To wonder how people will work on planes?

[KenAdams]

The new rules about no laptops in the cabin seem very restrictive for people who are travelling on business.

AIBU to think it's too restrictive? Surely a laptop bomb anywhere on the plane will cause significant damage?

My husband lives and works in Saudi (we love in the UK) and travels backwards and forwards a lot.

He normally uses his laptop continously for the entire flight so fort he poster who said business users won't need to use laptops on those flights is not correct. He normally flies Saudia but will for the moment go via Dubai instead cause flights from there to UK are unaffected at the moment.

Considering what his job actually is the entire thing is quite ironic really...he works in Aviation Insurance!

I would rather run more risk of death and still take my laptop. I won't now fly to those countries as I cannot go on holiday or away on business without my laptop. I don't think people have any idea what business life is like for most of us.

I will not now be going to Turkey etc. I willt ravel where I can take the laptop and no way would I ever trust it to the hold - they steal frmo there, they urinate on cases, they leave them out in the rain until they get sodden and wet.

The authorities are clearly doing this for a very good reason

Yeah, because when they claim its for your safety, that's always true.

Not.

I would rather run more risk of death and still take my laptop

And that would be fine if it was only your life you were risking.

DH travels weekly with business, often to some of the affected countries. He works on the plane usually. I asked him what he would do and he said 'rejig my work, no big deal'.

I'm not fussed about 18 hrs with out tablets for kiddy entertainment (2 hrs at the airport, 2 hrs on the plane, 5 hrs at the airport (tho this may drag), 9 hrs on a plane).
I want to know that the stuff I've put in the hold is going to a)arrive (assuming i and the plane get there) and b) be working when i get there. This is my concern.
And no, I'm not going to leave my laptop/kids tablets here for 2 months when i go to see my parents for the summer.

'I would rather run more risk of death and still take my laptop. I won't now fly to those countries as I cannot go on holiday or away on business without my laptop. I don't think people have any idea what business life is like for most of us.'

It's a good thing you don't make the rules, then.

'I'm not fussed about 18 hrs with out tablets for kiddy entertainment (2 hrs at the airport, 2 hrs on the plane, 5 hrs at the airport (tho this may drag), 9 hrs on a plane). '

I am. Mainly because my son has ASD and doesn't cope well without it. But thankfully we're not travelling to or anywhere near any of those places.

I know, Expat. There are lots of reasons why people would find a tablet useful. I'm not sure if it is on this thread, but a visually impaired poster was describing how airport plus tablet was possible to navigate by herself, impossible without the aid of her iPad.
Unfortunately DHs job is in one of the named countries, and our flights for the summer are already booked, so the route is fixed. If i want to see my parents this year, i need to fly.

ihearttc It's good to know you and your husband love in the UK!

Safety has to come first. I don't understand these changes though. The hold is pressurised, so if a bomb went off in there, unless it was during takeoff or landing, the plane would blow up. They cannot not pressurise the hold.

I do wonder if it's more to do with someone using a laptop / iPad to interfere with the plane's operational systems whilst in the sky, and I wonder if this is actually coming from some of the recent unexplained aviation incidents ( MH370) that have happened rather than the bomb in the laptop in Somalia. There is still confusion about what happened on the MetroJet flight out of Sharm el Sheikh as well.

I feel for all of those of you who have, or do support someone, with disabilities, who use that technology to get through the flight.

So why ban cameras in the cabin then Flappy? And Mard why not address the security action against the actual threat if it's not the airports listed but other destinations? Plenty of people fly directly from say Dubai to the US, or have come from places like Australia. All these people will have to put their larger electronics (not just laptops) in the hold too.

It can't really be about the quality of airport screening as Abu Dhabi has a pre-clearance facility (US run customs and border security). I really think the suspicion that this is largely a protectionist measure to discourage business passengers from using Middle Eastern airlines is not at all unfounded.

Maybe it's also possible to hide a bomb in camera equipment nooka?

Those big DSLR ones that every man and his dog seem to have these days probably have electronics inside them.

I was just picking up on the hacking idea. I think it's much more likely that it's hidden bombs that are the concern, although security experts are saying that there is a real risk in having batteries in the hold and there are some reports of people being made to remove their batteries. I've yet to see any security analyst report positively on the move, although they may well not have access to the information used to inform the change.

