To wonder why it's OK - even considered a positive thing- to give girls names that are traditionally considered boy's names but....

[BertrandRussell]

.......not the other way round?

John Wayne was a Marion

Those talking about gendered colours for children in Christian countries listen up. Until the late 19C blue was for girls, especially in RC countries, in honour of the Virgin Mary. Red, because it was a more expensive dye (and pink) was for boys. Then lo, came chemical colours and marketing. But pink was still for boys until the mid 20C.

As for mix gender names, they tend to be differentiated and I love them all - Julian has Julienne but Mother Julian was one of the UK's first saints. Vivian/Vivien. Lesley/Leslie. And let's not forget John Wayne's first name was Audrey.

Ah yes, John Wayne. Thanks Beauty.

sorry, correct, Marion for John Wayne.

Until a hundred or so years ago it was strong tradition to name your first born son (groan!) with the mother's maiden name. Hence I have an ancestor called Balls Garrett (yes really) because his mother's maiden name was Balls which I assume didn't connote what it does now! Quite feminist in its way?

Marilyn Manson was a stage name-I think he was called Barry. Or Brian?

And the male Evelyns and Shirleys from the past just prove the point about direction of travel.

That is family tree gold nanny.

Betrand I don't know, but maybe the boys were given surnames as names to preserve the male lineage on both the mothers and the fathers side, but for the girls it didn't really matter what they were called. That's why so surnames now names started out as male name but then later became girls names as well. But I don't know. It's interesting.

I have a name considered to be a boys. I've never really come across that being considered a great thing.

When I use to use my full name I'd get "but that's a boys name" with a tone if 'why are you called that!'

I also get people ringing for me and letters addressed to Mr - despite me using Miss. and back when notes were written a while file of dr stuff going missing when we moved house because they'd put my notes in a blue file and not a pink one.
I'd only been a patient at the surgery for 11 years! And had a full because I was the one in the family with medical problems!

"What about Jean?
Female in the uk,
Make perhaps in other countries?"

But that's in different languages.....

It's fairly common in parts of the US, for a mother to give her firstborn (male or female) her maiden name as a middle name. I know a family where every child has the mother's maiden name as a middle name.

I believe that Chelsea Clinton's daughter and son, both have Clinton as a middle name.

Honestly I don't think it is fair on a child to give them a name which is traditionally for the other sex. Children can be cruel - especially if you are different. But names which aren't even names or spelt in a bizarre way can be equally damaging. Maybe parents who choose these names should live the pregnancy introducing themselves with the name before settling on it for their child!!

On the topic of gender stereotypes - I think males expressing female traits is becoming more desirable and something to aspire to. That may be my experience of friends though. I have 2 girls, One only ever wear Tutus, rolls down muddy hills and wants to be a scientist. My other wears leggings and shirts loves everything glittery and wants to be a unicorn farmer. They are both encouraged equally and told daily they can be whoever they want to be ☺

How many threads are on here where the parents keep on trying for a girl? Don't often see it the other way around. And in real life I've met people who keep going until they get the much wanted girl, who then gets treated like a princess, the boy's almost taking a backseat. This is reflected in the media as well.

"This is reflected in the media as well"

Really? Where?

Jean is used for males in my home country as well. Completely different language and pronunciation.

I went to school with a Stacey and Courtney, both male and a boy called Gemma but that was a shortening of a traditional African name (which I can't for the life of me remember!).

I really liked Fabian for a boy but DH thought it was a bit 'girly' and used his veto. We laugh about it now as we know two Fabians, both big burly builders with nothing girly about them.

I think DH got Fabian (traditionally Polish I think) and Fabienne (French) mixed up.

With the name Robin, I've known both male and female but it's often spelled Robyn for a girl.

I agree that Rowan maybe a true unisex name.

Fabian is male. Derived from the latin Fabianus,still widely spread in latin origins countries. Would be Fabien in French. Fabienne is the female (french) version.

Coconuts I do wonder if that comes from girls are "sugar,spice and everything nice" and boys are "snips,snails and puppy dog tails" and everything else associated with that,which is equally damaging to both boys and girls.

Oh I explained to DH just how male Fabian is but he just didn't like it. He felt the same about Gabriel.

It was all academic in the end, we don't have any sons!

These are names I consider and have seen to be unisex? Do people identify these are more usual to a male/female?
I'd be interested knowing what people think!
(It's interesting to me having a 'boys name!' as a female). I see it as one of the more unisex names though!

Audrey
Jean
Hilary
Jamie
Andy
Cameron
Cody
Devon
Terry
Sydney
Erin
Francis
Madison

The only male Jane I know of is Jayne Cobb, a character in the programme "Firefly". It's ages since I watched it though, so I can't remember why he's called Jayne.

John Wayne was called Marion I tihnk.

Where I am, Jude is currently very popular for boys, although back in my schooldays it was much more associated with girls (as a shortening for Judith).

I appreciate it has always been a boy's name, my point is just that the fact that many girls used it has not stopped it becoming popular again for boys . But maybe that is no different than names like Alex and Charlie.

Gender neutral is really people like Solstice, Rainbow, Fable. I can't remember if they were boys or girls now, Rainbow was a boy I'm sure.

i wish you lot with your 'dodgy' names would name changed first before coming on threads like this one and then you could tell us!