To be gutted we're not entitled to any financial help?

[DeanaPiana]

Myself and DH have a combined income of £46000.

I have done numerous calculators and apparently, I am not entitled to Child Tax Credits or Working Tax Credits when baby gets here.

A few sources have even said I shouldn't go for Child Benefit as it wouldn't be worth it in tax returns

We didn't budget for a baby thinking we would get extra help to finance them etc, but I thought we were entitled to at least a little something and I have to say, I feel gutted. We live in a high cost area, London, and rent here too. We want to move out into a more rural/outer area in the next 2 years max but that just doesn't seem possible now. No way we can afford to save that much. We don't even have a lot of outgoings. Our rent is over 1K a month and that is considerablly cheap here.

Just doesn't seem fair at all

The OP works in the NHS. If every low paid NHS worker moved out of London, the London would be fucked basically. So yes, the NHS, and therefore the government should be funding decent wages for people

This Op doesn't have to move out of London, they want to move out of London because they want to live in the country.

This isn't "I can't afford to do my job and live in london" , this is "I want some extra cash from the gov to save up to live my dreams"

Ah yes, FlyAwayPeter, only those earning a FORTUNE have to be grateful for those things, don't they?

Oh dear, I don't quite understand what you mean there cathf - all I was trying to do was remind us all what our taxes pay for (even the childless by circumstance like me) - that the solid public support for our wonderful NHS (free at the point of use), and free education, is a really substantial benefit no-one should take for granted.

And that maybe we should all appreciate what we have here (in the UK) a bit more, and recognise it as a really important & substantial investment in the next generation.

But you're right, TBH, I was overreacting to the OP's rather whiney sounding "can't I get a little something?" - I felt she was ignoring the huge somethings her child will receive as of right. As any child should receive, as of right. I felt in my response that the OP didn't realise what she is already going to get.

Why do you think you should get 'a little bit of something' ?

I am absolutely baffled by that statement.

Do you think the state should be supportng you in any way when you can afford to support yourselves quite comfortably?

Or do you think having a baby entitles you to support so your living standard does not suffer at all?

I would expect a slating here if I was you.

Can't believe anyone can make such a crass comment.

cathf someone on full benefits would NOT be better off than the op fgs.
Its that sort of misconception that has led to people on 46k imagining they are poorly off.

Someone on full benefits who is not exempt from the cap would be on half of what the OP is managing on.

Plus the op is clearly well within the CB limit so feck knows what the angst is about.

And I wanted to remind the OP of what the State already provides. Because if we don't all see the tremendous investment in raising & education healthy children (NHS and schools) then we can be very dismissive of their value.

And that's a step on the way to losing such wonderful public resources ...

We should ALL be grateful.

Haven't read the whole thread but £46,000 income and you want help?!

We have a combined income of £18,000 and the only help we are entitled to is £80 a month child benefit. I'm disabled and can't afford a wheelchair so I live in my bed.

People shock me daily.

There's another thread on here at the mo sparked by the "70k is rich" insinuation from John McDonnell, where the vast majority of posters are saying 70k is "just getting by" or "making do" with London's extortionate cost of living.

If 70k is "enough" in London, what is 46k? Apparently - on this, the other side of MN - it's plenty, stop ya' moaning

It's not the same thing though, this OP has said that they do get by, they just want some extra gov help so they can save up for their dream country pad

The government has just provided a ten thousand pound postgraduate loan. I don't know your situation but I used my maternity leave to study for an MA and have managed to get a much higher-salaried job as a result. Might studying to improve your income once you return to work be an option?

It's not the same thing though, this OP has said that they do get by, they just want some extra gov help so they can save up for their dream country pad

Really? I thought she said she would have thought someone with her family income with living expenses being what they are might be entitled to some kind of relief on the arrival of a second child. Which would make it the same thing...

So OP's take home income is just over 3k but her rent is a grand and there are commuting costs and now childcare to be factored in as well.

I can quite see why you're a bit concerned OP. But you will find little sympathy here.

This government have done a fabulous job of convincing ordinary working people that they are in competition with other ordinary working people for anything approximating a comfortable life.

Depressing.

That's a reasonable combined income. I've no idea why you thought you'd get financial help! You'll get child benefit and childcare vouchers both of which will help.

£1k a month after rent is still a fair amount, OP.

I get about £800 a month, including benefits and have to pay around £200 towards rent from that. I have two children to pay for. (not exact figures. I actually daren't pay too much attention to exact numbers because it's fucking depressing)

Lots of others are in similar positions. Can you understand why seeing someone whinge about not being entitled to benefits so they can afford a holiday would be a bit galling to them?

I think you'll find once you are paying childcare, you will be entitled to some help towards the costs of it.

Maybe you're spending more than you think on frivolous shite? I've been guilty of the same in better times. All those "it's just a £1" add up throughout the month.

Have you sat down and looked at your budget closely to see where the money is going?

Of course, in an ideal world everyone would be able to afford live at a decent standard, but until those at the bottom aren't relying on food banks to survive, I'm afraid my sympathies for those unable to afford a nice holiday once a year is limited.

Although I do agree someone working full time should be able to afford a holiday every year. However, we need to help those at the bottom first. Once we don't have a problem of kids going to school on an empty tummy, then we can fix the middle classes.

