The reason young people can't afford to buy houses

[GrabtharsHammer]

Is because they all have iPhones and Sky telly.

So sayeth my mother.

Nothing at all to do with the ridiculous house prices then? They are baby boomers and bought their first house for a few thousand quid on my dads modest salary.

Apparently the youth of today just need to get rid of their gadgets and telly subscriptions and then they will easily afford a deposit and mortgage.

Are everyone's parents this judgemental and out of touch or am I just particularly lucky?

(Fairly lighthearted) AIBU?

Wrong side of Bradford I'm afraid. I'm already 45 minutes from my parents as it is. We actually have our eye on 3 properties at the moment (a 3 bed semi and 2 3 bed terraces) that are around the £125,000-130,000 mark. We've viewed so many properties over the past few months. Its such a stressful process but ultimately worth it. I'm very very lucky that I met dp who was already on the ladder so it is somewhat easier.
Thanks for the suggestions though.

I grew up in Belle Isle and went to school in Rothwell. We left in 1999... It was a shit hole back then (belle isle that is) is it still hideously awful.

expat I totally agree with you. Also, from the perspective of being a manager, I want employees who are responsible. My best employees do not live with their parents. Actually the ones who do are unable to cope when the pressure starts building. They are used to having their parents do everything for them. It is horribly unhealthy and it creates a substantial disadvantage to those from lower income homes further reducing social mobility.

My own father, in his wisdom, kicked us out at 18. It was really tough and I won't be doing the same to my children until they have finished their education, but it really was the making of me. I had to hustle and figure stuff out. My upbringing was extremely privileged on the surface so I was immune from poverty. I managed to save to buy a place by working 3 jobs while I saw a few of my friends from school have places given to them, or their parents gave them the required deposit.

Today I see the financial future of my friends who had parental help and those who didn't. Only two of us who didn't have parental help are financially able to support ourselves now and in the future. None of the others are saving for their pension and about 50% own. Those who had parents support them in buying a home are all financially sound except one who is a wreck (but her parents have enough money to bail her out and continue to do so).

One thing I notice round my way is there are a lot of terraces, mostly built to accomodate mill workers and their families. They mostly have a small yard out back rather than a garden yet can be huge inside. Interesting how priorities were clearly very different back when they were built. I imagine the large size was ro accommodate more than one family.

frikadela I live in North Jersey, USA in a row house. It was built to accommodate a family on each floor. The family who owned it from when it was built in 1890 to 1990 told me that his great grandmother used to rent the rooms out so at certain times there were 2-3 families living on each floor. The over crowding must have been horrendous!

I like Bradfor as well as Halifax and as we haver relatives in Yorkshire on both sides know loads of people who live in that area and then commute for work to the fairly near by cities for work and yes commuting is awful, I've done it on and off for 30 years - it's an hour from here into London usually but it's life for most of us. My relative who bought in Yorkshire (as it's cheaper) and commutes down to London for work only does it about once every two weeks and yes it's awful - they have 4am starts and that kind of thing but it's what some of us have to tolerate in order to buy a home.

The idea you ahve to do places up makes older peoplel laugh I'm afraid. We used every penny of savings including children's savings to buy this house and didn't have £20 left to do anything like buy a new chair. My house has the stuff put into it like kitchens and bathrooms from when it was built. Since when did people think they should have some right to do places up?

Anyway I think we all agree that in some areas prices are easier than others; that things are easier today than many of our ancestors (in 1901 my grandfather who left school at 12 was living in a boardi9ng house with 26 other young men in Newcastle - as shown on the 1901 census records); that current things are particularly hard compared with say the 80s (although not the 90s property crash when I sold my house at a loss, a real loss in London by the way); and that we need to build more cheaper homes to rent to people.

frik, also large families. My father's father was one of about 10 or 11 and the same on my mother's side too. (She had 52 first cousins) Then the next generation used and had access to good contraception and family size shrunk. If you've got 10 children it's no wonder you want them to leave as young as possible to go into service or to marry.

at "I like Bradford". You don't have to live here. I fucking hate it. It was voted the worst place to live in the UK last year. But as you say these are the sacrifices we make.

Bloody hell, there is nothing wrong with that 40k property in Halifax. An ordinary terraced house.

It's the older people who are saying you should do a house up, that you should buy a wheely bin 'do it up' like they did.

I also don't think posting random 30k houses and being like SEE their is NO problem because this one house in consett is 30k and with zero knowledge about the area or how much structural work needs doing to the property im going to suggest that all young people move into it.

My mother works in a mining village where houses go for about 40k, it's genuinely horrendous, there's so much crime and gangs of young men literally roam the street harrasing people. My mothers house has not risen in value since she bought it and she's been trying to sell for about 8 years, she's desperate but can't move. Her village has one shop and the bus to town in £6.80 and only comes once a day, I grew up there as a teenager and wouldn't wish it on anyone.
These houses are usually cheap for a reason.

Re doing up maxwell - my recollection is that lots of 80s ftbs did do up places, and i mean really do up in the sense that they were not really very habitable at the start. Not just 'new kitchen' but sorting out dry rot, roofs, replasterin, rewiring and so on. Funded by phased mortgage draw downs, contingent on the work being done.
However. One difference was that these tended to be couples in their twenties, with no dc. I think once you have dc it is much harder to live in a house while doing it up, and potentially quite dangerous. Also the house in london/se costs so much that you don't have the money to do it up, and i'm not sure if mortgage lenders even do that contingent lending any more!

