Fuming that they are talking of taking away pensioner bus passes and the triple lock

[jdoe8]

I'm still 40 years before I will get these, but I think we need to fight to keep these for future generations.

For many people they will have left school at 16 and worked until they were 65. Now after all those years of paying their taxes they aren't getting much back so the very least we need to do is allow them to travel and guarantee that their income will rise every year.

But anyway yabu op. Age should not be a reason to get benefits, it should be based on need.

Foxyloxy1plus1 So you had a lump sum, spent it on your kids and now think you are entitled to freebies because your pension is lower than the wage you used to bring in?

dreamingofsun

In an ideal world (Ha!) I'd like to see more housing complexes specially designed for older people to rent, with a properly regulated rental system & responsible landlords. (Doesn't that sound a bit like social housing?)

If it was easy to sell a much-loved family home full of memories, and move into somewhere more suitable for your needs, I'm sure more of us oldies could be encouraged to do it. Our current house purchase system is so stressful I can fully understand why people (myself included) don't want to move. I'd sell & move into rental if I could find the right property. And use the capital to fund a decent standard of living in my dotage, with generous provision for the grandchildren's education etc, and probably enough left to fund couple of years of care fees. Sorted!

And if I do downsize now (its only got 3 bedrooms) I will have less equity in the future to fund my future care fees, so no inheritance for my children.

I think people need to get out of this mind set to be honest. An inheritance for our children is a bonus when we die but life should not be centred around there being inheritance. It's this mindset that has people waiting far too long to access social care because they don't want to "raid the childrens inheritance". I've seen it with my own eyes working with the elderly, people in utter crisis when they needn't be. But of course we must protect the inheritance.

Bus passes are used by Londoners as they have a real advantage and I agree if you are still in employment you shouldn't be entitled to receive one.

I have a bass pass but live in Hertfordshire I have used it twice, our bus services aren't that good, and I would think that there are many parts of the country where a similar situation exists.

Not all pensioners, especially those retiring now will be getting the benefits of a final salary pension. There are many women retiring now who had career breaks to bring up family's (no child care allowances in the 70's and 80's and nursery places) who are getting virtually no occupational pensions and only minimum state pension.

I could probably sell it now and move someone where smaller & cheaper, but why should I be expected to uproot myself at my age, with all the stress, expense and disruption it will entail?

Unless you think your home will remain a viable place for you to live until the end of your life (potentially with very reduced mobility) then now is the ideal time to move! I watched both my grandparents and my husband's grandmother leave it much too late, and am currently really encouraging my parents in their vague musings about moving to somewhere that isn't in the middle of bloody nowhere. Move in your sixties to save yourself the trauma of having to do it in your eighties. I also don't really follow your point about inheritance/care home fees - the money you'd release by downsizing isn't just going to disappear?

I agree that ideally bus passes, fuel payments etc should be based on need, but as pps have stated, the cost of means testing probably outweighs the saving. My FIL retired at 50 (30 years ago), gets a huge bank pension, gets the fuel allowance and donates the money to ... the golf club (that well known charity!). I'd like to think that in his position I would choose a more deserving cause.

I could probably sell it now and move someone where smaller & cheaper, but why should I be expected to uproot myself at my age, with all the stress, expense and disruption it will entail?

It's a bit like saying 'why should I live in a small house with 3 children when it would be easier for me to live in a nice big one'. Erm well because you can't afford it. No one would expect the state to fund scenario 2, so why scenario 1? If you can afford it stay, but if not move. It's pretty simple really.

Starfish raises a very good point. Do we really want more civil service bods administrating means tests? The money will just get swallowed up by the costs - it won't go towards more benefits for the rest of us.

Just to be clear, I do not think my children are automatically entitled to any inheritance, (despite what they themselves might think) and I fully expect that any capital I have will be used on care fees in the future. I think this is actually my main reason for wanting to hold on to a house that is adequate for my needs at present, to preserve a larger "pot" for the future.

I was just thinking out loud that I would move if it was easier to find suitable accommodation, and I'm sure many others in my position would as well. The equity released would be used to supplement my meagre pension, and would take me above the means-tested benefits level, so saving the govt. money in 2 ways.

Blech Another race to the bottom, blame anyone and everyone older for the financial mess the younger ones are in...

... apart from the points made about the current family, working and child benefits not having existed when those OAPs were young, I wanted to add

Pensioners have been very lucky. They have seen their house prices rise enormously. Yes, except many don't own homes. That is a much more recent obsession!

They had free education. As does everybody now! If you mean Higher Education, then no, very few of them went! Most left school at 14 and 15 years olds and went straight into work, or became housewives!!

They have been able to retire much earlier than other generations will be able to. Yes. Most having done much more physical work than is the norm these days.

There is always another side to the uber simplistic baby boomer shite that the media loves to print. Just refuse to fall for it. Refuse to take the trite crap at face value. THINK!!!

Every generation has pros and cons the previous and following generations could never have dreamt of. That is life, progress and just 'the way it is'.