I'm out.

They won't get any extra cash but the OP is disinterested in hearing about lifestyle changes that mean they may have more disposable income.

I hope nobody has the cheek to complain about our government. I mean, at least we HAVE a government. SOME countries have no acting government. Some people have no bed. Some people are fucking starving.

This isn't deprivation bingo people!

cathf your attitude is grotesque. You think people like being on a low income? That it's a joke, you can have a good laugh as you compete to see how poor you are?
By all means start your campaign for goady middle-income wankers, if it keeps you from spewing bile on this thread.

TheFirstMrs DV, I don't think I said that the OP was worse off than someone on benefits?
I said that the OP's aspirations were the same as people on benefits have, and that is usually considered to be perfectly reasonable on mn.
fgs

Surprising how far you can stretch the £80 child benefit.
We made sure we were where we wanted to be and only costs we factored in we're mat pay and then child care costs to see if it was worth me going back to work.
Never even thought to check working tax or anything as we don't need it.
We get a lot less than you per year and live in a fairly costly part of U.K. (Admittedly it's not London high, but not that far off)

Our combined income is less than £20,000. That's for my husband and I, two adult sons with special needs no longer entitled to DLA, (and hence cannot claim carers allowance now either) and two foster children. We do not get any extra help - and as the children are fostered we do not receive child benefit either. I am astounded that someone on more than double our income would think they would receive some help.

I agree its depressing.
People living on half and less of what the OP is earning are being dismissed as jealous and bitter and top trumping.

Its depressing that young healthy people cannot see how fortunate they are.
They are so busy looking at what they haven't got.

Amber we need all sorts of earners and workers in London. At the moment it's for the well off. I'd like to keep nurses here so yeah, I think we should be subsidising some London living.

OP that is a small income for London, but you will be surprised at how you can make it work.

Good luck

OP my son is at an NHS nursery on site at local hospital. I'm not staff but most of the parents are. The rate £60 per day for staff is slightly below market rates here. Difft city.

In London quite a few years ago most of the nurseries were £70-80 per day. Childminders about £20 cheaper. So you will pay a lot it childcare. Many people i know worked "at a loss" re second income until the free hours kicked in, then of course school eases the costs considerably.

So the first couple of years will be tough but hopefully it gets easier.

Tbh I think it's pretty surprising in this day and age not to realise how reading your post might feel to others. But i think TTC can (understandably) sometimes make you a bit cut off from anything outside your own little world.

On the plus side, when your baby arrives, there are loads of great free groups in London to go to. I took that for granted until i left London. It can be a fantastic place to have a baby/child.

I think you will be surprised by the economies you can make if you have to. I know a few people switched to cycling in London to save on commuting costs.

Why do these threads keeps popping up?
"Is 60k a lot?"
"I want a 4th kid, I'll get tax credits, right?"
"I want a little something over our 46k"

They're all just skipping around the same subject. No one plans to gets pregnant and doesn't check why benefits beforehand. I smell bullshit.

'A joint income of £46K is loaded if you live Up North. Here? Quite the opposite.

I have friends who have quite a few children and earn less, yet get more in tax credits and seem to be living very well indeed. I didn't make any complaints like I wanted to burn down the next leader who doesn't grant me extra cash. I really was just wondering.'

Yeah, sure it is! Everyone knows us teuchters 'up north' pay peanuts for everything, roads are paved in coins. £46k is a King's Ransom in Edinburgh, can really live the millionaire lifestyle on that.

If you have friends like this, why not join them? Jack in your job! And then find out just how cushy it is for your life to be beholden completely to the DWP and the HMRC and the council for your HB/LHA, which they fuck up all the time - and good luck finding that LL, they all love tenants who claim LHA with kids! Their favourite type of tenant.

At any time, your friends can get a letter in a brown envelope that means financial disaster for them. The HMRC has decided they are due 'mandatory reconsideration' and bang to the tax credits! Or that they've been overpaid to the tune of thousands so in addition to no more tax credits, they also have thousands of debt.

Yes, really the life of Riley, there!

Give your head a wobble!

You're getting you 'little something' in the form of CB. Although after the next GE, even that may be in doubt.

As for unfairness . . . welcome to Planet Reality, we have much to teach you.

This government have done a fabulous job of convincing ordinary working people that they are in competition with other ordinary working people for anything approximating a comfortable life

Hello - that is an excellent post.

MrsDV it is depressing, but what isn't depressing atm?

But I do think we need to be careful about the "race to the bottom".

But that also, there is a kind of reality about the 'squeezed middle' - I know I come from what most people would see as affluence. However, in my family (and extended family) we have always practiced a very old-fashioned kind of self-sufficiency. If you can't afford something, you go without, or save up. And I don't mean things like holidays - I mean children, houses - big stuff.

And then you look around and see people making what feel to be "irresponsible" life decisions, or getting lower rent on social housing when your own mortgage is killing you (I worked 3 jobs - 2 almost full-time ones - to afford my 1st house). Or when you make a "responsible" decision to limit family size because you can't afford more & you know that you won't get more than CHild Benefit (if that, nowadays) to help ...

I can see how people start to compare & judge. I think it's almost like a complete culture clash between those who think that they've never received benefits (although we ALL have) and those who seem reliant on them.

Neither side is pretty, really.