Aibu to have stepped in.?

[DiddysMammy]

So.. it's the Easter holidays as many of us know.. I was out with a friend earlier picking up some tickets from my local theatre. Before heading home I headed to the loo with my DD. There was man and a lady in a wheel chair having a pop at a lady with a buggy and 4 young children. She was looking very stressed and upset. The man and the lady in the wheelchair were having a go at the poor lady for using the disabled loo (it does have a baby change).
They were ranting and raving at her about people taking advantage of facilities for disabled people.. she was trying to explain that 2 of the children weren't hers and that she used the disabled loo because it was the only way she could ensure the safety of all 4 children while they all used the toilet.. she hadn't been in there for very long and she was sorry for the delay etc etc..

The theatre was VERY busy and she had just been upstairs to an activity (our local borough holds free events in school holidays) I could see the lady with the children getting redder and redder and the cue for the ladies was out the door so I just popped myself between the to sides and said "look all the while you are stood here having a go at this lady you could have used the loo and got on with your day"

The lady with the children looked relieved while couple looked rather PO.

I smiled a sympathetic smile at the lady with the children and moved into the loo.. my friend then asked me what the fuss was. I explained and she said I shouldn't have stepped in. The lady with the children was in the wrong.. I honestly don't think she was. I have on occasion used the disabled loo when I have my children with me as toilet cubicles aren't built for double buggies and extra people. I would never use one while on my own or with one DC.

Was the lady in the wrong? Was I bu to step in?

Ella Sometimes, disabled people will have to queue. That's unavoidable, I agree.

I see disabled toilets in the same way I see parent and child parking spaces.

People who don't need to use those spaces shouldn't. Occasionally they'll be an unavoidable reason for using them if you're not a parent with a child, but it's not really ok to hog them if you don't need them. The fact that they're closer/more convenient doesn't make it ok to use them.

I was bawled out of it one day also for using a changing table in a disabled toilet. It was the ONLY one in the place. ....what was I supposed to do.....use the floor.....I don't think so, with a new born.
Afaik ..... a disabled toilet is not exclusively for disabled people. ...it means it accessible for people in wheelchairs !

Well of course is not exclusively for disabled person if it has a baby change in it. There couldn't be a clearer sign that it's not exclusive

a simple statement of fact would have done.

And what fact would that have been? Bearing in mind that it is an ACCESSIBLE toilet, and she needed to access it?

That was a very kind thing to do. Good for you.

You didn't step in, you just poked your nose in and made a bitchy comment. Stepping in would have involved helped my either or both parties and defusing the situation

I used to use disabled toilets with my 2dds if I couldn't get to a baby change one in time, at least she knew all the children were safe with her in there, the couple were being arsey and I'm sure they weren't too damaged having to wait a minute for the loo.

Today 18:36 humblesims

sorry but its ridiculous. Disabled toilets are not for the exclusive use of disabled people. They are merely accessible. There is no reason why an able bodied person shouldnt use them.

This! Of course disable people can queue What if several disabled people need the loo at the same time, surely they would queue and if they couldn't wait they could say they can't wait etc. If there is a changing table in there then it is serving that purpose as well.
It was nice of you to cut her some slack OP.
Disabled people can come under 'entitled' also

"Accessible" as a label is misleading though. Anyone could use it meaning that they might have more room (for assistants/ wheelchair/ to transfer/ supports). But many fall short of being genuinely accessible (space to turn an adult sized wheelchair independently for one is often rare).
Anyway 'accessible' doesn't always mean it is. Including the baby change/ having to wait isn't a problem for anyone that I've supported to use a loo. But could be a problem for some (if a baby chage table is left down it could be a faff for eg).
There is a massive misconception by a lot of people (able bodied or not) that accessible toilets are for people with mobility aids only.
So few facilities are actually genuinely spacious enough for that as to make it a farcical notion. No idea who some of these toilets are aimed as there often isn't enough room for a wheelchair and a carer (or indeed a large pushchair, toddler, parent & baby - god forbid you'd be an independent pushchair user with a baby to change as the change tables aren't that low)

It was a very kind of you to step in. I understand the disabled person's frustration but the couple were U to have a rant at her. We don't know that she hadn't used the baby change and it may have been the most accessible facility for pushchairs. I've used some where baby change is available in smaller places, which is fine when you don't have a pushchair to accommodate.

Yes, it's far from ideal and I have done it myself (baby twins and 2 older dc). The older 2 used the toilet while I did baby changing. Of course because I was changing double nappies, I took double the time and many times there was a disabled person waiting when I came out. I was very apologetic about taking a while and thankfully no one was angry to my face about it. As pp's have said, if there is only one disabled toilet then people must have to queue at times.

