To be furious at ds school?

[weneednopants]

This is going to be a long post. Sorry
So backstory is ds (6) has sn. With various extra conditions. One of which is bowel issues. He either can't go or is very much the other way (sorry tmi). Anyway just before Christmas he was going through a lets say loose episode. Not contagious just his normal movements. Now he struggles with coordination and finds cleaning himself after toileting very difficult. Added to this he has asd and will have a complete meltdown if he gets poo on his hands. So in light of this I rang school to advise that he may need assistance when he uses the toilet just while he was going through this episode. His allocated 1:1 ta phones back to say in no uncertain terms she wasn't willing to help him and because he was likely to have a meltdown she didn't want him to come in until his bowel movements had firmed up.
So to the aibu part.
Today I received from the school an attendance warning letter. Telling me we are on a monitored 6 week period. If attendance doesn't improve we will be put before the attendance panel and face possible prosecution. His attendance dropped because the school wouldn't allow him to attend and now I'm put on warning!! I wanted him to go to school during that period not be at home perfectly well and bored but because his ta wouldn't wipe his arse when it needed it he had to stay home. Am I wrong in thinking this is totally unfair and in fact the school should be taking responsibility for his absence. Sorry for the long post

Children have a right to a full time school place though. Even if the child has bowel issues and 2 members of staff are required to deal with it. If they can't spare 2 members of staff as often as required - then they need to employ an extra member of staff for as long as needed. They can't just refuse the child access to school.
It is fairly common for schools try to save money by putting kids on part time hours or excluding them if their medical needs are expensive. But is isn't legal. They count on parents not knowing that.

Once again thank you all for the advice my ds does now have an ehcp which includes intimate care and 2 wonderful TA's employed specifically for him who are both aware of his bowel issues and are both happy to help out on the occasions it's needed.

Bumsexatthebingo ds is on reduced hours at school. They are much improved now he has an ehcp. During the time of the "issue" his hours were ridiculous 9-11.30 3days a week and 9-2 2 days per week. At least now he is 9-2 for the full school week

What is the reason for him being unable to attend for the whole school day? Or is that the schools regular hours?

Astoria and others who feel the same way. You are wrong - no dressing it up nicely - you are just wrong.

No child should be prevented access to a mainstream education due to toileting issues, whatever the reason for those issues. All children have the right to be treated with dignity and kindness when dealing with those issues. A TA who works as a 1-1 has every right to state that they don't wish to be involved in intimate care, but that should be declared before working with children who may have a variety of needs - otherwise it is not the job for you.

I work with children as a 1-1 in a preschool and deal with any intimate care with respect and dignity - their toileting issues should not impact on their learning or school life.

My son is disabled, he has a right to mainstream education, he has physical and medical needs that mean he is still in nappies. He does not need 2 people to change him, he does not need me to leave my place of work to clean him, he does not needs TAs who act in such a way that implies disgust at his needs, what he needs are people who care, and treat a child with kindness and dignity.

Some of the posts on this thread disgust me.

Agreed hazeyjane. I don't know why anyone would come on here and post 'it doesn't happen' about ta's taking care of toileting needs in mainstream schools when it just isn't true. The op herself has said that the 2 ta's who are now working with her son help with toileting!

Astoria, no child can be asked to leave mainstream school because of continence issues and all mainstream schools have to provide support if children require it.

Am glad you've got it sorted op.Without an ehcp it's a legally grey area. For example, legally, my type 1 diabetic child has a right to attend school without a parent coming in every day to administer insulin but unless school employ 2 full time nurses (there has to be two to cover sickness and other commitments) it falls to TAs to offer to do it.

We are lucky now in that ds school employ two women in the school office who are willing to share this daily task, despite it not being part of their contracts. Prior to this, I usually had to go in every day for the first 4+ weeks of the school year until the TAs were trained and ready to take over. I nearly had to give up work.

Definitely challenge the attendance letter - get it all in writing. They should apologise to you for the stress and inconvenience.

Bum his hours have been reduced during reception and first term of year 1 as no ehcp and he needs constant 1:1. In reception his hours were 9-12 as the general class ta or teacher would be his 1:1 if you like. He has huge sensory issues so things like lunchtime in the hall etc or assembly is a no go for him. Then in year 1 the school obtained temporary emergency funding for a dedicated 1:1 but only 25 hours per week. Now with ehcp he still only has 25 hours per week funding so just not enough hours for a full school day. Also transitions are a big problem so staggering his start time until after the morning rush means he is calm and not overloaded before he starts the day. But it would be lovely just to get that extra hour a day so he nearly fulfills the whole school day.

