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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To expect school teachers to actually educate my child?

460 replies

ICancelledTheCheque · 27/01/2017 10:41

Maybe I'm being a bit PFB but this has really irked me.

DD is Y7 in a big academy secondary school. She showed me some work she had done - in three paragraphs there were six spelling errors and five grammatical errors. The teacher didn't mark up a single thing and just put big green ticks and irritating smiley faces on her work and wrote "excellent work" at the end.

But it wasn't excellent work. How is she going to learn if they don't flag this stuff up? Is this the norm these days? Doesn't bode well for GCSEs if so!!

OP posts:
Trifleorbust · 27/01/2017 17:53

Pranma: 3,000 minutes being, of course, 50 hours, so more than a full time job in and of itself!

Some people are just thick on this issue. They think saying something is better for the kids equals it being possible. It doesn't. If the government wants every child to have work marked every day, the education budget probably needs to quadruple to hire sufficient teachers to staff realistic timetables (plus these people would need to be trained). Either that or they need to take apart the system of accountability that forces teachers to spend their time planning lessons in great detail, entering data and reporting on progress. Never going to happen.

OopsDearyMe · 27/01/2017 18:25

Isn't SPAG taught separately at secondary, maybe that's why??

worriedmum100 · 27/01/2017 18:29

This is a very interesting thread. I wonder if I could ask the teachers on it a genuine question? My DS in in Year 1. He has a group of spellings to learn each week (usually grouped around the same "sound"). He is then tested by being given a sheet with sentences where there is a gap and he hasaid to fill in the correct word so that the spelling is used in context. This seems sensible to me and he usually does pretty well.

He really likes writing and will often spontaneously choose to write a "story" about something. It is invariably full of spelling errors. Should I correct them or not? It's very hard not to but I'm aware that he's still only 5 and some times he mispells because he's tried to write it phonetically.

OopsDearyMe · 27/01/2017 18:29

Sorry i might be being thick but isn't it less about the government and more about school priorities, I don't remember marking ever being a big problem when I was at school, after all isn't that a big part of being a teacher! Maybe less time spent on pointless meetings and planning and ticking boxes and more out of the box tinking might be in order or don't bother setting work! What's the point if the children never recieve full feedback!

worriedmum100 · 27/01/2017 18:33

Sorry posted too soon.... by correcting would it risk interfering with his developing understanding of phoneics/reading? I am know no way a "special snowflake" type of parent but he does get upset if he thinks he's done it wrong and I don't want to discourage but I also don't want errors to become "embedded"!

Broccolirevolution · 27/01/2017 18:36

oops you're right - but it's not us teachers who want meetings or box ticking. I sat in a meeting for an hour on Monday night talking about how to lay out a form. At the end of the hour a decision hadn't been reached. We will have to discuss this again! Instead of complaining about teachers please complain about school management! Please!

SmileEachDay · 27/01/2017 18:51

Government do have a massive influence on school policies though oops..they decide, essentially, which courses can "count", what has to be taught, what "good enough" looks like, what progress is acceptable etc

School have to jump through those hoops.

So school management presses that downwards and, to varying degree, puts teachers and support staff under pressure.

FruitCider · 27/01/2017 18:53

Surely pointing out the great things in an analytical piece of work and highlighting one or 2 key words that aren't spelt correctly is a FAR BETTER teaching method than scribbling all over pupils books, making them feel berated and useless?

I do think parents expect far too much of teachers. If your child's SPAG is out and you notice, why don't YOU support YOUR CHILD in rectifying?!?!?

Sorry for the shouty reply. I have PMS. However I think my point was clear Wink

SmileEachDay · 27/01/2017 18:55

You'd think, fruit, wouldn't you?

badhotfanny · 27/01/2017 18:57

Yes, but the trouble is that English teachers ALSO have content to mark.

ALL teachers should be marking for literacy.

FruitCider · 27/01/2017 18:57

It's almost like parents don't want to take any responsibility for their child's education. Do they not realise that consolidating learning outside of the classroom is important too? I mean, my child hasn't even started school yet, but I get this. It's not rocket science, is it?

