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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

...to feel depressed that only 7% of UK identify as Feminist?

999 replies

DioneTheDiabolist · 18/12/2016 18:30

www.fawcettsociety.org.uk/2016/01/we-are-a-nation-of-hidden-feminists/

7% of the population and just 9% of women in this country identify as feminist. I'm not saying that everyone should call themselves feminist, I care more about what people do, rather than the label they assign themselves. But I am Sad that the number is so low.

Given that most people believe in sexual equality, why do so many people not feel comfortable to call themselves feminist? And what (if anything) can we do about it?

OP posts:
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TheWoodlander · 18/12/2016 23:31

Well, I identify as a feminist and have done since I understood the meaning of the word. OP, YANBU.

I have managed to love my sons (both of them) and my husband, and my father - and have also managed never to be called a rape apologist. How about that? Probably because I don't say things that are rape apologist.

TheMortificadosDragon · 18/12/2016 23:35

The first debate I ever engaged in about feminism was on a computer forum back before the Web had been invented. I was the only female on it, and at the outset there was only one person who identified as a feminist... not me. Well, I'll always be grateful to that anonymous bloke for puncturing my complacency that it was ok now for women, (we could do science degrees and get proper jobs!), and making me realise that equality was not yet a reality for many women in the uk let alone elsewhere. I've considered myself a feminist since then, over 30 years ago. I'm pretty ignorant of 'feminist theory' - some of the debates on the boards here I find interesting and informative, others not so much ... bit like a lot of other boards. Maybe I'm just old enough and opinionated enough not to be scared off if I don't agree with absolutely everything, or if theres some esoteric debate I don't understand or don't care about.

Having a daughter has developed my tendency towards being a gender critical feminist (though I didnt learn that term till quite recently).

EnthusiasmDisturbed · 18/12/2016 23:36

No it isn't that's why I asked and replied to your previous comment

Missswatch · 18/12/2016 23:39

That the real issues are in the middle east. A bit of 'manspreading' pales in comparison. First world problems

TheWoodlander · 18/12/2016 23:41

Yes, gender critical feminist is loosely what I'd describe myself as. Second wave I think. Which would be in line with my age.

But, I shave my legs and wear make up. I have my DH's name. I simply don't see these things as something to be hung up about. I do get annoyed by pink for girls and blue for boys, cars for boys and dolls for girls. Because dammit, its annoying, stupid, and reinforces gender barriers. I can barely find a blue pair of pyjamas for my 9yr old dd this xmas and they're on her list - to put a personal gripe in Angry

BadKnee · 18/12/2016 23:42

TheWoodlander Nor of course do I!! Why would I - that is the whole point! I was accused of it - just like you have implied in a passive aggressive way that I must in fact be a rape apologist.

And you say that you are a feminist...

It is about what you DO not about how many other women you can accuse of NOT being feminist. That's what counts.

I just don't get it. Why would women who purport to want to fight for women - all women - delight in tearing other women down? I mean why???

SoggyDays · 18/12/2016 23:45

The reason MN has changed my self classification (for the purposes of answering surveys!) is that I was quite happy tootling along with my own definition of what feminist meant and MN showed me it was rather a contested term and that I was maybe more an equalist.

Some posts on the feminist boards are thought provoking.

SpeakNoWords · 18/12/2016 23:47

How does equalism differ from feminism?

TheWoodlander · 18/12/2016 23:48

Interesting that there is a view that loving sons makes you a rape apologist - I have never fallen foul of such of a thing, or come across it. Ignore it for the bloody nonsense it is fgs. It's not "feminism" that says that.

However, I would point out that loads of people say (incl my own mother) say thoughtless things like "what did she think she was doing walking home on her own" etc etc of rape victims. Not saying you did, of course.

Many, many of the famous MN feminism board regulars (who also get moaned about regularly on the MN boards for being vicious manhaters with body hair and sharp tongues, oh, and "shrill") have sons - having a son and being a feminist is not mutually exclusive.

