Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To be absolutely disgusted at this? *upsetting*

53 replies

Mulledspicezoflora · 02/12/2016 08:23

www.belfastlive.co.uk/news/family-irish-mum-killed-alongside-12256118

Clodagh Hawe and her three lovely sons were killed by her husband in a murder suicide back in August.

This awful man killed his wife and children in the most horrendous way, because of his own "fall from grace"

Not only that, but he has been buried next to them. so now when Clodagh's family visit the grave, they will be right next to that of the man who murdered their family members

Shocked that that was allowed to happen to be honest

OP posts:
FlappysMammyAndPopeInExile · 02/12/2016 09:38

What they must have suffered is sickening. And the way the media treated this murderous bastard makes him a hero.

I hope that his is exhumed and dumped for the crows. Dandre-buried away from his wife, Clodagh, and those three innocent boys.

NoSunNoMoon · 02/12/2016 09:41

Thanks, Elendon. I suppose I'm struggling to understand why even a controlling bastard could kill his children.

Original poster
Mulledspicezoflora · 02/12/2016 09:41

White, man, good job, sporty, pillar of community

If you fit the above criteria, you too can get loads of sympathy for murdering your family with an axe.

I hear of this sort of thing, and I honestly wonder if there's anything a man won't be excused for

OP posts:
Elendon · 02/12/2016 09:41

From that article you linked to Manhowdy

' Had Alan Hawe murdered a teacher and three pupils in the school in which he taught, there would have been universal outrage. But because he butchered his own wife and kids in the family home, the great and the good tiptoe around his actions. In Irish society in 2016, women and children are still seen as chattels.'

I don't believe it's just Irish society that thinks this. It's pervasive everywhere.

Maudlinmaud · 02/12/2016 09:44

I was thinking of Clodagh and her boys only yesterday, it's such a heartbreaking tale. I think it will stay with people for years.
I am so glad the family are speaking out and being a voice for their daughter. I hope it helps others.

WouldHave · 02/12/2016 12:00

It looks as if it was the priest who pushed the family into agreeing to a joint funeral and Hawe being buried with his victims. Unfortunately that doesn't sound at all surprising.

Cloeycat · 02/12/2016 12:05

This was truly awful and the initial treatment of Clodagh in the media was an actual scandal however it is worth remembering that the parish priest was a family friend and was quite likely also in total shock when he was being consulted about the burial. I think it's easy to forget that just because someone is priest doesn't mean they aren't actually a close personal friend also.

myoriginal3 · 02/12/2016 12:05

What a nightmare. Her family must feel like they have let her down. They only did what they thought best at the time.
I can't believe the extent of influence the church retains in Ireland.
This is a time where your faith should be a source of comfort. NOT influence.

OneFlewOverTheDodosNest · 02/12/2016 12:37

I'm not surprised that the family are now feeling they've made a mistake - when I read it at the time I felt they'd been railroaded into it a bit by expectations and the awful media narrative that kept talking about how sad it was that he'd "snapped" rather than discussing it as the butchery it truly was.

Absolutely awful that this is still happening and excused in 2016.

MySordidCakeSecret · 02/12/2016 12:44

My god how awful Sad

January87 · 02/12/2016 13:23

It was the same a few weeks ago when a man murdered his wife, tried to murder his son then killed himself. Everyone suspected the son, not the father. Another 'pillar of the community'. Buried together too.

EveOnline2016 · 02/12/2016 13:49

Can some point me to a specific piece in the article in which there was a history of Domestic abuse.

I have reread the article but can't find any.

January87 · 02/12/2016 14:01

There was no 'history' of domestic abuse, Clodagh never made anyone aware she was being abused, nor did anyone spot any signs that she was being abused.

AcrossthePond55 · 02/12/2016 14:13

How horrible!

I feel for her family if they are now regretting their decision to have him buried next to Clodagh and her children. I wonder if they could have him moved?

There have been spouse & child murders I can think of here where the wife was buried under her maiden name and the children buried with just their first names on a combined headstone with her. The husbands are on Death Row. One tried to stop the children being buried without his name but a judge overruled it.

NKFell · 02/12/2016 14:34

Absolutely disgraceful. He has no sympathy from me- he had no right to decide his family must die.

FlappysMammyAndPopeInExile · 02/12/2016 16:38

January

No history doesn't mean it didn't happen. Abused women often feel ashamed of what is happening to them, even though it's not their fault. They hide it from friends and family. They become very clever at wearing clothes and make up that will cover any bruises. And friends and family often don't see abuse because they don't want to.