SmileEachDay · 27/01/2017 18:59

Unless it's A'level physics, fruit, in which case it could be. Wink

FruitCider · 27/01/2017 18:59

Worriedmum your child is 5 and is writing stories, and yet you are worried that his spelling is wrong? You cannot be serious?

FruitCider · 27/01/2017 19:00

Smile well that's put a smile back on my face, it's not often that people live up to their usernames... (although right now I am drinking fruit cider!)

derxa · 27/01/2017 19:07

It's very hard not to but I'm aware that he's still only 5 and some times he mispells because he's tried to write it phonetically. But that's what 5 year olds do. They haven't established spelling rules yet.

I read on an old thread that French children's books are sent home every day so their parents can go over the mistakes at home. I'm sure parents complaining on here would love that Hmm

worriedmum100 · 27/01/2017 19:08

Well fruit I did say it was a genuine question so yes I was serious. I'm not sure how you square your comment to me with what you've said about parents taking an interest in their own children's learning. Of course I'm very happy with the fact he likes to write stories (he's not so keen on reading)and wasn't suggesting I should castigate him for spelling errors in the absence of any praise for the effort. Of course not. I simply wanted to ask the people who are trained in this type of thing which I am not (although highly educated in other areas). I wasn't looking for a bunfight.

arethereanyleftatall · 27/01/2017 19:14

Worried - I let it go mostly for both my dc. I would just say 'wonderful story. And you're right, that spelling is how the word sounds' so for example if they were leaning 'ay' sounds that week, then wrote 'mayk'. It all comes good in the end.

worriedmum100 · 27/01/2017 19:16

Thank you arethere

MuteButtonisOn · 27/01/2017 19:25

I think you have a really valid point Fruit. However I think many parents don't know their ' place' anymore on how to support a schooled child. They are worried about teaching in the ' Wrong way' - at primary Graphemes etc and lots of wordy babble and changed teaching methods ' confuse' parents imho, it is very different in lots of cases from when they were at school, and they worry about undermining learning methods. As I mentioned I HE now but I do think ' out-sourcing' education to schools goes too far for some parents.

FruitCider · 27/01/2017 19:31

who are trained in this type of thing which I am not (although highly educated in other areas).

Not sure why your personal education level makes a difference here.

Maybe you don't genuinely realise how special it is that your 5 year old can write stories, regardless of the spelling?

worriedmum100 · 27/01/2017 19:45

Wow fruit did you take a nasty pill today or something?

I put it in because I wondered whether my level of education (and my profession) required and require very accurate spelling and grammar and this might have been influencing my feeling the need to correct him so I thought I'd ask people who knew better how to approach it. What's so wrong with that?

Anyway I said I didn't want a bunfight and I don't need anyone else to enlighten me on how special my own son is thanks. I think it was clear from my post that my intention was to do my best to support his learning not ride roughshod over his efforts or feelings FFS.

SmileEachDay · 27/01/2017 19:46

fruit isn't being nasty. She's genuinely thinking your son is all the aces.

Anothermoomin · 27/01/2017 19:48

Bobochic " I take issue with English people who accuse students who have been educated in other systems and languages of not knowing "how to think" and not having analytical skills. Analytical skills are strongly culture and content dependent, and that is before we even take account of language barriers."

I am not accusing anybody of anything. Please control your language. I am observing that many ESL students struggle with analytical thinking. They struggle to explain "why a particular point is important. I am keenly aware of cultural issue as that is a key part of my job* but thank you for pointing it out to me.

I am nor necessarily criticising other systems I am being positive about the strengths in our own system. A strength of the English system is answering 'why' and 'because' questions.

If you feel the Iraqi or Chinese systems address these issues I would very much be interested to hear of your experiences.

worriedmum100 · 27/01/2017 19:53

Fair enough smile but that's not how it comes across to me. Great that fruit thinks it's impressive he writes stories. It's the insinuation that I don't realise that myself because I care too much about spellings which is rather insulting.

OwlinaTree · 27/01/2017 19:54

Spelling, and grammar, just aren't a priority like they used to be.

Lol are you joking? There's a whole load of testing dedicated to it in ks1 and 2!