How are schools allowed to take pupils on holiday in term time?

[Cab65]

Last year my DD was fined for taking her DS out of school on holiday for three days during term time. This year the school is taking him and his class on holiday to the Isle of Wight for a week during term time. How can this be allowed. I have never seen a better example of don't do as I do do as I tell you. Why aren't more parents fighting this injustice.

Elode you can teach all that in your average secondary school and on day trips everybody could afford to go on.

What happens to all those kids who can't afford expensive residential trips? Do they not get to learn those skills? What about the disruption for those left behind?

The year 7s are going skiing next spring in USA. It includes shopping on the way home. Not sure about this being educational.

GreenGinger
No you can't. Being away from home & family for a week iin a different country s different from a day trip to Chester Zoo or a day in school. You must see that it develops different skills.

As for being inclusive... You send your DC on trips you can afford. A £1200 school trip to USA & Canada is not possible.
My parents couldn't afford to send me on school trips and there were plenty. I never remember anyone having a 'it's not fair attitude' or exclaiming that 'if I can't go, nobody can go'.
Life isn't fair. Another great lesson to learn.
Dreams of Luxury holiday in Barbados and remembers to book campsite in Wales...

I think some school trips are more educational than others. I think family holidays can also be educational. Someone up-thread talked about how school ski trips were educational - an opportunity for PE, practise languages, develop "awe and wonder"etc. I absolutely agree but I think there are inconsistencies in suggesting skiing is educational if the school takes the kids and morally abhorrent and illegal if parents do. (And I say this as someone who doesn't ski.) And this view isn't inconsistent with acknowledging that teachers work incredibly hard on school trips and being very grateful my kids are taken on trips.

In our school, as I've said, the 'jollies' like ski trip and Classics trip are in the holidays. Curriculum time is so tight that only field trips go out in term time. Don't want to go on them; don't go. Disagree with how your school does things? Take it up with the head. Not all schools organise things the same way.
We've stopped doing theatre trips (sadly) the cost of cover (which has to be costed into the trip) and coach travel means that we can no longer (even with school party discounts) offer theatre trips that are cheaper than it would be for the parents to take their children. We now only go to the local theatre (walking distance).

And, most importantly, schools are not the ones giving fines out for holidays. It was government policy.

It's not about "it's not fair" at all. It's about some children being allowed to go on non essential school trips when the gov says any time off has an impact on education and causes disruption.

And sorry we were ditched in Birmingham bull ring centre with instructions to fill out 10 questionnaires,ditched on Dartmoor with only a map to get back......

There are loads of ways to teach resilience. If overnight is necessary you choose something that compliments the curriculum,everybody can go on and is affordable for school to pick up the tab if some can't.

I think it is true that some educational trips could be done with parents but that you are missing the point. I work in a relatively middle class school but still very few kids would have the opportunity to go canoeing on a family holiday. The experience of going with your friends is completely different. Some parents can afford for their child to go to Paris, pgl, skiing, etc. But could never afford for their whole family to go so therefore would be an opportunity lost. Spending 4 days in Wales when it rained the whole time measuring infiltration rates while my family were at home and I had to pay for extra childcare-how dare I?....

Our DGCs school is running a ski trip in February next year completely during term time. The DC's dad and my DH went to the meeting which gave all the info. The lovely PE teacher did an excellent job of referring to the jaunt as 'This Residential Experience" and only slipped up once - "This holiday..."

I agree that the trips should be affordable to the whole class. I remember plenty of school trips I couldn't afford to go on. I just had to sit around at school, not doing much whilst we waited for everyone to get back from their skiing trip. Then we had to stick up photos of the trip everywhere, and talk about it non stop. I wish that I could have gone on holiday with my family for 2 weeks whilst all that was going on.

Not all school trips are term time too - we take some trips out in half term so the group isn't missing lessons.

In fact, we don't do that many residential trips at all. Which is quite sad because they are a brilliant opportunity. Beneath the masses of parents taking sneaky term time holidays, we have plenty that can't even afford that, or just aren't interested in giving their dc new experiences, and often the school will pay for these kids to go.

. If you take a yr 6 residential trip for example, the kids go to the next county and spend 3 days canoeing, climbing etc. Just them. I don't think it's any more educational because school take them, compared to if we took them, and it's all stuff we would do on a holiday together

That's all very well for the children who have families who either can or will take them but for many children the only place their families take them is to the shops.

