AIBU to suggest that schools cannot win?

[Piglet208]

It seems that whatever schools do it will upset a large group of (very vocal) parents. If they host productions during the day they are criticised by working parents. They host in the evening and they are criticised by parents with tired children. They organise trips which annoy parents due to the cost or they don't organise trips and are thought not to care or be lazy. They give out too little or too much homework...never just the right amount. They push the children too hard or they don't do enough. Has it always been like this or are parents more invested in school life now? I don't remember my parents having such strong opinions. I also don't think society judges and scrutinises other professions in quite the same way. AIBU?

I don't think my view will be popular but I think it's parents who can't win.

My impression of teachers, if mumsnet is anything to go by, is that they are above reproach, that children are liars and that any criticism, even mild criticism, makes them angry and defensive in the extreme.

I agree, who'd want to be a teacher nowadays for all the reasons you've said.

They juggle so much and then on top have parents moan about everything or have to do things twice as seperated parents can't put the chid first and share appointments/letters etc.

There you go... proof that MN will give you a viewpoint to meet any need, whatever you want, you will find it.

Far from finding threads full of teachers being above the law, beyond reproach etc, I see many posts asking why teachers don't walk on water. Sometimes the thread goes against the teacher/school. Sometimes it fills up with support and explanations.

But, much like Baby Boomer, Estate Agents, BTL Landlords etc, teachers are very much in the firing line.

I must be missing those posts.

I see a lot of posts where people insist

the child is lying
even if they aren't, the parent(s) need to butt out
teachers work soooooo hard so it's all okay

I would not be a teacher for anything! Class numbers rising and still going to continue to rise!

Class numbers may be rising but that isn't s reason to treat children badly.

Ah!

I see posts where some posters advise that a 4 year old doesn't always tell the whole story, they have a limited viewpoint as they are wholly solipsist at that age - and others leap in to say that is calling children liars.

I see posts where parents want to micromanage or have a rant at a teacher and are told that maybe they need to let go a little bit, let their DC acclimatise to the changes - and others leap in to say that parents should always challenge crap teachers

I see so very many posts that suggest that, because teachers explain how hard it is to teach for many things that have fuck all to do with the classroom, teachers are always complaining that they have the very hardest job in the universe.

You see what you want to see... just like everyone else!

As a teacher I just want to say most my parents are fab, only a very few make me go

And in ten years of teaching I can only think of 2 parents who really got my goat. The rest I know just wanted the best for their kids and their questions were warranted.

Ive seen both sides represented on mn. There are some clueless parents. There are some clueless teachers and schools. Thus it is, was and evermore shall be.

Yup! Thus it was, indeed. From the very year dot!

There are good parents and there are bad parents.
There are good teachers and there are bad teachers.

Obviously I'm a good teacher AND a good parent

There are, but parents aren't paid to parent, is the difference :)

YANBU.

Schools can't do anything right. Always a parent to complain.

redexpat I think that is a very accurate description and it made me laugh! I am a teacher and a parent and sometimes I think a bit of empathy in both sides improves the relationship. I am also very lucky that the parents I deal with have been great over the years. I am seriously glad I don't have access to their Facebook page though

My DCs have been in the school system for 5 years now and the expectations of parents amaze me.

I went to a meeting last term where a parent was furious that the head of year 6 wouldn't confirm what trips were planned for the next academic year because if the Y6 trip wasn't going to be to Harry Potter Studios like the past 3 years she would need to 'emotionally prepare' her DD for the disappointment.

I find parents at our school are hugely over invested in their child's every educational experience in a way that my parents never were. I wouldn't be a teacher for anything.

YANBU.

There are, but parents aren't paid to parent, is the difference
They don't have to be qualified either!

No, indeed :)

I think you're right in a sense, but I think it stems from a one size fits all approach to education by the State. I've just moved abroad and my children are now going to a school that molds its education to the child and has a real partnership with each set of parents to try to provide the education that suits the child, the parents and the school. It's such a refreshing change. The teachers aren't parroting lines they don't believe but which reflect national policy, they use their expertise to find individual solutions that suit each child. They're supported by the school in making hard decisions and they discuss with parents what parents are willing and able to do to support their child and can point out how a particular approach/set of interventions/excercise etc. will help that child and partner in making decision with the parents about which to use. It's been brilliant. The teachers are really happy, they have autonomy, support and respect and aren't being held to one set of standards by their bosses and another by parents. The kids are really happy because they aren't getting frustrated with things that don't work for them and conflicting messages and priorities from home and school. And the parents are really happy because educational philosophies and approaches match their own and they feel informed and involved. Total revelation.

The teachers my kids had at their English primary school were great - way more skilled and involved than my own teachers had been - but the school itself was being forced into all sorts of things no body at the school was keen on by the narrows view of education and child welfare embodied in national policy and a cultural obsession with conformity.

Boomboomcousins I'm moving! It sounds great.

FGS.
Primary schools round here have upwards of 700 pupils.
That is potentially 1400 parents (give or take) with opinions.

Of course there is going to be someone who doesn't like something.

It doesn't signal the end of civilisation and it doesn't make teaching the hardest job in the world.
Teaching is a fantastic profession and thank goodness for them.
But if you complain about something at a school it doesn't make you a shit parent and a teacher hater.

I have seen both sides on MN. There are LOADS of threads moaning about entitled parents as well as the loads complaining about schools.
There are truths in most of them and some of them are ridiculous.

Who would want be a teacher?
Who would want to be in most front line public sector jobs and vast swathes of the private/service sector?

On the other hand intravenous parents are expected to be invested in their child's education in a way my parents never were and I wasn't with my eldest two.

Parent consultation meetings for 2 year olds?

A cleaner has a post on here at the moment firmly saying she has expectations and has been cheered along by mumsnet.

Apply those expectations to your child's teacher - forget it

I think what parents tend to forget is that teachers have far less authority and power than they think they might. Usually they HAVE to follow certain policies on behaviour, homework, marking, SN etc., and if they don't they are subject to additional monitoring and eventually disciplinary action. They can't individualise everything, and they are obliged to be consistent in terms of how they deal with different children and situations. I get that as many parents would like to see no homework as would like to see extra homework, for example, but they have to appreciate that teachers generally don't have that discretion.

MNetters (imho) treat/and speak about teachers like dirt. Not all MNetters (naturally), but I see it a lot. It saddens me.