To not invite this girl round again?

[WinterIsHereJon]

BIL's DP has a DD aged four. She's a nightmare; stroppy, whinges constantly, loses her temper when not getting her own way. Some of it normal for her age, but she's noticeably more difficult than any child I've known at that age. No discipline from her mum, even when she has hit my dcs, broken things etc.

A few weeks ago we invited BIL and his partner for dinner. Evening invitation, didn't mention the child. Our DCs were staying with grandparents. When they arrived, the little girl was with them, in her PJs. Crossed wires possibly, but they were obviously hoping she would end up staying over. She ran riot and unchecked throughout the house for hours. She then through a tantrum as she was leaving and deliberately kicked my dog in the face. I shouted, in shock more than anything, her mum just told her that was unkind and to apologise to the dog they left soon afterwards.

I was furious! Thankfully the dog is as soft as they come and just wandered off to bed looking confused, but that is pure luck and there are no guarantees she couldn't snap. Had she bitten this girl I have no doubt they'd have demanded she was PTS, and I'd have been forced to rehome her. DP and I agreed that we would not have them over again unless things improved with her behaviour.

Since this, MIL has invited them to join us on Christmas Day without asking me first. They are all basically making out that it's me being precious over the dog rather than taking any responsibility for her behaviour, and suggested I send the dog to my mums "if that's the issue". It isn't!! I sense a big family fall out will ensue but just wanted to check whether IABU before making a fuss!

Yorkiesglasses - As long as you aren't saying that challenging behaviour cannot be due to sn.

YANBU.
I think the message to MIL needs to come from your DH: that it's not just about the dog, it's about the way this child behaves towards your DC (and their toys) and it's not up to MIL to invite people to your house EVER.

TBH any child that kicked a dog in my house would get a sharp reprimand, and I'd probably have a word with the parents too. But then I am older than I used to be and have run out of fucks to give.

I think that MIL needs to be told that they are not welome & if she wants to "keep them on side" & host them then that's fine.

I wouldn't have them for Christmas , you'd be on edge , your children don't like her and there's the risk of hurting your dog
Your MIL needs to tell them

Difficult it being Christmas you don't want to exclude and cause lasting offence, but likewise you want to preserve a nice day for you and your family, including the dog.
Your mil was out of line extending an invitation to your house in the first place, that needs dealing with by your dh.

If you decide that to keep the peace they can come after all a stern discussion with bil and sil needs to happen. Tell them you won't tolerate your dc's things being broken, people and animals being hurt and seriously bad behaviour. One warning and then that's it, they will be asked to leave. Any lashing out to the dog will result in them having to go immediately. I am zero tolerance for this kind of behaviour, I never tolerated it from my own child and I won't from anyone else's.
The child is 4, perfectly able to understand that the rules at Aunty and Uncles house are thus and if they want to stay and have a nice time they tow the line. The parents need to be on board though.

"Parents of kids allowed to run wild unchecked never respond well to someone else doing their parenting for them."

Tough. You ask them first to discipline their child and if they don't you do it. I think the idea of asking MIL to tell, not ask BIL and his partner to keep the child under control is a good one.

The problem with that, Rumptof, is that at the point where they're forcibly ejected from the premises - the day is already ruined...

I'd say no, the child is a pita either way.

It's your house, you can say no. If you it this time it makes it easier next year.

"Hi MIL, we don't have the room for additional guests this Christmas otherwise we'd have extended the guest list ourselves.
Also to be honest BIL's SD is more than I feel able to handle on Christmas day so we're not comfortable with this change either.
Will leave it to you to rearrange.
All the best, Winter."

I wouldn't put money on the new baby being disciplined much either,

I'm not sure I'd put money on the new baby being safe!

I'd tell your MIL not to worry and to avoid any further complications she can hold Xmas at hers with BIL et al, and you will have it at home with your family.

Even if you manage to argue the toss and uninvite these people, I think there is a fair chance you will end up with a sob story on Xmas Day if MIL comes to yours.

I feel sorry for the little girl though. It's not her fault that she has been taught badly. But it is a good plan to keep her away from the dog.

I'd just be up front, the child is not safe around our dog so it wouldn't work to have them both here again.

Who cares if they think you are being precious, it just shows how off the mark they are when it comes to animals and children. You need to protect your dog from a situation that could get it pts.

Hell no. No one invites anyone to my home without my permission. I would be fuming and would make that known.

Example: hi Mil. I am very unhappy that you thought it was appropriate to invite bil et al. to our home without asking. We do not want child here due to her appalling behaviour in the past when visiting. I am not happy to let our Christmas be ruined as sil and bil are unable to control her. If you want to spend Christmas with them you will need to go to their house.'

I would be so angry!!

I'm genuinely surprised at the suggestions to ask MIL to tell them this or that - does anyone really think that someone so lacking in insight is likely to say anything at all?