EnthusiasmDisturbed · 18/12/2016 23:49

So it's not possible to be concerned about both if you are a feminist

That we should not bother being concerned about young girls in the UK being conditioned to believe they should look a certain way that has led to a huge increase in bulimia and anorexia because girls in the Middle East are being forced to marry and raped at the age of 13

Or concerned that girls here suffer sexual harassment walking down the street becuase girls in parts of Africa and the ME (and other parts of the world) are being mutilated

TheMortificadosDragon · 18/12/2016 23:51

People can care about large and small issues, you know. Threads featuring something like 'manspreading' are largely just for a bit of light entertainment. The world isn't a worse place for a few minutes of men saving room for cats

SoggyDays · 18/12/2016 23:52

Speak no words I don't choose to be nit picked this evening. Just explaining that I am not here to decry the feminists of MN.

Missswatch · 18/12/2016 23:55

You can care about both. Though tbh I never see any posts or western feminists give any mention to the ME fighters. Just saying you think Mr Men books are sexist and damaging your children? Pffft whatever, you seem very weak to me. Real strong women are those in the ME fighting

BadKnee · 18/12/2016 23:58

But Woodlander - you just implied it. That I must actually be one - or be lying.

FWIW it was once in a discussion about how funny/ridiculous it was men with small penises were. As the mother of a small-for-his-age son son who had to have psychiatric treatment and be removed from school due to bullying by girls, (who pulled his trousers down in the form room and dragged him across the class while laughing at his "smallness"), I was told that since that was nothing in comparison to what girls had to go through and since I was trying to "equate" that to what happens to girls I was a rape apologist.

BadKnee · 19/12/2016 00:02

Oh dear midnight - and work tomorrow! Just realised.
Goodnight

SpeakNoWords · 19/12/2016 00:02

Sorry soggydays I'm not trying to nit pick. I just genuinely don't understand the differences between the two. I was hoping you'd be able to give me a quick summary as it's what you stated you believed in.

TheMortificadosDragon · 19/12/2016 00:02

Soggy - and anyone who is unsure what 'feminist' means - honestly, I'd recommend simply referring to a dictionary rather than what someone on an internet board might say.^^ Some of the FWR regulars might be towards the 'radical' end, but that doesn't mean its the only valid definition.

TheWoodlander · 19/12/2016 00:05

I'm very sorry for your son - truly I am. But I'm just trying to say that "feminism" didn't do that to him. Feminism simply asks that women are entitled to the same rights, opportunities, wages and justice as men - and are not seen as second class citizens.

EnthusiasmDisturbed · 19/12/2016 00:07

Well I suggest you read up there have been quite a few discussions on the ME and many on FGM haven't seen one on women fighting in the ME

The difficulty with FGM and preventing young girls being being forced to go through the horrifically cruel procedure is that it is unlikely to stop until attitudes and societies change their attitudes that are deeply ingrained towards girls and women

women have forced changes to come about in our society we can support and lobby our governments to support women abroad to be able to do the same but a western women marching over there and showing them the right way isn't going to work

Missswatch · 19/12/2016 00:08

Woodlander if he fought back and punched one of those girls most feminists would be up in arms screaming patriarchy etc and minimising the issue further

SpeakNoWords · 19/12/2016 00:09

That is really not what I would envisage happening. I'm a feminist and that sort of response wouldn't even enter my mind.

Missswatch · 19/12/2016 00:10

EnthusiasmDisturbed if a westerner walked over there and told them how it's done she'd be laughed at and told to fuck off. Or to STFU and grab a rifle

Leanback · 19/12/2016 00:14

If you don't want to call yourself a feminist then go ahead but please don't call yourself a humanist instead. That word already has a definition and is something entirely different.

EnthusiasmDisturbed · 19/12/2016 00:16

Woman are fighting back with riffles against men trying to force FGM

Or are you talking about women in war zones

Do you not know how women supported the war effort here and in Europe. In all wars women have risked their lives supporting fighters, fighting themselves, being a decoy and taking huge risks trying to protect their families that comes down to human nature It's a fight for survival

Or are you talking about the young women from the UK that have been brainwashed into fighting for ISIS

TheWoodlander · 19/12/2016 00:16

Woodlander if he fought back and punched one of those girls most feminists would be up in arms screaming patriarchy etc and minimising the issue further

You have absolutely no way of knowing that is true.

This should be treated as bullying in school - and we all know many schools are woefully inadequate at dealing with such things. Just as they are woefully inadequate with dealing with the routine sexual assault of girls in classrooms and school corridors all over this country - who are told "boys will be boys".

Boys will not be "boys" if they are told, and shown, that this behaviour will not be tolerated. Girls will not bully young boys on the size of their penis if they are told, and shown that this will not be tolerated.