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AIBU?

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Original poster

To think it's selfish to deliberately plan to rent out the old house when you buy a new

343 replies

jdoe8 · 27/02/2017 08:08

I understand why people do it, its dog eat dog out there and people look after number 1 even if it means it screws others.

But how are the next generation going to ever afford to buy if people carry on doing this?

This makes for depressing reading especially the comments - www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/feb/26/the-sad-cost-of-renting-never-having-somewhere-to-call-home

I don't believe any generation worked any harder, you just had to be lucky and in the right place at the right time. Its very well to say just rent but renters have such poor rights in the UK it's very undesirable.

OP posts:
ShesAStar · 28/02/2017 23:19

It's just business. We all need money, the more you have the easier life becomes, it oils the cogs as they say. After health and love, money is the most important thing for a happy life. If you have the chance to make some extra cash to put towards your old age or DC future why wouldn't you? If you think you've won some battle of morale by selling a house rather than keeping it for a BTL your DC might disagree - they might think you could have bettered their lives with the proceeds.

caringcarer · 28/02/2017 23:21

I would offer a longer tenancy as I do realise renters may find a 6 month or 1 year lease stressful especially if children involved but I can't because terms of mortgage dictate up to 1 year only but I do renew without any charges and deal with tenants myself so no agencies involved.

Catwaving · 01/03/2017 06:19

OP

Really ignorant statement IMO

Lots of people don't want to buy, landlords are doing them a favour. Totally normal across Europe

Applebite · 01/03/2017 06:54

I remember reading a statement by a build to rent company, fizzy living I think it was, which said that they offered 3 year contracts with a tenant break - and not one tenant took them up on it, all going for a fixed term 12 month AST instead. It didn't say whether there were more onerous terms for the 3 year term, but they were pretty clear that not everyone wants long term contracts. Some might but lots don't.

PegaGryf · 01/03/2017 07:28

They also worked hard to get there, just wish I went ahead and started to this myself 25 years ago.

No, they lucked out. We all work hard.
25 years ago I was barely born so that attitude isn't useful to my generation, yet it's something I hear a lot. My fil bought his council flat for 10k, rented that out to buy another btl, and just kept doing it. He's not a genius, he's lucky.

Roomster101 · 01/03/2017 08:52

I think a big problem is that everything in this country is so London centric. Even this thread assumes that everyone lives in London and the South East. In the rest of the country, houses are still affordable.

Applebite · 01/03/2017 08:56

This

It is v hard but true that when people say "I can't afford a house," what they really mean is, "I can't afford a house where I want to live."

merrymouse · 01/03/2017 09:01

'Affordable' depends on local wages and job opportunities.

Blueflowers2011 · 01/03/2017 09:25

Er no, they didn't luck out, they worked hard to get there, the people I know with 2+ properties anyway, working really long hours, overtime where they could, 6 days a week jobs, various self employed and regular jobs, putting every penny they could away and managing to secure their first deposit 25+ yrs ago. Their priority was to secure a second property as their pension and for their kids.

I was 'in the right place at the right time', have a run of the mill job which didnt allow me to afford to do this so maybe I am not so lucky although I dont feel like this.

It is my aim to get that second property (or more!) at some point, I am not going to reply on a crappy state pension and whatever else I have managed to accumalate through my work pensions.

ShesAStar - totally agree with every word you say

If I can better life for my family by renting out my current property and buying another then of course I am going to do that, even if it means not buying in my dream area or dream house. Just climbing that ladder slowly. It's not selfish! Confused by this thinking. And yes, purely for having a better and easier life, what other reason would there be? Well done to them.

Yep, maybe it is bad luck you were not born but that's not their fault.

This sounds more like jealousy to me.

Applebite · 01/03/2017 09:51

merrymouse - hmmm, sometimes it does, sometimes it means keeping your job and sucking up a commute. not for everyone, but as one example, my friend couldn't afford to buy in London where he worked, so he bought in Folkestone, where he got a 3 bed house with a garden for under £200k, and commutes in on HS1 every day.

(The incredible thing is, he gets to Kings Cross more quickly from Folkestone than I do from my flat in zone 1...... stupid tube...........)

EmeraldIsle86 · 01/03/2017 10:45

We're planning on this. We have 15ish years left on our mortgage and plan to move next year.

We'll be buying a new house and letting our current until the mortgage is paid. At some point after that we'll sell it and the value will be put towards the dc buying houses.

merrymouse · 01/03/2017 10:45

applebite, I live further from central London than Folkestone and DH commutes every day. It is very expensive and would not be possible without a well paid job.

It takes about an hour to get from Folkestone to a main line station plus travel at either end. It really shouldn't take that long to get to Kings Cross from somewhere in zone 1 but if it's a regular problem, it would be quicker to walk.

However, If you live in Folkestone and the trains don't work you are stuck, which is a bit of a problem if you need to collect children.

Long commutes work for some people, but they really aren't an option for everyone.

Thingamajiggy · 01/03/2017 10:51

I agree. The government should clamp down on on buy to let and second homes. But you cannot blame people individually for doing it. People will do what they can to get ahead, it's the system that needs to be fixed. It's hard to act ethically in this respect when you feel that the rest of the country has free reign to exploit the system

sparechange · 01/03/2017 10:53

The government should clamp down on on buy to let and second homes

They have. They've reduced interest deductibility and increased stamp duty.

