AIBU? Neighthours and dropped kerb

[Mummysboy2014]

Right so we own a bourse with a dropped kerb directly outside our house. Next door do not have a dropped kerb they have a big tree at the end of their driveway assuming they can't get permission for a dropped kerb. Anyway so we have 2 cars next door has one. They use our dropped kerb to access their driveway as they wouldn't be able to access it otherwise. Last night my partners car was parked on our drive, I parked on our dropped kerb and was taking the shopping in. Next door pulled up behind me beeping their horn. I continued to get the things out the car took them to my front door, he beeped the horn again and I shouted wait. I then got the baby aged 5 months out the car and came To the front door to which my partner had now opened the door to see what was going on. I walked back to my car and got my toddler as he didn't want to get out the car. Next door beeped the horn again. Aibu in thinking his an arse and you know what he should be grateful as, Correct me if I'm wrong I'm allowed to park on my dropped kerb. And if it weren't for us he wouldn't be to access his drive without using our dropped kerb.

YABU. If you don't want people beeping at you to move, don't park over dropped kerbs or block access to someone's property.

I think your neighbour was very cheeky beeping you continually when he arrived as you were unloading your car, with very young children to attend to.

From what I have read, contact your council and inform them of your car details so you can park on your lowered kerb, if you find your neighbour does not have right of access.

Find out the legal standing, then if they do not have access rights, inform the neighbour that they do not have access rights, and that you will erect a fence, giving them time to arrange access via their land.

From what the former owner of your property said, they choose not to put in a drive due to cost, but prefer to sneak in diagonally on your one.

I coudn't put up with that, especially as they are behaving in a very entitled way.

I really hope no-one is allowed to remove that tree. I suspect it's the only pleasant thing in the vicinity.

Looking at your neighbours drive it looks narrow for a car and maybe that's why he removed his wall, as well as the wall making it difficult for him to access the drive

am I going mad? Surely the presence of the large and established tree in front of the neighbour's access means there is zero chance of him 'getting his own dropped kerb', thanks to hopefully tree preservation rules.

I found this if it helps?

The construction of a vehicle crossing by TMBC remains part of the public highway and does not give the resident/occupier any legal right of ownership to the land or license to police that crossing in any way

However, your new crossing does provide full acceptable rights to drive across the footway/highway land to gain access to your (your landlords) property or use of land developed and deemed suitable for off road parking

Gardenlaw seems to have lots of discussions on it too. It looks as if the neighbour needs permission to drive across to access his drive from the highways department.

I think he was really rude anyway, whatever the legal point is. I can't bear the arrogant use of horn like that.

Dropped kerb belongs to no one in particular. Get that.

But how far along a pavement are you allowed to drive in the name of using a 'dropped kerb which belongs to no one in particular' to get to your house?

I mean - IF he's not crossing any of OPs land (and i think he is) then he's driving up the pavement from a dropped kerb which is outside another house to get to his own. To what extent is this legal? Only if it's round a tree? One house down? Two? It doesn't seem right.

If you buy a house with a tree outside it surely that's your own problem.

X posted with sparkly. Wh i think has answered my question.

So he needs permission to drive 'along' the pavement rather than across it. In layman's terms. Yes?

From what I have read on law sites and council ones, it seems to be that you cannot access your property across the highway without permission.
So the house with dropped kerb has permission, I would assume that the neighbour doesn't as there would have been some consultation or notification.

The highways department can clarify all that.

I don't think he needs permission as such. The law (or rather the Highway Code interpretation of the law) is "You MUST NOT drive on or over a pavement, footpath or bridleway except to gain lawful access to property, or in the case of an emergency." Question here is whether it is lawful access or not. To charge him with an offence they would have to prove it is unlawful access, and I think that would be rather difficult.

The highways agency (on my local website anyway) says that you must not drive accross the pavement to access your property without explicit permission.

But the permission is shown by the presence of a dropped kerb. You don't get a certificate with your house to say you're allowed to drive across the pavement...

No, the permission is given to the house with the dropped kerb.
It does say on my council website that you are issued with written permission.

Otherwise, the flow of traffic and access is affected. Where would it end- the third house down using it too?

Any such land which you do not own may be the property of another person or of a business or of a public body such as the Borough Council or the Local Highways Authority. If you do not possess a legal right of way to cross over land which you do not own then, whenever you do this, you will make yourself liable to prosecution for trespass and/or causing damage. Such liability to prosecution applies to any land which you do not own, no matter how small or how narrow the strip or piece of land may be

Sparkly, the written permission is talking about doing the actual work itself. It is not clear whether a formal easement is granted as part of that, and I've never seen any sort of permission like that in any of the houses I've been in. In any case, as others have said, it is also likely that the right to cross the land has been acquired through use.