No sign yet of Canada joining the ban (or any other European countries). I wonder if some North Eastern States travelers will look to get flights from Montreal or Toronto. The airlines affected have much better reputations that their US competitors. I flew Emirates to Dubai fairly recently and it was a very pleasant flight even in economy, not something I've ever been able to say about American, United or Delta (the airlines who have been lobbying in the States against the affected Middle Eastern airlines).

" Electronics ban does not apply to Emirates’ US-bound flights via Milan and Athens"

Why not?

Also, yes Lithium batteries in the hold actually is against the IATA rules.

It's a bit of a mess. I can avoid Turkey etc for holidays now (and UK to Dubai unlike US to Dubai is not affected) but if it spreads then given I would never put these products into the hold (too risky for all kinds of reasons) it will have a big impact. I work on all holidays and on business trips - the impact for me is not the flight when I usually don't use the laptop but just have it in my bag but during the holiday or business trip. And yes over the decades I have taken myself off to hotel business centres (ugh...) and queued for a PC which often doesn't work and is in a hot or not very nice area with no privacy but that's not ideal.

Flappin because then it's not a direct flight. The US ban is certain direct flights on names airlines from specified airports.

That said, the word on the street is on indirect flights to the UK from the specified countries but via a European hub, people are being asked to check in electronics at the moment.... Hopefully the exact process will become clearer over the weekend.

People coming from the affected countries will add another step to their journey, that's all. They won't fly direct to UK or US.

"it's much more likely that it's hidden bombs that are the concern"

Doesn't sound like it to me.

Electronic devices pass through x-ray scans. Any idiot could see if there are bombs in them.

Besides, what kind of bomb will that be in a thin Kindle?

I don't think there's a threat at all. I reckon the head of the CIA had to sit next to a toddler who was watching Peppa Pig on an iPad with no headphones for 10 hrs on a flight and thought 'How can this never happen again?'

I don't think it's about hidden bombs either.

I could understand if a bit better if mobile phones were banned too as they can all be used as communication, image-sending and detonation devices (if we can us them to control central heating remotely it's easy to see how straightforward this would be).

When I was recently visiting a building which genuinely has ultra-high security, I had to leave my mobile phone with a guard in an out-building for this very reason!

Is anyone else wondering what's going to happen at the gates, when the passengers who feel the rules don't apply to them are told they'll have to give up the electronics they've brought through?

Electronic devices pass through x-ray scans. Any idiot could see if there are bombs in them

It's not actually that easy. Standard components can be removed and explosives made to look like batteries etc. Unless they are actually a trained X-ray scanner operator, 'any idiot' wouldn't have a clue what they are looking for.

With the advent of more powerful explosives and compact electronics, if the authorities have decided that a device could be concealed within a kindle, then it is probably a realistic proposition. Or multiple people with multiple kindle bombs on the same flight.

I think checks will have to be outbound side, surely. Extra warnings at check-in = last chance to put stuff in the hold. Then through hand luggage scan and like liquids, if you've got any non-confirming items they go in the bin. It won't be pretty.

Yes, there are a million holes in the plan. But it's coming into force before midnight tomorrow according the note from the foreign office I received...so we'll find out soon enough!

Puzzled, presumably they will have to chuck the £1000 lap top away in the rubbish basket with the water bottles if they want to take the flight.

On the bomb issue a Radio 4 expert was quite good - she said small items it is much harder to pack enough explosives in. She also described a printer (large item) where the bomber had taken the ink out of the cartridge and then filled that with the explosive. Smart phones are usually too small to do all this with and bombs in the luggage hold cause less damage than in the cabin apparently and apparently the luggage hold is checked more thoroughly ( although one reason certain air ports are picked out is because they have very corrupt baggage handlers)

presumably they will have to chuck the £1000 lap top away in the rubbish basket with the water bottles if they want to take the flight

Yes, that's what I'm afraid of - not because I'd ignore the "check it in to the hold" warnings, but because of the god awful fuss it will cause

Unless they are actually a trained X-ray scanner operator, 'any idiot' wouldn't have a clue what they are looking for

I also agree with this, though it's complicated by the technology shifting as fast as security measures are brought in. That said, you'd hope that all X ray operators are fully trained - except that in some countries it just isn't so. Which presumably is a large part of why this is happening ...