998bn & 16/17 1701bn.

Before 08/09 highest labour deficit over the 12 years was 21bn, lowest was - 25bn
Deficit through Austerity:
10/11 97bn, 11/12 78bn, 12/13 86bn, 14/15 66bn

Basically the conservative party have been superb at promoting the necessity of austerity and trashing labour's economic record. cf graph from treasury data:

If austerity was a success they would be shouting about it - it wasn't so its being forgotten. That's the point - hitting free schools meals has a disproportionate impact on the 'just managing' relative to 'the wealthy' on this forum who are proclaiming 'i don't need it'.

And remember - means testing is not free - testing and checking needs to be paid for.

Should also remove subsidy for house of lord/commons meals too.

It really is a basic function of a family to feed and clothe their children. Why do so many people feel such an entitlement?

The thing is; like other Tory policies, they're not telling us where that saving will go. I notice lots of you that approve of this removal are making the assumption that the savings will (or should) be channelled into resources that are desperately needed. It's unlikely to be the case, so then you have schools that are charging for meals and still not getting the funding for resources so it's a double whammy and no-one is gaining anything. Least of all 'the taxpayer'.

Did you read p52 of the manifesto?

Money saved will be added to the core schools budget.

On p51 it says the core schools budget is being increased by £4 bn by 2022 and pupil premium is protected.

Still the question remains:

Why, of all things, target children?

So many other things need addressing.

It surely costs less to cook meals for all than for a small(er) number.

Also, if you remove the FSM and means test them, kids will pick up on some having, and some not. Surely potential for bullying.

Thanks future
I was really aiming my question on practicality at posters here rather than the politicians. How can people say 'ah well, it's unpalatable, but y'know they've got no choice, the county has no money for this frivolity' while not acknowledging the tax cuts for the wealthiest in society. The country evidently has some money to give out sweeteners.

Yes two i have, but it's very light on the detail isn't it? How much does FSM for Early years cost and how does that compare to (cheaper) breakfasts but across all years? Is there even a saving? Is there any actual evidence that breakfasts would be more beneficial to schools/pupils/parents? Who is really going to make use of it and get their kids out even earlier to go eat a breakfast at school? When you have more than one child why would you feed some at home and drop off others at school..? As for the pennies saved (and it will be negligible) they will get swallowed up in a budget that really won't amount to much per school once the '100 new free schools a year' are lumped in with it.
It's entirely possible that the 4million over the term of parliament including the new schools just means that schools manage on much the same budgets they already are, which we know have been cut to the bone thanks to the 'fairer funding formula' already. I think it's a lot of smoke and mirrors to provide a consistently poor level of investment.

It was means tested right up to Sept 2014.

Reverting to the previous system shouldn't be too difficult - after all it's still running in KS2 and secondaries.

If a school is stigmatising FSM children by having suboptimal practices, it needs to be kicked for that. Because some schools have very good practices which make it imperceptible, and those should spread.

I completely agree with you marigold

And it terms of this: It really is a basic function of a family to feed and clothe their children. Why do so many people feel such an entitlement? teaching children about different types of food is pretty fundamental to education. Functional feeding, ie bunging a ham sandwich (or last night's takeaway) in a lunchbox everyday doesn't do this.

swirly

Its as if people have their head in the sand

Loads of 'tories are being clever getting rid of school meals for all' comments and 'waste of money' comments

Just how much do people think is going to be saved by breakfasts for all

The staffing costs will be similar to that of lunchtime, but just a bit cheaper for the food

So lib dems dumb for helping to bring in free school meals for all

But tories A ok for bringing in free school breakfasts for all

I dont get it

Its like on another thread evil stupid labour bringing in £10 minimum wage but yay tories bringing in a £9 MW (granted over a slightly longer time period)

Divide Rufus.

teaching children about different types of food is pretty fundamental to education

Food groups are covered in the science curriculum, but where do you think parental responsibility comes in? When they are getting their slice of meat, ice cream scoop of mash, and spoon of peas at school, when are they getting this teaching about different types of food?

FSM were introduced so that all children had a hot meal once a day. That is all, not as some great educational initiative.

Way I see it: universal FSM for primary is removed. FSM still exists but is means tested as it is for other educational levels.

FSB are introduced for every child.

Surely that means that the poorest children are now entitled to two free meals a day, rather than just the one atm. Therefore the social provision actually goes up....

Unless I'm missing something.

Food groups are covered in the science curriculum, but where do you think parental responsibility comes in?

It's fine to chuck in parental responsibility. But those parents who don't take responsibility it is the children who suffer. FSM increases the different foods children have tried, for many kids substantially. It's all very well middle class people sneering at peas, but the diets some children have are awful.

FSM is only 39 weeks of the year. Doesn't do anything to help during the other 13 when they're not at school. Also doesn't do anything to help when the kids get older and they're no longer eligible.

Availability for a limited period of the year is a problem that needs addressing. But the policy isn't there to address that (Although it should, but in fairness I don't think Lab covered this either)

The FSB across all years means that KS2 and secondary pupils will get one meal, even if they don't meet the means tested criteria. Again, surely that's an improvement?

If you meet the FSM criteria then you are essentially guaranteed two free meals a day (for 39 weeks a year) through you entire school life.

Currently you would get one.

The introduction for FSB means that is still protected.

big

I dont care one way or the other to be fair

Means tested FSL is fair enough and you would have to give the breakfasts free to everyone otherwise you would soon be able to work out who was getting it free as they may well be the only ones there

But...its a logistical nightmare. Its really badly thought out

Its one of those fantastic in principle ideas

big

And i agree with you, in principle it would ensure that those children that need it are fed at least two meals which would be great

@Rufus

Just like every political promise ever then.

big

Absolutely

Bit sad though isnt it