The way we live now is so different from the way I was brought up... I am 51, have worked and been self supporting since I was 17. So I have already 'paid in' for 34 years and have another 16 years to go. By the time I have worked for 50 years I would hope that, those of you who are currently moaning that pensioners have it easy, will have grown up a little and realised that the vituperative shite you are aiming at your grand/parents will now be being aimed at you, by your kids!

Oh and...

There is much truth to the idea that as a youth you are a natural communist: you have nothing and think it is unfair that those who have don't share their riches with you.

As you get older you become much more conservative: you have worked fucking hard, have accumulated some treasured possessions and a lifestyle you can bear. You wish all those moaning young twats would piss off and work hard, just like you did!

Every generation goes through similar stages... My parents did, I have... YOU WILL TOO

The thing with that idea OurBlanche is that for many of the young generation now there isn't any chance of ever owning property to want to conserve!

Actually, most of today's pensioners are homeowners. Even those who lived in council housing bought theirs when Maggie let them - my grandparents did.

The utter nonsense about them doing more backbreaking work is hilarious - you do realise somebody retired now would have been born in 1950? Not all of them were in physical jobs and many went to university!

And most female pensioners gave up work to have children and never went back - should they really be getting a free bus pass, TV licence, and all that stuff? My grandma worked from 15 until she was 22 and gave up to have kids. She then worked about 18 months when my dad was about 15 before leaving. So she'd paid in about 8 years - why was she entitled to a full pension, bus pass, TV licence, eye tests, winter fuel payment etc? I didn't begrudge her getting it, but even she was amazed she got what she got.

Yes! So you are, as do many others, ignoring the reality that many of the older generation do not own their own homes?

Look... the data sets are fairly unequivocal..

visual.ons.gov.uk/uk-perspectives-2016-housing-and-home-ownership-in-the-uk/

ourblanche - spot on
many younger people forget that those who retired earlier particularly those born during and just after the second world war needed 44 years NI contributions (male) and 40 years (female) and their state pension was reduced according to how many years they worked. Now it is 30/35 years for both men and women - so they are 'lucky'.
The state pension is TAXABLE income unlike most 'benefits'
The winter fuel allowance is £4 per week per household and unlikely to increase so inflation will take care of that
The free TV licence is only for the over 75s not all pensioners
Bus pass is only really valuable if you live in a big city (think London) as many areas have very few buses and so the bus pass in these areas is of minimal value /cost to the Govt.
There used to be extra tax-free allowance for pensioners - this has now gone.
Finally the insanity of the triple lock on the basic state pension (which for existing pensioners is about £120 per week) should go as it gets people frothing at the mouth imagining a few percentage of £120 (or £155 is you have recently retired - lucky people) is a lot of money - it really isn't.

It's official, I give in! Sometimes there is just no discussion to be had!

Only on page 3, blood boiling.

Only Arfarf and Loki seem to have a clue about any of this!

My generation of women, who weren't brought up to work and get educated (I did, luckily, and have paid tax at the higher rate for almost 20 years) have already lost 6 to 7 years' pension payments.

And I actually can't believe there is a person on this thread who would begrudge an 85 year old a free bloody bus journey.

Wrong time to stop triple lock IMO as inflation is about to take off. But governments only as innumerate as most people on this thread.

Not you mollie obviously

So it's wrong to get rid of the triple lock? Why? Why should you get that whilst the disabled people get money taken away? It's not FAIR. That's the point here - fairness. If old people are going to keep fucking the country over by voting for Tories and Brexit, it's only fair they get hit like everybody else.

You can't use a bus pass if there aren't any buses. That's the situation here and in a lot of places.

As I said Matt, innumerate. Also discriminating against people based on the voting preferences of some of them - NICE. I wouldn't want to live in your totalitarian state.

Younger PPs - let's hear your opinions when some of you cop for all that inherited boomer wealth. Watch the solidarity of misery break down then.

I hope I'm still around, with popcorn.

FAIR!!! Ye gods you sound like a 12 year old!

Maybe you would like to live in a world where Logan's Run and Soylent Green are real possibilities! Well, until you get to your mid 30s

I'll take a seat, if I may, user I have my own popcorn!

So the state pension would only be paid to 20% of people and was only payable for 8 years on average.

Fast forward to today. Pension is payable at 65. About 85% of 20 year olds will make it to that age and on average they will live to their mid 80s. So the state pension is paid to 80% of people and payable for 20 years

Well said Minipie - this is the bleedin' obvious point that people miss.
Would be interesting to know what age would now re-establish the 20%/8 year average?

GettingitwrongHauntingat night. Taking from the system? You do realise that pensioners with an occupational pension pay income tax on that pension? That pensioners also pay VAT. That pensioners also pay petrol tax. That pensioners also pay council tax. Where do you think that money goes?

And pensioners who have saved all their lives have seen the interest rates on those savings slip to almost nothing, and why? To support historically lowest of the low borrowing rates for people starting out on their mortgage journey.