AIBU to want to carry on this interesting discussion about the Child Protection System?

[Spero]

Following on from this www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/2792849-AIBU-to-be-horrified-by-the-Stolen-Children-of-England?

I thought it was interesting. Some people didn't agree with me and said they would tell me why. I would like to hear their views.

Of course yanbu. You do an important job in educating people and dispelling widespread and damaging myths about child protection.

(Aren't you in a mosh pit, though???)

I, personally, would love for this conversation to be carried on. Especially when we have knowledgable posters with experience of how SW/care system/adoption works.
I'm sure it'd put a heck of a lot if minds at rest after hearing scaremongering stories.

Marking place.

Fwiw after 10 years in children's social care I have never heard of any targets for removing kids to be adopted. Within. Several authorities not just one.

Placemarking

It's an interesting discussion.

Glad to see you've stayed. Let's hope mn edit the last post on the other thread to link here.

It's an interesting debate and one that needs to be held I think.

Very interested to hear the views of those who disagree with Spero, and would very much like to see their evidence not holding by breath tbh

Place marking

Doing a victory lap round thread/place marking.

From my experiences, some work, some personal, all local. A lot of effort is put into finding kids private arrangements i.e. placing with family or friends. It is the cheapest and quickest option, when it is possible.

tldr

Is this the famous missing in action thread?

Ooh. Welcome home.

stands as the side pogging

Glad this is here, and glad you are still here. I didn't follow the last thread to the end, but it certainly was an important subject.

Sorry to see all the thread deletion nonsense.

Spero, can we go back to your quote:
"There is undoubtedly a constant swinging of the pendulum from one extreme to another. We are now very firmly in the 'child rescue narrative' and the focus is on removal rather than support. "

This is very worrying, don't you think? The lack of balance. Any swing of the pendulum, to any extreme, on any issue, not just CP/SS/anything is never good. Don't you think?

Excellent

I agree oblomov. I think for an outsider it probably just seems like we are all doing a crap job. But honestly I feel like part of the problem is that government policy changes do frequently there is never any time to see if such and such a programme works to its fullest potential.

I don't believe my colleagues want to be in a pendulum. And I hope I'm not naive in thinking that my colleagues in duty and assessment know exactly what to look for without being too rash or too lenient. I personally feel that the media and our government/policy makers have more effect on the pendulum than the individuals working on front line.

Glad you've not gone Spero. You help a lot of people.

All my experiences are with teenagers and removal in the form of private arrangements seems very popular. However, these are a form of temporary removal and the child gets to have a lot of say in the proceedings?
How different is it with younger children?

Oblomov I would say that too if I didn't actually think we set the bar way too low in the first place before we intervene with families. We allow children to be horribly damaged by their parents in the name of 'the family'.

I feel we should do far more to protect children but that that should be done in the context of better trained, better resourced, more professional SS.

Lord knows how we get that though. SS are woefully mismanaged and have been for decades.

I always welcome posters like Spero and indeed anyone with intelligent answers even when their views are very opposed to mine. The more different views we have on here the better.

Oblomov - Matthew Syed and Black Box Thinking is very useful when thinking about the pendulum. He points out that the aviation industry promotes a culture of learning from mistakes and people aren't shamed for making mistakes and thus not afraid to report them.

Glad the discussion has been restarted, was a bit shocked when the other thread got deleted.

conserve The bottom line is that we need central government to prioritise social care. Prevention is always better. Struggling families should be supported by universal services and other services. If a mother is missing alcohol and thus, neglecting her children, let's get her proper substance use help. To do this, we need to fund and resource addiction services much better than we are.

We make social workers accountable to the law. If they make a wrong decision they don't just face losing their job but also risk a prison sentence. It is bound to produce an 'if in doubt, remove' culture.

Placemarking - glad to see this discussion carrying on.

The Catholic church in England and Wales recently apologised for its role in removing children from their unmarried mothers for adoption in the period between the 1950s and the 1970s. Imagine that you, 20 or 30 years from now, found out that your adoption might have been the result of a council target. How much trust would you have in the quality of the decision-making that changed your life?

Earlier this year I received the following email from a family lawyer: “Many in Europe believe that in the future, the UK government will be apologising to a generation of children who were swiftly and forcibly adopted through our family courts.” The lawyer believes such concerns to be justified. So do I

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/dec/13/breaking-up-families-councils-child-adoptions
can this really be happening?