The same principle applies to "bargaining" with DB and his partner over the child's behaviour; is it really likely to make any difference to someone who'll willingly allow their child to behave like this and then blame others?

It's not even as if OP has some abstract worry which might never happen; the child's already run riot and already attacked the dog, and MIL has already seen fit to issue invitations which aren't hers to give

Time, surely, for some decisive action?

How big of a bash is the Christmas hosted at OP's house? If only not-resident person invited was MIL, then fine to exclude the BIL+others. But if every other relative is welcome meaning many guests but not the BIL+his lot... I'm starting to take MIL's side. The dog could be shut up for a few hours if required. The girl is difficult but still just a 4yo. I'm not saying that's fair to dog, but it would be the price of volunteering to host a big diverse group.

MIL can be tasked to keep an eye on the wild child during the whole event.

ps: if it is a big event as implied, and OP stood her ground... if I were MIL I might vote with my feet & not come at all that day. You need to be ready for unexpected responses.

I would go with StormWhale's response - it is very to the point and gets the message over very well.

Your MIL does not invite people to you house without your permission.

You and your children have a right to enjoy your Christmas - I'm sure this little girl will have a nice Christmas if it just her and her parents at home (in fact maybe being at others houses is one of the things that stresses or over excites her)

Your dog has a right to enjoy Christmas with her family - not shoved into another house to accomodate a badly behaved child. Anyone who kicked my dog would not be coming back to my home. Even the most lovely natured dog will react if they are hurt. You need to protect your dog and of course the child who is doing the kicking - because she may well end up being hurt.

So I would make it a very definite 'NO' this year. But I wouldn't close the door on them for ever - a child's behaviour can change as they mature - she may grow into a much calmer child, that you would be happy to have in your home - it sounds as if she has had a few disruptions on her life and the coming baby may be making her behaviour worse.

But saying 'she doesn't seem to be able to cope with being here and her parents seem unable to control her behaviour, so this year it's a pass' is quite fair IMO.

I agree with FloggingMolly too. Anyone who talks about 'taking the child's behaviour into my own hands' has clearly never dealt with someone like my sister. BTW, I'm nobody's wimp.

No discipline from her mum, even when she has hit my dcs, broken things etc.

It's not just about the child's violence to the poor dog. She hits the op's children too, and this needs to be addressed - especially with a new baby on the way. It is unfortunate that the issue is seen to revolve around the dog, when the SC's behaviour is so bad across the board.

I would be telling MIL/BIL that until the SD learns to behave herself, she is no longer welcome in your home. Your rude MIL needs to wind her neck in about issuing invitations to someone else's home.

I wouldn't be putting my dog in kennels at Christmas to accommodate somebody that I hadn't even invited. Unless Jesus arrived, obvs.

The thing is, even if bil and his DP did get on board with monitoring and correcting the child's behaviour whilst they are at op's house, it is very unlikely that a child who hasn't previously been given the tools to manage their behaviour will suddenly find themselves able to do so on what is likely to be a long, over-exciting, over-stimulating day - particularly when she will have been taken away from her home and presents and seeing your DC with all their presents around them. It sounds like a recipe for disaster - not the kid's fault at all, of course, but apt to be pretty shit for all involved.

If they've been together for less than a year, it does seem a bit sudden for the wee girl to have a whole 'new' family to deal with, particularly with a new baby on the way which may have thrown up all sorts of feelings for her. This is the case regardless of how lovely the 'new' family is.

I think you're absolutely right to say no to this one. It's not good for you, the dog, or the child.

Before you potentially start a family fall out, would you be happy if it was just BIL and his DP going?

Is there any possibility that the little girl is going to her dads on Christmas Day? Do you know she is definitely going to be with her mother?

I would possibly try to find out first (somehow) before saying anything.

If she is going to be with her mother and you really don't want her there, then you will just have to let them know that you can't host an extra 3 people this year.

Good luck OP!

First of all, WTAF is your MIL thinking inviting people to YOUR house?! Please tell me she's been kicked into touch about that.

Second, I'd say to the parents that this child will not be coming round again until the parents agree to stop her from running around your house unchecked and hurting the dog. Point out that this is for the child's safety as well as the dog's welfare.

definitely needs to be discussed and boundaries set out to mil- by dh, or together to show united front.

also to have a seperate discussion with the girl's mum about wanting to accept her and her daughter into the family and to achieve this the need for behaviour boundaries to keep all the children safe and happy-

ask her mum what she thinks sets her child off and if there is some way to help her parenting -

what is she like at nursery/school? she needs to be preparing her to behave well at school or her daughter will be unhappy

that said, it sounds like you are facing a tricky situation made even more sensitive by the Christmas factor wishing you good luck, for you and a doggy for your ddog