Am I just a horrid atrocious bitch or something ?

[Birdsbeesandtrees]

Or do people really put up with some crap ?

I read so many thread on here about things and I think "Christ I wouldn't put up with that"

Not any specific thread - usually ones about outrageous behaviour from others to the OP and often there are similar stories from posters who reply and I just sit there going that

a. People behave like that and
b. Other people let them/ say nothing but fume about it.

Especially the MIL ones. I don't mean I'd be awful but I just wouldn't tolerate being spoken to like that or the kinds of behaviour mentioned.

I have a mum that is quite passive aggressive in the same vein about many things. I just call her on it.

You know things like " well this is my house mum and I do things this way because I want to." When she interferes.
Or

"That's nice but we have decided to do x"

She did have a go at trying to tell me what furniture I should buy for my house and I just asked her who was paying and who's house it was for and she soon shut up.

Am I unusually assertive ? or a bitch

I started off very assertive then went back in to my shell because I was told by a lot of people that I shouldn't be so assertive. Then I came back out of that and am very assertive now. The only difference is that I have learned to be more diplomatic when exercising my assertiveness. You don't have to be rude to people when you're doing right by you, if you see what I mean.

Whilst some people do seem to put up with a lot of shit, I also think that many posts are written to garner a certain response and therefore play up some of the negatives.

I also think that many respondents forget that they are only hearing one side of the story.

My MIL has to take a dig at me every time or will debate anything I say. Oh believe me, if I could, I'd give that cow a right mouthful. Unfortunately, DH has a fake, cold family and has told me that I need to ignore it and just play along. Due to her behaviour and my dislike of MIL, DH waits until she contacts us and we try and drag out visits to once every three months. Also my DH wants to move and we will be far far away :D

You're not a bitch and clearly don't really think you are one, but you may not fully understand the psychological effect abusers often have on their victims, or how a frog can be boiled without realising...

Sometimes people do subtle crap that it takes a while to figure out how bad it was. By the time you join the dots the moment is gone & you don't want to be petty to bring it up again.

I have become more assertive with age. What I find it irritating is when my own mother comments "oh we won't get on the wrong side of you.". I'm actually pretty laid back but just stand my ground if a situation requires it. I'm not even argumentative so I don't even know what she's getting at.

You're not a bitch, but if you're so assertive why do you need affirmation for the way you are? We're all different. Some people have real problems asserting themselves for a variety of reasons. You sound like you unapologetically believe 'It's my way or the highway.' That's fine for you - it might not suit everyone.

I'm tough outside the home but realised about a month ago how subservient I am...
Hubby will say... no one has let the dogs out and I will go from what I'm doing and let them out while he types on his laptop.
Dd will say I'm thirsty and that means I'm to get her a drink.
Hubby will say I can't find my pants and that means I have to bring him some.
He'll say someone has left the lights on upstairs as he's coming down and that means I have to go turn them off.
If the bin is full they leave the bin for me to empty and the rubbish for me to put in it, and all the recycling to sort gets left where it's used. Toilet rolls left empty. Etc etc.
The other day he emptied some boiled potatoes from the fridge and left them on the top..for me to clean.. they're still there mouldy as fk. Somehow it's my job because I put them in the fridge...
And I've been doing it... for years... and no one even needs to say thanks because no one actually asked me to do anything.
Its not like I have nothing better to do. I work for the hubby. I have a very difficult baby and a 6 year old who's home ed and I also do the ground works, building, car repairs etc.
But if I so much as need a wee I have to ask him to babysit yet he acts like I've asked him to skin a live kitten.
Outside the home, I don't take crap from anyone at all and am pretty short tempered if people try to pressurise me

However, I'm old, wise and experienced. Some posters are young, isolated and have little or no education (either formal or practical)

how odd

You only see one version of events one here. Of course they are going to be written in a melodramatic way to make the OP look hard done by. She (or he) won't garner sympathy otherwise

I think situations can be far more nuanced than they initially appear on here.

northernshepherdess I am exactly the same at home, but my reasoning behind it is because I gave up work when I had my children and this is my 'job', albeit a bloody long one with no sick time or holiday time or any bloody time. I annoy myself with that one though, but lately I take time to watch tv during the day and have 'me' time which for years I didn't. If I was working there is no way I would do what I do for everyone

Yes I think it's an English/British thing - maybe a more Southern English thing as Northerners are more likely to call a spade a spade? I am southern-bred but northern-born and am pretty forthright!

I also think it's expected of us - years ago I worked with some Antipodean ladies - all of whom could be quite stroppy at times. But woe betide me if I was! I think they just couldn't' accept that somebody who was supposed to be "British polite", wasn't always.

I also think people are right about having been conditioned to be subservient females. If you are assertive as a women, you are considered to be aggressive or shrill or some other undesirable attribute. But a bloke is just being assertive.

It's very interesting. This sort of thing has been a life journey for me. I was brought up to believe that I could do anything (via my dad), yet taught how to toe the line by my narcissist mother. As a result, I was, roughly until I got pregnant and found Mumsnet (coincidence? I don't think so ), a terrible people pleaser.