Also there are no jobs there. There isn't a hospital or shops or anything for miles around. The village was designed to support the Pitt and when that closed there was nothing. There is a crisps factory about three miles away but it's tiny. If you haven't got a car you are screwed.
It's just completely unrealistic to expect people to move there.

Ciutadella, my reply was to Enormous who was saying that older people were laughing at younger people who were wanting to 'do up houses' when no younger person has sugessted it, it's been the older people saying that younger people just have too high expectations and should just get a shithole and do it up.

Let's also not forget that a lot of "doer uppers" get snapped up by property developers. The 2 estate agents we've had round to our house (needs a bit of work but is livable straight away) have said that they have developers on their books who would snap it up before it even went to open market. Lucky for us, lucky for them, not so lucky for the first time.buyer that this house would be perfect for.

I meant to say my mother lives not works in a mining village.

I posted several pages back that where I live most of the large bungalows are owned by property developers or estate agents. They have gambled on the occupants not living too long, I suppose! A jerry-built bungalow on an acre of land can support a new build mansion monstrosity with associated profit. The young carpenter who did some work for me said that he and his fiancee were desperate for a do-er upper but even small terraced houses like that do not come onto the market.

I agree that it's ridiculous people linking to houses for 15p in Wherever. If the place is in any way desirable - location/job opps/attractiveness - then there is no way the houses would be affordable.

I often muse on the number of holiday properties available and think it is amoral. Look at any site - Sykes/OwnersDirect etc etc and there are thousands of homes which are just investments. But if renting out a holiday cottage were outlawed tomorrow, how would that help the local communities? There would be cheaper property to buy in, say, Fowey, but no fishing industry is going to magically spring up.

Yes, even if you can actually get a doer upper, they're in no way a more accessible option. Because you then need resources. Be that time, access to skill, capital, people who'll let you use the facilities of their home, the ability to borrow more in order to fund the work. I think it's also quite important to spell out here that when we're talking about places cheap and needy enough to qualify as doer uppers, we are not talking expenditure of the £20 on a new chair level...

Yes - I can only imagine with horror dh being let loose on a do-er upper. He once put up a curtain pole and the fruity language could be heard ten miles away. Plus it fell down, taking half the wall with it.

If you are not handy, then workmen cost a flippin' fortune. And, of course, the better the area the more expensive labour is. If you have access to mates' rates/family know-how etc etc, then you're lucky. But for the rest of us a do-er upper would likely be a horrendous money pit.

But if renting out a holiday cottage were outlawed tomorrow, how would that help the local communities? There would be cheaper property to buy in, say, Fowey, but no fishing industry is going to magically spring up.

Worse than that, Rhoda. All the existing hospitality and leisure businesses which rely on tourists will go to the wall.

The only way in which we will solve the affordability issue is housebuilding on a vast scale the likes of which have never been seen before, and NIMBYs be damned.

But the politicians are also often NIMBYS

I think doer uppers are feasible depending on the level of work required. Something that needs a new roof, new wiring, heating, new Windows etc isn't feasible for a FTB as the work would be horrendously expensive and require the employment of specialist tradesmen. However, if we are just talking about a new kitchen, new bathroom suite and general decor then I think most FTB could manage that, especially if the current facilities are serviceable but just ugly and in need of updating.

Mmm, but if the only work that might be considered necessary is cosmetic, that tends to be reflected in the price. I wouldn't really consider something with dated but perfectly adequate facilities and decor to be a doer upper. At least not in the sense that people who advocate them as a solution to even small homes being many times average young people's salary in most areas of the country mean. Ie, being significantly cheaper.

I agree with that hyacinth. I suppose what I was thinking was that totally modernised freshly renovated properties usually attract a premium price and sell quickly. Those that are dated but serviceable usually have the dated aspect reflected in the price and are not attractive to serious developers so might be an option for the FTB to get something £10k- £20k cheaper than the newly modernised property and then modernise it themselves as and when they can.

Say there's no jobs in an area .... Well as somebody whomumsnets works from home I would suggest that's going to be less relevant in the future.

It is if your skillset is amenable to that. I'm very much an advocate of more remote working, it's better for the environment and everyone's quality of life for fewer people to be forced to travel for work, as well as reducing the pressure on housing stock in popular areas. We could and should do much more of it. However, even I would have to admit that there are quite a lot of jobs requiring one to be physically present. If you don't have qualifications and experience in something that can be done remotely, you'll struggle.

We bought at the absolute extreme top of our budget a small house that needed doing up. We then took out a £10k loan to put heating and electrics in (the electrics had only two ply wiring and were not earthed).

The bathroom and the kitchen were at least 40 years old and got done by stealth - the toilet broke so we absolutely had to get a new one. The kitchen flooded and became unusable.

Ten years later - it's less of a hovel but it still needs about £40k spending on it. The windows are on the verge of falling out. We are older now and finding it much harder to get work. So we are trying to sell it on and move back into rented.

I think it only really works if you have the money to do it up or are likely to in the future. Otherwise you just end up living in a hovel.