This is especially true were the husband is regarded by all and and sundry as being a "lovely man" who will "do anything for anybody". Attempts to tell people are met with disbelief "Oh - I'm sure it was an accident". "Perhaps he is under stress at work". "and worst of all "What did you say to upset him?" - as though that excuses violence!

And remember abuse isn't necessarily physical: tit can be mental, emotional, financial, or all of these.

Clodagh was described as a very shy person who preferred to stay at home than socialise. there are people like this, but many abused women keep out of the limelight as much as they can, and don't socialise because their husbands very often get angry when the evening is over.

Luckystar1 · 02/12/2016 18:59

I was amazed at the difference in appearance of Clodagh in the picture at her sister's wedding and in the one with the husband and her sons. She seems effervescent in the wedding picture and almost unrecognisably shrinking in the family pic

SantaPleaseBringMeEwanMcGregor · 02/12/2016 19:29

To be fair, Lucky, one appeared to be a casual phone snapshot, while the other was a professional photograph taken on a day when she was especially well done up.

I'm still wondering what, exactly, he was so afraid of that he had to murder his own family. it's heartbreaking. :(

slenderisthenight · 02/12/2016 19:41

I find it hard to believe that anyone could make a 'calm' decision that it was in his family's interests to die and then kill them in such a manner. On the little I know about it, I feel he was either completely unhinged or a person who acted out of deep anger at some level. Either way, his actions were utterly evil.

Amandahugandkisses · 02/12/2016 19:50

Sorry this may be triggering.

The actual murder was sustained, brutal, calculated butchery.
This wasn't - I pushed my wife and she slipped down the stairs in a moment of temper.
I have been disgusted with the reporting of this crime and the minimisation that it was a sadistic act of personal hatred and violence.
I can only think the family were out of their minds at the moment to bury her and the children he butchered with that monster. It was a final act of dismissal for that poor Woman.

SantaPleaseBringMeEwanMcGregor · 02/12/2016 20:09

Amanda, did you actually push your wife and cause her harm, or is that just an example? You may want to clarify before you get unjustly labeled. :D

SantaPleaseBringMeEwanMcGregor · 02/12/2016 20:10

Er, a hypothetical example, that is. Oh, that they'd let us edit our messages.

thisisafakename · 02/12/2016 20:18

Amanda, did you actually push your wife and cause her harm
I would assume that it's just hypothetical. Amanda is probably a woman too (not that that precludes her from having a wife).

It's horrific how this crime was minimised. I remember reading an article which had a statement from the children's school (possibly the same school that the dad was head of). It mentioned how lovely the children were and how lovely the dad was (!) but not a single word about Clodagh. If her children attended the school, they must have known her.

To have a joint funeral and bury them together is sickening. I hope his body is exhumed (I would want it thrown on a garbage-fire, but I guess re-burying it elsewhere is more realistic). I doubt very much that this was a one off moment of madness. Normal people don't snap like that. They tried to fight him off, they had defensive wounds. That monster murdered them in cold blood and knew precisely what he was doing. I bet you anything he was an abusive bastard behind closed doors and had been for years. Bollocks to the perfect husband portrayal.

FlappysMammyAndPopeInExile · 02/12/2016 20:50

I bet you anything he was an abusive bastard behind closed doors and had been for years. Bollocks to the perfect husband portrayal.

That's what I think, FakeName.

To me this is the act of a controlling, narcissistic man who realises that his "image" is going to be tarnished in some way (his "fall from grace"). He preferred to die rather than face the music. And he was determined not to relinquish control over his family - so he butchered them, in cold blood. It can't have been quick. He murdered four people who were fighting for their lives and or trying to escape or hide from him. Clodagh's wounds also showed that she had been trying desperately to defend her children. He was angry and he was selfish and he was a brute, and he slaughtered them. I do not believe that this was an isolated incident - I think he was a domestic bully who didn't want the truth to come out.

AcrossthePond55 · 02/12/2016 21:00

I think that one of the reasons that something like this is (wrongly!) minimized is that this type of murder tears at our worst fears. It brings up things about us as 'civilized nations' that rattles us. We all want to believe that 'this could never happen' in a civilized country like the UK or US. We don't want to confront the fact that evil exists and not much can be done to 'fix' evil. And that it exists at times very close to us. And so we'd rather minimize, say this person is 'sick', or 'snapped', or try to put the victim 'away' from us by diminishing their importance. Anything rather than to have to admit that evil walks among us.

The likelihood of something this horrific actually happening to one of us, or to someone we love, is extremely miniscule. But it does happen and when it does happen to someone we know we are forever changed. The blinders are removed and you see the world as a bit of a darker place.

Swipe left for the next trending thread