All a person can do is apologise and tbh I'd want to suggest the complainant took it up with the facility manager. I suspect many disabled toilet do double up simply so they don't have to provide a separate toilet in a baby change space for the single person out with a child. Although I have been known to wait for the end toilet and leave to door open dignity lost in childbirth

The worst ones surely are the ladies toilet which triples up as disabled and baby change (subway I'm looking at you). I have no idea what possesses designers when coming up with that one - "I know, let's make the 3 groups of people most likely to spend longer in a toilet use the same facilities".

Ih ffs do we need yet another fucking thread about disabled toilets.
Why are people obsessed on mn with taking stuff away from disabled people.

I bet if it was a 6 ft gentleman they wouldn't have said boo.They gave out to her cause she was a woman with kids.Bullies and I'm glad op you stuck up for her.

I had 3 small kids and I used accessible toilets cause I couldn't leave them outside.

Oh my lord this thread AGAIN. Okay.

Some disabled people can't wait because their disabilities also cause incontinence / other urge issues - of course sometimes the wait is unavoidable and that's really unfortunate but the likelihood of this happening is reduced by non-disabled people not using the disabled toilet. Disabled toilets are for the use of all disabled people, not just wheelchair users. It's not illegal to use the disabled toilet if you're not disabled (but it's pretty rude). If the only baby-change facility is in the disabled loo then parents have no choice but to use it and it's not their fault but the venue's. You shouldn't confront someone leaving a disabled loo who doesn't 'look' disabled because some disabilities are hidden. This would all be solved if venues provided separate baby-change / family-sized cubicles and sufficient disabled facilities accessible by radar key (and radar keys weren't available to buy online). But that will never happen. In the meantime, all one can do is avoid using the disabled facilities if you don't need to use them for one of the many valid reasons people might need to use them.

There. Did I cover everything from the last thread?

I can understand if they were perhaps desperate to go and were feeling anxious and upset by it but the woman with the four children made a good use of the facilities and doesn't deserve to be humiliated.

If the disabled person had rushed into the toilet, and the non-disabled person had a go, maybe I could have some sympathy. However there was obviously no urgency involved AND there was a baby change in there.

So it sounds as if you did a nice thing, which did, for the lady who was being harangued, defuse the situation.

it's not always the public taking facilities away from the disabled. Some venues are inconsiderate enough to designate them as multi function spaces. Eg ladies/disabled/baby change all in one. Funnily I don't see many men's toilets designated multi function in quite the same way - maybe disabled but certainly not baby change.

Perhaps we need to steer away from separate toilets full stop and have them all unisex cubicles that anyone can use. The space previously designated 'men's toilets' can be given over to multiple baby change units and chairs for bf spaces (there are never enough of either unless you are in kiddicare) and the disabled toilet can remain just that. But I would also like them all to be changing places sized as it's no fun trying to change an adult in even a regular disabled toilet.

What is she supposed to do with the children in the alternative!? Serious question. My bf and I were talking about this today (we are about to have our first baby and one is hard enough to work out the logistics for!)

From my PoV YABU.

You don't really know what the situation was and you didn't help out, you just made a snide comment and disappeared.

Where I live, they are accessible toilets. Wide doors, rails, turning space - for all who need that.

podrig if there is only one of you out with baby, I do recommend researching the places that are the most pushchair friendly before hand. Eg department stores are mostly fine unless they have narrow doorways/two door entrances.

Then take end cubicle, pull pram/pushchair as far is as possible and do business as quickly as possible. You don't have the flash everything while on the loo and the pram tends to block people from seeing anyway.

It doesnt really matter if there are other baby change facilities elsewhere. The specific facility that this lady was using was a baby change facility as well as an accessible toilet so there was no reason at all why she should have to go round the building looking for another baby change facility when she had one right there.

neonrainbow

We don't know if the woman was using the baby changing facilities

I think something to remember is that disabled people get a lot of crap on a lot of levels, all the time. I am one and it makes you far more assertive than you might choose to be.

I'm totally with the people who say that disabled loos should not be for the exclusive use of disabled people. Half the time they'd be empty and there's nothing more ridiculous than a queue of 20 people and the disabled loo not being used.

HOWEVER I think it's common courtesy to let disabled people use them first. Problem is a lot of people don't use common courtesy. Indeed my disability would affect me far less if they did.

In this case, with a baby changing facility in there, it was obviously intended for general use and had been put in there for space reasons.

Well done for stepping in. The wheelchair couple couldn't be that desperate for the loo if they had time to stand arguing

Accessible loos can be used in law by anyone who feels they need them. Anyone who shouts at someone in the manner you describe is an arsehole so well done for helping that poor woman.

Well done.YWNBU. The wheelchair couple were. I've often done this when I have a pram, 1 year old and toddler