...to think cutting beef out of our diet is a good idea?

[KlingybunFistelvase]

And that even the most committed of meat eaters would be happy enough to cut out beef if they could eat moderate amounts of other meat?

www.collective-evolution.com/2016/08/06/leonardo-dicaprio-calls-for-a-ban-on-beef/

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/environment/2014/jul/21/giving-up-beef-reduce-carbon-footprint-more-than-cars?client=safari

vegmum No 'harm' but you risk looking like a bit self righteous. I'm sure people know that giving up meat is an option, therefore they have made a choice on some level to keep eating it.

It's not like they are going to listen to a veggie/vegan who is asking them about giving it up and think 'oh there's an idea, I have never thought about doing that'

Actually for some people it does make them think about it more, probably why people transition to vegetarian or vegan everyday.

"I thought about unethical and decided ethicless was more appropriate."

Because you like words that don't exist?

I transitioned back!

"I know people love their beef/meat etc and won't give it up, no harm in asking people though"

It is silly, not harmful.

Another semi-vegetarian here, relying heavily on own allotment, locally grown veg, and occasional British-reared beef, pork or lamb. Plenty of outdoor pigs in my part of southern England: I can see them rooting around in the mud when I go on a Sunday walk.

So could you explain to me, vegmum, how my going vegetarian would help the general sustainability of the world? Would the people who are now eating intensively reared meat in America suddenly start buying in those free range cuts from the UK instead? And what would that do to the environment? Surely sustainability is about eating local food which does as little harm as possible to your local environment?

I know it's silly, can only try though. It's not hurting me if people say no.

So it doesn't occur to those people that they can give up meat before some well meaning veggie tell them? They may be persuaded by arguments if they are inclined to listen but just suggesting that people stop eating meat isn't going to have much of an effect.

Of course it doesn't hurt you if they say no, but it probably pisses them off, and adds fuel to the cliche of preachy self righteous vegetarians/vegans

Actually for some people it does make them think about it more, probably why people transition to vegetarian or vegan everyday

No, it doesn't. I've watched so many videos and saw so many pictures posted on facebook by my vegan friends that totally desensitised me. Opposite effect than what they wanted I would hazard a guess.

It's a bit like a strange penis, don't shove it down my throat uninvited. You not eating meat doesn't make you a better person than those who do.

The point is people just need to eat less meat in general. I'm a vegan mainly because I don't want an animal to die for me but that isn't what this thread is about. What you are doing yes is a lot better for the environment than intensive farming and if everyone did that it would be so much better for the planet. But the amount of meat the world is going through and how much meat people in general want to eat isn't sustainable that way. If people ate meat like you did then the intensive farming etc wouldn't be necessary. Also so much food that is produced is wasted too and not needed to be produced in the 1st place.

That was in reply to Cory.

Gamer-that's why I said some people.

Absolutely we should all move to Almond milk, quinoa and all the other stuff vegans eat.

Draining the water sources of the local area.
Increasing deforestation.
Being shipped in on great big diesel hogging ships.

Far better for the environment. Di Caprio says so.

I don't tell vegetarians or vegans that they should consider eating meat because it's not my business to do so. I'm always a little surprised that some of them don't adhere to the same principle.

I read once that DiCaprio was at a school for gifted kids. What went wrong?

Bloody

On the plus side, if all that was available to eat was quinoa, almond milk and vegetables, then there would be fewer people in the world as some wouldn't want to eat ever again

I would go further and say eating sustainable meat, local game for example, is better for the environment than being vegan. Obviously animal rights come into it for many vegans. But to use environmental arguments for total veganism feels a bit bogus I am afraid.

The ban beef campaign also has a religious aspect according to the link. All a bit murky for me.

vegmum I assume when you say "so much food is produced is wasted too" you are referring just to animals? EVERY part of an animal is used and not just in food for humans to consume. Just because you might have some manky wilted veg in your fridge doesn't mean meat eaters or industry wastes meat or meat products.

And a lot of the veg that isn't pretty enough to make it onto the shelves goes for animal feed use.

Also if everyone went vegan do you think we would have no use for using animal parts? We would. What we don't eat gets used in so many ways I would never be able to list them.

You are a vegan and that is your choice. I choose to eat meat produced in the UK/ Ireland as part of my diet and that is my choice.

At least if I have a sausage made from a rare breed pig I know at least it is keeping that breed alive for future generations. I for one do not want our fields empty of livestock munching on grass in the open air.

I've not asked you to eat meat, please stop asking me to go vegan. (and when I say me I mean the meat eaters on this thread).

But vegmum, how is "in general" going to help with sustainability? You seem to be suggesting that everybody ought to eat the same regardless of where in the world they are. From an environmental pov, that seems a dreadful idea to me.

So people who live on islands in the North Sea where few vegetables will grow should stop eating fish and start importing soy beans? I should stop eating rabbits, which are over-running the countryside, and start eating nuts from the other side of the world instead? Because statistics matter more than how food is actually produced and transported? Because what matters is that everybody does what should be done "in general" rather than what would do less harm in their own individual case?

And di Caprio isn't a veggie/vegan so he doesn't feel that strongly about it

Portobello burgers are amazing... Id rather fart than chew on a dead thing.
I still cook meat, family n dogs. Hate the smell too now.

This year I'll be growing a fair chunk of what I'll eat, if it all works out. Prep n freeze what I don't burn through. I can't say there's many steak lovers who'd host n prep there meals. The main issue with sustainable beef is that its not the majority, you'd physically never meet the demands if you worked with nothing but grass fed natural beasts. They also pump out a fair bit of methane per cow which is destroying the ozone layer, the waste ends up in the water system n is proving to destroy ocean life, so no fish in the future.
There's research that's shown what cattle/chickens are fed as a commercial diet is increasing antibiotic resistant strains, since you are getting trace amounts in every bite. Dog treats were pulled not long ago from b&m because dogs were dying from the left over antibiotics.
Milk also has a quite a bit of pus, blood n shit in it. A third of dairy cows have mastitis. I also don't almond milk often, perhaps once a month if I'm going to bake for something but there's no need for a milk replacement. Sustainability will be different for every climate, my bananas probably burn alot of fuel, averaging 15-20 a day but definitely don't use as much or give off as much as beef.

You do not need meat protein. You do not need 30 odd grams of it in any form. I'd be deader than a dodo if that had any substance

Nobody is saying they need it but it is a choice - you choose not to eat it and I respect that.

I however would actually starve if I was forced to eat a vegan diet. However I don't have a go at vegans for their dietary/ethical choices

Quorn for everything I say...those poor animals! It's absolutely barbaric.....

YABU and the 'facts' are bogus.
Many places such as Wales can only grow grass. Humans cannot eat grass, so we use livestock to turn it into usable food.
Here in the UK we farm beef differently from the USA.