If the assessment said he needs full time 1-1 then that's what should be in the echp? I would get advise about that because he should be able to access school full time. If you feel it is in your sons best interest to start a little later and the school s happy with that then that is fine but the provision should be available the same as for the other children.

Poor boy. It sounds like it may be the wrong school for him though - would a more specialist setting not be better and then he'd get the care he needs, especially as he gets older?

When I stared working as an lsa, it was part of the contract that duties may include attending to personal care, ie: wiping bums. Even though I've shared to TA, there's still a catch all section in our contract : '... and any other duties or responsibilities the head teacher considers appropriate '. Also, whilst the ht might be happy to allow the ta to refuse to carry out part of her duties, that doesn't mean your child should have been told not to attend. That would be discrimination under the DDA. Some ta's aty school have refused to work with certain children, by it just means that other arrangements were made so the children could still attend school.

Hahaha Astoria and others, good luck getting a child with continence issues into a SN school. They need an EHCP, the school to be unable to provide adequate support (employing a TA, SEN TA or LSA for 1:1 constitutes adequate support), they would need to prove they can't cope with the child to the LA/County, who would need to agree and then there would need to be a place available at a suitable school. Often the school has to also prove the child is at least 2 years behind academically and won't improve without support (this fact is often used to determine whether they can get an EHCP or not).

There is not a choice to "just send them to an SN school". SN kids aren't in mainstream schools to inconvenience staff, other parents and pupils. They're there because the government decided that they should be educated in mainstream schools wherever possible and closed a lot of SN schools down!

My DS has ASD. He would have been very suited to the local school for HF kids, but needed an EHCP to go there. But he doesn't qualify for an EHCP because academically he's bright. Instead he has to cope in a mainstream setting that stresses him out. And he had/s continence issues too, similar to the OPs DC. School has always cleaned him up, or now he's older, provides a safe space and support for him to clean and change himself. He's never been illegally excluded. At worst I've been asked to keep him off for 48 hours in case it's a bug, which is fair.

OP definitely write to the HT. This was an illegal exclusion and they need to admit it or authorise it. If they uphold it then you need to take them to tribunal for disability discrimination.

Some schools do send those letters out automatically to everyone whose attendance drops below a certain percent, so it may be worth popping into the office and querying it. My little brother (17) got one last year when he was in hospital, spoke to the school and it was just the secretary hadn't checked his records to see why he was off, just the figures from the register.

Such ignorance on this thread.....no ta would do that at my school...

Educate yourself as to the actual law.

Am glad you've got it sorted op.Without an ehcp it's a legally grey area. For example, legally, my type 1 diabetic child has a right to attend school without a parent coming in every day to administer insulin but unless school employ 2 full time nurses (there has to be two to cover sickness and other commitments) it falls to TAs to offer to do it.

Not really. This comes within the school's duty to make reasonable adjustments for disability. Surely all they need to have is two people trained and insured to give the injections rather than trained full time nurses?

I don't think it's a good idea that TA's have to wipe intimate areas either. Surely that's the very essence of safeguarding?

How is it any different to a car worker changing a nappy on a baby or an older child with those needs?

*care

Your school should have an intimate care policy. If he needs assistance with toiliting then you should have an intimate care plan drawn up and signed by yourself and anyone in school who would be doing the care. Logs have to be kept every time care if needed and the staff member doing it has to inform another member of staff they are about to give assistance. It's a fairly standard thing for special schools but mainstream should have them too. Especially if your son has an EHCP

YANBU. Ask for a meeting.

Mrs Bob Dylan, it's not for the ta's to offer to administer insulin. We have had many type 1 diabetic children at our school. EVERY member of staff, other than the site team, has been trained in how to administer insulin, as well as how to enter data on the different types of pump and to use an app that some pumps share to automatically. This way, everyone is able to do the day to day stuff and we know how to deal with lows and highs. This training is led by a local diabetic nurse and, like epi-pen training, is updated annually.
I am amazed that so many schools (on here at least) seem so happy to allow their staff to dictate whether or not these children are supported properly. Surely, personal safety aside, we are obligated not to discriminate against our students like this?

mega, your T1 child doesn't need a trained nurse to inject. What they need is a trained 1:1 or a member of staff trained in carb counting, insulin dosing and injecting.

Sorry mega, you were quoting and the post wasn't yours!

SmellyChristmasCandles: But you do know you can train someone to do something without them becoming obliged to do it, yes? I would have no problem administering medicine by injection if properly trained, but I know plenty of people who still wouldn't feel comfortable doing it. Do you think they should have to?