You have families in poverty, families with several children, families where the children are carers, families where they don't have a car, families who cant go away because of older siblings doing important exams etc etc. All those children would miss out on the opportunities given by a school residential, why should they?

Just because you can take your children on such a trip doesn't mean that others should miss out.

My dc are lucky and get to travel a lot to many different countries but last year my Dd went in a residential to Scotland and went up Ben Nevis and did all kinds of activities that she wouldn't have got to do otherwise because we choose a different sort of holiday and made some great memories and learnt a lot.

But plenty do miss out,don't go on these trips and then suffer disruption on top. Just because a school puts on a trip it doesn't mean everybody can go.

It's actually going to be less likely that families can afford school residentials now as nobody can take their kids out term time. Any spare cash will be going towards scraping for premium holiday prices in the school holidays.

Family holidays are far more important than a school residential if I had to choose between the two

A friend of mine's dd is asking to go on another school trip. It's going to be £900 for her to go to Italy with the school for 5 days. It's just an ordinary school in an ordinary area. I'd say that most families don't have £900 going spare, and it's going to be a real struggle for most to afford it. Why do schools put families in this position? It just puts a strain on everything, and some kids feel like they're missing out. All their friends are going. Oh you're too poor? Your family is too poor? That's too bad. Tell you what, you just sit around school, missing all your friends with half the staff gone, and then you'll get to hear non stop talk about it when they get back. If you dare go on a cheap holiday with your loved ones, we'll fine you. How about making the trips more affordable, and inclusive, so that all of the children can benefit? They don't have to go all the way to Italy to learn social skills, independence, team building and whatever. They could have an educational trip at a camp site in Wales or something.

People need to get off their high horses.

This isn't about teachers at school level. Everyone knows how much they give up to provide these trips and that many feel forced to go despite them not really wanting to as part of school tradition.

We are a family of teachers here spanning a few generations and we also have the same mindset as the OP.

Recently a friend of ours asked for her DD to have 2 days off to attend a world sports competition in Europe. School refused.
I told her to write immediately to governors and ask them to explain why they felt her DD missing 2 days of educational lessons was going to impact on her future so much yet as a school they organised whole days of sports event for a few of a year group who excelled in the sport - who also missed lessons and whole school sports days.
It was authorised within 30 minutes and her DD won her first gold international medal. Which unsurprisingly the school got put in the newspaper, school website, prospectus of her in uniform with her medal.

I don't know what the solution is but certainly some students who have 3 days off school with parents for a trip can have better attendance than others who can afford all the school trips on offer and so miss school (except their absence gets marked as present but offsite!)

It's actually going to be less likely that families can afford school residentials now as nobody can take their kids out term time. Any spare cash will be going towards scraping for premium holiday prices in the school holidays.

So because some children can't afford it then none should have the opportunity ? I work term time only (not a teacher) and a condition of that is that I don't have holidays in term time, I prioritise school residentials as I think they really benefit children and we have holidays that are within our budget in the school holidays. Children are just as happen with a week away camping as they are with a fortnight abroad. It's the parents who tend to want the aspirational holidays.

This cannot be real!!!

I work in education and I simply love leaving my own children at home with extended family to go and take someone else's ungrateful children away for a few days....I genuinely hope this isn't the attitude of a lot of people!!

Everyone seems to be ignoring the many teachers saying that in their schools jollies aren't in term time.
If you have a problem with your school take it up with them. Not all schools do trips in the same way. Schools are not responsible for fining parents.

900 pounds and Italy sounds like a lot. Definitely would prefer a week camping in Wales. However, it tends to be the loudest shouting group of parents who are catered for. No doubt that, if next year they planned to camp in Wales, more people would complain that their DC would be missing out on a trip to Italy.

Our school education trip to a forrin land is booked over a long weekend. Rise up against the bastard selfish teachers having to give up weekend time. I think not, DH and I are off for a mini-break to Venice!

JessKM

It's not a holiday. It's a school residential which is educational in some way and team and relationship building.

I am running a ski trip to USA next year and have pencilled in a 'shopping' trip one evening to an outlet and NYC for 24 hrs on the way back. Pupils had asked that trips like this are available and so we arranged it. We will get the Friday before half term off as the flights and the holiday are Friday to Friday. Then myself and 4 members of staff will give up all of our half term to take the children. It is expensive but we have arranged it so families have 15 months to pay. We also pay towards the trip so we can take extra staff.

Oops I used the word holiday - which it will be for the pupils as it is away from home etc but not quite for staff, even though we will have a great time.