Nursing homes for elderly people with dementia. A good thread derailed; can we try again please?

[OCSockOrphanage]

I know there were some people adamantly opposed to the idea that they might ever need to place their parents in care. but this was, I felt, a useful thread for all of us wrestling with the decision. Any takers for its continuation?

keep those are safeguarding issues and need reporting to your local social services

We had exactly the same issues with my DM when she was in hospital, especially the food one- no one helped her eat and the uneaten food was simply collected later on, nobody noticed or cared that she had not eaten. Could we have reported the hospital to Social Services? I am sure they would have just said her care needs were too high and they were too overstretched, or some such .

Yes you could and should report any and all negligence no matter what the setting

I wish I had now. The hospital was a nightmare, the staff seemed not to understand dementia at all. They were surprised she could not eat by herself and were indignant when we asked if anyone could help feed her. We ended up going in everyday at mealtimes to feed her ourselves.

My grandma went into a lovely old people's home after developing dementia. The move made her worse and she was soon moved to the dementia wing (which we thought might happen). She was looked after incredibly well, in purpose-built surroundings which made sure she was safe. She was well fed, and led as full a life as she ever had, with trips out to the seaside, local gardens etc.

I had power of attorney and her house was sold soon after she moved. If she'd have spent the last pound on living in such a good place I would have been happy. It was her money that her and my grandad had worked and saved hard for, and it was only right that it was used to allow her to live in comfort.

There is a huge range on homes available - some we went to see were awful - and I'd you get a good one with the right staff there are far, far worse places to be.

KingJoffrey - I'd like to thank you and anyone else working in residential care from the bottom of my heart for the amazing job you do.

Having cared for my Mum (who has dementia) long distance over a period of 2 years we were forced to place her as an emergency in a care home when things got to breaking point. She was found wandering in the pouring rain with no coat, having locked herself out of the house (again) and Social Services intervened. They were wonderful - she was due to be sectioned (which would have destroyed her) but they gave us 48 hours to find an emergency place.

Although she hated it initially, she has settled over time and in our situation it was the only possible option. She needs 24/7 care and we both work full time and have four children who need us. The strain it has placed our whole family under has been intolerable at times.

She is so much better off. Her room is lovely and it is a miniature version of her house with all her own furniture. It's not perfect and sometimes I have concerns but I'm realistic about the extremely difficult job that carers do. When I left my Mum on Sunday after a visit I was talking to one of the carers about bathing my Mum and she said "I care for her just the same way I'd care for my own Mum" and it made me cry with gratitude. Most of the staff are absolutely wonderful and they have a totally open door policy where we can turn up day or night.

My Mum came to stay with our family at Christmas and I didn't sleep for 4 nights as she has erratic waking patterns and gets confused using the toilet i.e. misses and goes on the floor. I had intended for her to come and live with us but those few days confirmed that her condition had advanced so much that it would be impossible without round the clock visiting carers, and even then it would be horrendous with 4 children.

I think that many people think dementia is being a little bit forgetful and confused. My Mum has had a complete personality change, swears and has angry aggressive outbursts.

Don't judge anyones situation from the outside because you are probably not seeing the full picture.

My mum spent her last three Yeats in S nursing home and has dementia.

We could not have cared for her at home.

The staff were amazing, truely incredible.

When she died the staff were lovely. They were moved, one to tears.

It was the best decision for mum and so never felt guilty. I would never make anyone feel guilty for not being able to cope with the care of an elderly relative.

Thank you to all who work on care and nursing homes.

Place marking. We are totally in a dilemma about what to do with elderly mil. She went into hospital mostly compus mentus (sp) and is currently exhibiting all the signs of severe dementia. I think this may improve were she allowed home, but long term, I don't think we can afford 24/7 care. We are debating a care home.

It is possible to develop severe confusion through being in hospital. Infections also cause confusion. Did she have signs symptoms or a diagnosis before admission?

*Occasionally we get a new resident who's been previously living alone.

They're often in quite a state. Malnourished, medication a shambles, inappropriate clothes and unkempt.*

That's the situation we found with a distant relative.

It may be that discharging her to respite to finish recuperating will get her well enough to go home. Speak to a social worker before she's discharged to discuss your options.

It was me who started up that thread your talking about and I had it deleted because people seemed to think I was having a dig at them for putting people in nursing homes that's not what I was getting at what upsets me is that these people are losing everything to pay £1000 a week for seems to me at times is crappy care. They shouldn't have to live the way they do and to top it all off sometimes they are forced to stay in bed that's not the care they are paying for and thats not the kind of care that families want for them. I apologise for getting it deleted but people where bashing me as well for having an opinion and saying I shouldn't do the job that wasn't what I was asking to be told. All these families don't see what goes on when they aren't around I as a carer do see what happens when no one is around.

Siwdmae, has your mil had an infection? Unfortunately, this can result in delirium, acute, sudden confusion. This usually improves over time, but some people are left with some ongoing confusion.

If your mil is still in hospital, the social work team should offer an assessment of need to plan her discharge. They will explain re assessment process, Mental Capacity act, and also finances.

Do feel free to pm me if I can help further.

Siwdmae - sounds like my mum. I think people with dementia are very good at masking the symptoms for a long time when they are on familiar ground. When they suddenly find themselves in hospital the routines which they normally follow are removed and it's much more obvious how much they have declined mentally.

Also, urinary infections are very common in the elderly and can exacerbate/mimic dementia symptoms.

My mum was admitted to hospital and given morphine for severe pain. It knocked her out for 24 hours and when she came round she seemed to have suddenly developed full blown dementia. I'm told morphine can sometimes have that effect. But with hindsight we realised the signs had all been there.