My longest relationship was with an abusive arsehole, alas the father of my dc. Yet, everyone who knew us at the time would've said that I was in charge, I wore the trousers (hate that phrase).

And I HAVE been pretty strong all my life. I can spot an abuser in someone else's life in a heartbeat, but, as is so often the case, it can be hard to turn that analysis on oneself.

Since having dc, well, that was the point at which I became unfuckwithable, and it has just got better (or worse, depending on your view!). No one gets a thing past me now. I suspect that for me, this means I will be single for the rest of my life, which makes me rather thankful. I like the peace, and I like going my own way.

So, I agree with a lot of what is said re conditioning, how you're brought up etc. I am more me these days than I was for 25 years before.

women are supposed to be "pleasers", nice girls don't make a fuss etc

When I was about 12 my uncle groped me at a family party and I yelled at him and pushed him away.

My mother smacked me hard across the face and hissed; 'I don't care what anyone does to you. You never be rude'.

That is the kind of conditioning I grew up with. It can be hard to overcome that sort of thing. Even now, when I am 43 I am having a very hard time trying to work myself up to standing my ground when it comes to my family an their expectations. That spills over to other parts of my life too. I have a fairly successful career / family / social life on paper, but my self esteem is a fucking mess.

God HRH that's awful. I can ofcourse fully understand some people are they way they are because of life experiences like yours. No one should have to put up with abuse.

I also hardly think not letting someone walk all over you is "my way or the highway" as was suggested. I am talking about the extremes of outrageous behaviour here. I've already said I quite understand why some people may struggle to be assertive as like HRH they have been forced to become so really.

I'm talking about people who don't really fall into this catergory but seem to be passive bystanders when someone is taking advantage or being really quite nasty to them.

It's fine to not be particularly assertive obviously but I imagine if you are completely unable to stand up for yourself or someone else it will lead to some real problems in life.

I really do think there is a huge amount of cultural conditioning and sadly conditioning of women in particular to put up with all kinds. But some people seem to escape it. That's what I'm trying to get at.

I also wonder why as people have said this seems to fade as we get older.

YANBU

Assertiveness comes more with age. I look back at my younger self and can't believe the crap I put up with from people. I'm older now and don't put up with rubbish from anyone. Maybe that's because life experiences toughen us up and harden us - certainly the case with me. I used to always want to see the best in people, and never thought people could be as awful as they appeared to be. Now I know different, but maybe I've gone too far the other way now, in that I often misread people's intentions negatively.

I also think assertiveness comes with age.Eventually you are just not willing to put up with shit anymore. I think that when you have alot of experience being walked on you do toughen up. I am definitely getting better at it. And, actually, I have to say that being on MN has helped me alot. I find it interesting to see the experiences of other people, when they have problems to consider what course of action etc. I find looking at things from other perspectives (that people offer freely on MN!) have really made me a bit more rounded.

to some extent I think you're right - I also read posts on MN and am aghast at what people put up with.

However I think other factors can come into it -.e.g one poster mentioned above being warned she'd end up alone if she nagged her husband. If you are financially solvent, have other strong relationships and are comfortable being alone, the threat of breaking up your marriage is less than if you are not, and it is easy to udnerstand why people might be afraid to challenge unpleasant behavior, if the consequences of doing so could negatively affect them. Same with issues at work - not everyone is on a fair contract and as much as they might want to stick up for themselves doing so could really impact them in a way they can't afford.

There are also just personality differences. Some people really are just very laid back, able to look over things, or just hate arguments. So for them it might be easier to just think 'yes my MIL (or whoever) makes all these snide comments, but I care so little for her opinion I can just let it wash over me. Getting worked up about it will only upset me and the rest of the family, and give her what she wants.'

For most people there will be a tipping point at which behaviour becomes so bad they are forced into asserting themselves - but this point can vary hugely between people, and those with a higher tipping point are not automatically walkovers or timid.

I agree with the age point. At some point in my early thirties I realised that not everyone I met in life would like me and that was just fine. That realisation has been particularly useful as I have become more senior at work. Sometimes to get things done I have to do things that others won't like, and it's ok, sometimes for the good of the business, sometimes for the benefit of the person in question even if they don't like me for it.

Agree that there is a correlation with age - but I think its to do with learning how to be assertive without being rude, because no one ever teaches you that. I gave up ever challenging anything at school because any questioning of authority no matter how reasonably framed was just branded as rudeness and it really wasnt. I still struggle with it now, it helps that MN has raised my self esteem and that i live in a more egalitarian country where you can raise issues and discuss them.

I used to be the 'don't rock the boat' kind of person usually to save hurting others feelings but couple of years ago I was diagnosed with cancer, been treated etc...but I have a whole new perspective and now do not tolerate any shitty, out of order attitudes, however I don't go round seeking confrontation. I just now think 'whats the worst that can happen?', cos for me i've already experienced one of the worst things that could happen to me.
We de-clutter our homes from the shit we dont need, not adding anything to our lives so why not do it with people!!