No, it's not...

For parking enforcement purposes there are two types of dropped kerb:

dropped kerb that serves a single occupancy driveway
dropped kerb that serves multiple occupancy driveway or more than one driveway
Dropped kerb that serves a single occupancy driveway

Enforcement action can only be instigated at the request of the occupier of the premises.

A single occupancy driveway is a driveway used solely by one property and served by a dedicated dropped kerb, which is not used or shared by other properties.

Any resident, not previously registered, who finds their dropped kerb blocked by an inconsiderate motorist should:

Register now

If you don't have a dropped kerb, but would like one, here is how to apply

Once registered please phone the council's parking enforcement hotline on 01895 271 418, between the following hours:

6am to 10pm (Monday to Saturday)
8am to 10pm (Sundays and bank holidays)
They will then arrange for a Civil Enforcement Officer to visit the location and carry out appropriate enforcement.

Dropped kerb that serves multiple occupancy driveway or more than one driveway

A multiple occupancy driveway is a driveway used by more than one property (a) or served by a dropped kerb that is used or shared by more than one property (b) See below eg shared driveway, access to a block of flats or an office block.

As more than one person may use this type of dropped kerb you cannot park across it even with the permission of the occupier.

We carry out regular borough wide enforcement against vehicles causing obstruction to this type of dropped kerb. This type of dropped kerb does not have to be registered for enforcement purposes.

You can't just randomly make a single access point in to a multiple one. Permission is based on pedestrian safety, traffic implications and visibility.

He might technically be allowed to use this, OP needs to contact the council/planning/find as much in her heeds as possible to establish this. But fact IS- kerb is infront of/linked to her house, he cuts across it and I am sure, part of her own driveway/front garden to get to his. OP is first priority. He acted in vile fashion with car running sit and beep someone, clearly unpacking shopping/taking a toddler and baby out of car into house. Its clear she was on the move and close to going into house and finishing up, beeping does nothing but stress the person you are doing it at out and cause them to make mistakes under pressure and take longer (or do so on purpose, as I'd have done). I'd hoot at say unknown car taking ages in a car park blocking the way, but never to anyone I knew/a neighbour- and never anyone unloading young kids in/out of car -so intimidating and dangerous a sudden shock could be in say toddler running onto road. Its rude, aggressive and immature.

Just to point out that whilst it is usual for a home owner NOT to own the dropped kerb it isn't impossible - I own mine, as do our neighbours.

But it is all kind of moot as I still can't see whether OP has actually bothered to check her title information document which would - in all likelihood - stop her speculating and actually be able to deal with the situation.

Or of course she could go around and sort it out like adults. #justsaying

Find out the legal standing, then if they do not have access rights, inform the neighbour that they do not have access rights, and that you will erect a fence, giving them time to arrange access via their land.

I might be missing the point here but why on earth would you even need to park over the dropped kerb? From the pics it looks completely lazy to not just pull up onto your drive and THEN unload. You're going there to park after anyway right? And it's less walk with the shopping? Makes no sense to me at all. You wouldn't get in the car, reverse down the drive and sit across the dropped kerb to go and get the kids to get in, would you?

Your neighbour was annoying for the horn honking but you were being weird about your parking/unloading.

Sparkly, you don't know that the dropped kerb is only for the use of the OP's house. And even if originally it was, the right can be acquired through use.

Plus, all that is talking about is enforcement of people parking in front of a dropped kerb. It doesn't mention who can use it.

Who cares who owns the dropped curb? What sort of person would intentionally block their neighbour from accessing their own driveway?

And then moan when they hoot at them because they are taking all the time in the world to unload their shopping and then the children.

I still dont get why she was unloading a baby and a toddler when she knew the car had to be moved, unless she was planning on leaving it parked there. As husband was supposedly asleep but got woken up by the hooting as she was unloading the children

And then all she did was pull further onto the drive once eveything unloaded.

Plus she says the neighbour hooted her 3 times. Thats not excessive in 5 minutes - IF it was only 5 minutes. I have my doubts.

Bluntness100 The fence would only be on her drive, not on the pavement.

Freyanna, what's the point of that though? He's not using her drive, he's using the dropped kerb and the pavement to access his own drive.