And not all care homes are bad. My mum was in one for 18 months and someone visited her pretty much every day - usually for at least a couple of hours. So we would have noticed signs of neglect. Yes, it's grim to watch someone you love lying in bed all day, unable to speak, feed themselves etc. But that's the nature of the disease.

And OF COURSE assets should be sold to pay for care.

We know when our residents have a UTI or anything like that their confusion gets worse as does other things that gives it away that there is something not right. But we can very quickly get a GP out to them to check them seems to be every week half of our residents are on antibiotics for a UTI or in winter we have D&V flying round that spreads like wild fire round everyone because we can't keep the ill ones confined to one room it's not possible. Yes sell assets if they have them I just think it's a bit cruel to also take everything else away from them and leave them with £26 a week pocket money that's money they have worked damn hard for. Another thing I hate is the way some people talk down to them like they are children no they are bloody not they are grown adults so speak to them with the respect they deserve these are people who have 50 years more life experience than I do its their mind that's gone they haven't suddenly become a toddler so don't speak to them like one sorry that irritates me when people do that.

Peanut if you see or hear anything that concerns you regarding the care of vulnerable adults you can report it anonymously and easily via the CQC website. I've done it myself for hospital nursing care with regard to a nursing clinic my service was interlinked with and action was taken the next day.

michaelsheensnextDW thank you I will keep an eye and report anything that I think is wrong. All I want is a better standard of care for these people they bloody deserve that much at least.

Unfortunately it is not always just thinking about the person with dementia but also thinking about the health of their loved ones who are trying to care for them. Try caring for someone in their own home who doesn't believe it's their home and they are being held hostage there. Dementia has taken my mum from me, we weren't going to let the stress of looking after her take my dad too. She is in the best place for her and my dad is now not at risk of getting ill himself with the sheer stress and sadness of watching his beloved wife deteriorate before his eyes and is also no longer at risk from violent outbursts.

This disease doesn't just destroy the person who has it, it destroys the family who have to watch it unfold.

It is interesting that my DHs relative refused to leave home.Although Dementia made her scared to be at home, and she continually rang the police about alleged burglaries and break-ins, she was determined to stay put even when it was plain to everyone, carers, neighbours, relatives and the police (!) that this was no longer possible. Social Services sent an assessor to live with her for two weeks and eventually agreed a move to a home was required. When interviewed by social workers she said she still cooked (she hadn't for 10 years), she did all her own housework (again not for 10 years) and went up to bed every night (refused to go to bed and sat in her chair all night and couldn't move in the morning, except when she ejected herself from the chair onto the floor) and used the upstairs bathroom (mostly refused to). SS decided to fund a live-in assessor because the answers she gave seemed plausible to them and she wanted to stay in her home, so they tried to continue with that policy. When eventually in a home, she put her coat on and sat waiting to be collected to go home. Except, of course, it had been sold to pay for the home. There is no good in this disease.

MomEquites has dementia, and threatens to kill DadEquites frequently. She told me I was fired from the family business and disinherited. I don't visit, as she is too angry with me. My father visits only once a week on the advice of Mom's key nurse. If she becomes too agitated, she will have to leave the pleasant memory care unit where she now resides. Finding another place after being asked to leave is difficult, as with expulsion from school.

We had no other options.

People always with the best intentions say that they would never put their loved one in a care home. However the loved one requires the level of care that is impossible to provide at home it's cruel to yourself and loved one not to consider this. Anybody who passes a negative judgement for those decisions can do one in my book.

Bojorojo My Mum told her social worker that she could cook for herself, make a cup of tea etc. I think it was true to say she could in the past do these things, but was not able to anymore. But in her mind she remembered doing them so she answered yes she could when asked. It was not deliberate, it was just another sign of the confusion in her mind.

Bojorojo & TheWhiteRoseofYork - an almost identical experience. My Mum insisted she was able to wash, cook, clean and drive (!) when in fact her family were running themselves ragged. After 3 driving incidents in quick succession we removed her car keys as she was a danger to herself, and maybe more importantly other road users.

We spent 2 years caring for her in her own home and it took a terrible toll on my family (still is really). The exhaustion and stress is very difficult to describe because you also experience a long protracted grieving for the much loved person that was. My brother was signed off work with depression and lost his job eventually. My sister had a terrible car crash driving home from visiting my Mum and I am certain that it was partly due to exhaustion.

My husband has been incredible - he cares for our house and children while I care for my Mum but that means family time is cut by half and there is just no time to recover mentally or physically. Most of the time I feel torn down the middle with responsibility for the old and the young at a time when DH and I had just regained a little free time. It doesn't help that DH's Mum also has terminal cancer and needs support.

It is an impossible situation but no one should ever feel guilty if the decision has to be made to place an elderly relative in residential care. The ongoing strain of caring for the elderly can destroy people and families.

The naked greed mentioned above was the motivating factor for my wonderful grandmother, who had a rapidly advancing dementia, being kept at 'home' on the say so of my uncle. She ended up smearing her own faeces on the walls, spent the nights wandering and screaming and was scalded twice by a spilled kettle. It caused horrific tension in the family but because he had very quickly arranged power of attorney for her, he had the final say. Totally and utterly motivated by inheritance. She had a house and small farm. Could easily have funded the very best care in the very best setting. When she died, her other children ( including my father) refused to accept their 'share' and cut contact with him completely.
It still makes me angry to this day. I work in healthcare now and it's still a recurring theme. My children already know that whatever assets I have will be used to pay for whatever care I need.

Caring for an elderly person with dementia at home, must be harder than caring for a child. A friend cared for her Husband at home, but ended up having to put him into a home. He had lost the concept of day and night, and would get up at all times, and wee on the carpet as he could not remember how to use the toilet. My friend was very close to a breakdown herself, before she put him in a home.