But they don't need or want to choke it off totally because it is a very necessary and beneficial part of our economy

Roomster101 · 01/03/2017 10:53

It only take an hour to get to London on the train where I live in the Midlands where houses are very affordable although if you wanted to commute every day the train fare would probably be about £6,000. Still, it does illustrate that the issue is not that the next generation won't be able to own their own their house but that they won't necessarily be able to live where they want to.

makeourfuture · 01/03/2017 11:17

But you cannot blame people individually for doing it. People will do what they can to get ahead, it's the system that needs to be fixed. It's hard to act ethically in this respect when you feel that the rest of the country has free reign to exploit the system

This is an interesting thought. I am not sure about "the rest of the country having free reign to exploit the system". We all do many things against our direct self interest. We withhold from committing violence/breaking the law. We pay our taxes. We recycle. Who are the "rest of the country" exploiting the system?

Ethical behaviour is rarely the easy choice. Again self interest is understandable, but the type of behaviour we are speaking of is hurting society at large. It is detrimental.

malificent7 · 01/03/2017 11:19

I hate this notiin that we should all uproot our lives to anywhere in the country we can afford. Creates ghettos imo.
I went to uni in Liverpool where there is cheap housing. Am i going to leave my family, dp and uproot dd to buy there? No chance.

merrymouse · 01/03/2017 11:42

An hour between stations is not the same as journey time unless you live and work in a station.

MumsGoneToYonderLand · 01/03/2017 11:46

if i could afford 10 properties, and rent them out in great order and be a good landlord, I would. So? doesn't make me a bad person.
BuyToLet did increase, for clear reasons, it was a good bet in the early millennium, now the tax benefits and gains are not so attractive and it will reduce slightly. But the biggest factor in my opinion is the crash in social housing stock - building new homes and right to buy. RTB should be abolished now to limited to longer periods of tenancy. In the 1980s it was to help people who had rented for decades, now its possibly available after a relatively short tenancy.
when people are offered social housing (based on having kids, disability or whatever criteria this is totally reasonable and needed in our society but it should be for a set period e.g. 10 years then reassessed at that time, so people either pay market rent if circumstances have changed (4 bed home, kids moved out) or move out so someone else can benefit from that property.
we need to find ways to have more social housing available - that in itself will reduce private lettings.
we have one btl (our first home) and in 9 years since we moved out we have only put the rent up once. same tennant (single bloke, no plans to buy). It is my pension - not that I will get much from it.

I work pt for myself and have no pension at age 45. if husband and I weren't married we would be allowed one property each - because we are married we are effectively allowed half each before we have to pay CGT.
when we sell, with 40pc capital gains and a hefty mortgage (which the rent just covers) we actually won't make very much, after 15 years of ownership.

sure lots will disagree with me. fine to do so.

Roomster101 · 01/03/2017 12:42

I hate this notiin that we should all uproot our lives to anywhere in the country we can afford. Creates ghettos imo.
I went to uni in Liverpool where there is cheap housing. Am i going to leave my family, dp and uproot dd to buy there? No chance.

I'm not saying that you should but you do have the choice, as I did many years ago when I moved from family for job, house etc. Therefore it is not the case that it will be impossible for the next generation to afford a house. They just won't necessarily be able to choose where they live.

Floggingmolly · 01/03/2017 13:24

What's the alternative to buying what you can afford?? If there is one; do share, malificent Confused
And no, someone else funding it for you is not a feasible option.

PegaGryf · 01/03/2017 18:09

Er no, they didn't luck out, they worked hard to get there,

No, they didn't. I literally just gave an example of luck. Having family that can help with a deposit counts as luck.

And I'm sick of hearing how ll's ate doing us some sort of gracious service by allowing us to pay their mortgages off 😂

Landlords: we are doing you a favour, you don't even want to buy!
Renters: yes, we do want to buy
Landlords: work harder and perhaps one day you'll be as successful as me.

Hiding this thread. I don't know why I even commented tbh.

MrsKoala · 01/03/2017 18:26

Our first house we bought just before the recession and it went into negative equity, so when we moved for dh's work we rented it out. We let it at under the going rate and the rent just paid the mortgage. We allowed the tenants to have pets and decorate and when they wanted to buy we offered it to them at 5k under the valuation with all furniture and white goods included.

The second house we bought we lived in for 10 months before mil died and we needed to care for fil. So with pils money and ours we bought a bigger house for us all. But paying off the mortgage on the house would have meant a large forfeit to the lender. So we are renting that out till that 5 year period is up. Again we have let it just to cover mortgage, allowed pets etc. The couple could afford to buy but the dh travels round for work.

But I suppose we are just actually selfish cunts Hmm

MrsKoala · 01/03/2017 18:42

I never understood the paying someone else's mortgage idea. Maybe it's because dh was in the military and we travelled a bit so we're often a renter and ll at the same time. I always saw my rent as paying for somewhere to live and the service of someone else maintaining it.

FloweringDeranger · 01/03/2017 19:19

Not finished reading tft yet, but isn't just absolutely sickening how many people quote "life isn't fair" as if it's some sort of excuse for the most selfish behaviour?

Is that it? Is that all Britain has to offer now, even to it's own children? Life isn't fair, so no, you can't have this while I have 4? Life isn't fair, so I'll just take that off you? Life isn't fair, so I'll kick you in the face too and tell you how lazy you are for not having the power to fight back?

Would it still be the same story if all the youngsters say life isn't fair, so I'll just take all your pensions off you? And those 4 extra houses you're not living in? No, that's somehow morally wrong because oh they've worked, yet youngsters now have to work so much more for so much less.

We need some basic levels of fairness in society, without them law is a joke and we'll be back to hanging poor people for stealing loaves of bread. Without some social contracts and trust we won't have peace.

The path we're heading down is not good, it will lead to disaster, and it is sickening how many people think equality and fairness are not even worth trying to aim for.