AIBU to not grasp some kinds of grief?

[lizzieoak]

I'm curious about what upsets people when famous people die? As an example, I was a massive fan of Amy Winehouse & I was sad when she died. Primarily thought "oh, how sad for her poor family" & a little bit thought (& still think) "how sad for people who loved her writing & voice that it's all ended so soon."

But, horrible monster that I am, I didn't cry, as I didn't know her personally and, sadly, it was hardly a huge surprise. Ditto the death of our treasured Mr Cohen. He was 82.

On the non-famous end, while I was sad when my dad died when I was in my 20's, I thought "well, today I'm sad, but in a year I bet days will pass when I don't even think of dad". A friend of mine had a parent die around the same age and he spends the whole month, every year, 30 years later, being Quite Upset. Slight difference in the manner of our parent's deaths as my dad had been sick on & off since I was a kid whereas my friend's mum died of cancer within a year of getting ill.

I totally grasp that a loss of a child could destroy a person. It's out of the natural order of things. And the loss of a spouse - I can see how that could be pretty devastating.

But I worry a bit that I feel sad but not grief-stricken about the loss of people I love (older adult family members thus far) & people whose work I've admired.

Is it just that I'm a cold fish in this regard? Can anyone upended by the death of an elderly person, or Princess Diana, explain to me ... well, just what it is they're upset about?

Hard to convey tone online sometimes, but I'm not being sarkie, I really don't grasp this (though am otherwise emotionally normal).

Anecdotally, my male friends seem more thrown by the death of elderly rellies, whereas women seem more emotional than men are by the death of famous people. Not necessarily true across society, but in my circle I've noticed this.

I cried so hard after my cat died 2 years ago that I gave myself gastritis and lost 2 stone! Have only put 1/2 stone back on too. If I think of him I still get tears in my eyes and this despite getting another cat a few months later.

I lost my mum and then my dad 16 weeks later and outwardly was calm and did not cry too much to protect my kids (they were 5 &12 at the time)and because my sister and brother went to pieces so someone had to keep it together! but when on my own have sobbed. I cry at films, news feeds, long lost family etc. I have also blubbed loads when any of my cats/dogs have died. They are such a big part of my families lives that we get very attached to them and so when something happens to them it is like losing a family memeber to us and they are not "just a pet". I don't think there is anything wrong with not crying or crying loads its just how people are, different! 11 years on from death of myn parents though I suffered from stress and this was linked back to then so maybe rather than hold it in I should have cried like I did when my cat was pts after an rta!!??

Excellent post LizzieOak

I find grief very confusing - my own grief. I am know for crying very easily and strongly over songs, music, films, the news - lots of things. I can't control it. I sad and cried during the first episode of the new Walking Dead series - properly crying. I call it my 'safe crying' and sometimes I really enjoy a good cry - I'll put some songs on so that I can have a good cry sometimes.

Real life - very different reactions, When family members have died - very close aunt, beloved grandmother and then much loved grandfather - I was very freaked out that I didn't cry. I was extremely upset but it didn't seem 'real' to me. Even at their funerals, I was detached. But then years later a song or a smell or something banal would happen and trigger a feeling/memory and I would break down inconsolably - like a delayed reaction.

My dad died 3 years ago quite suddenly (we had 3 days to get our heads round it) and I was again completely detached. I found it extremely hard to leave his hospital room (my brother had to physically remove me) but I didn't cry or anything. At his funeral everyone kept saying I was so brave and strong and I was almost ashamed because I knew I wasn't - I was 'nothing'. And I was in this state for the next 6 months but in private with my family I was able to cry out my grief (still do now).

And after that long intro - the point I actually want to make is that when David Bowie died, I was hysterical. The first few weeks I ignored it, and then my husband brought my phone and headphones to me in bed one sunday morning (2 weeks after he died and after I'd had delivery of his latest album) and said I should listen to it and I was hysterical - guttural cries and noises that I'd never heard or made before. I actually lost my voice! I think I cried for nearly and hour - my DD came and lay with me.

Afterwards I was so confused but realised when I reflected on it that it was 'safe' to lose it as I don't know him really - he's not a 'real' part of my life. I've been a fan since I was 8. His music got me through some very tough times. His music has been with me always. It gives me joy, happiness etc.

Like most have said - we all deal with grief in our own way and I think maybe we all sometimes worry and don't understand our feelings. I used to think there was something wrong with me to not feel this grief that I could see around me when people died but now I have accepted that it's part of my 'control freak' character. It's probably a subconscious switch that won't allow me to lose it when the pain is raw just in case I can't come back from it. I can see it's ridiculous when I write that or say it out loud!

Great discussion

I think it has so much to do with the age someone is when they die.

My ddad died at 81. He was a smoker for most of his life and died of lung cancer. He had had another kind of cancer at the age of 49 and was very lucky to survive that (had a pioneering op, ground- breaking treatment etc). So he had 30 cancer free years and then died in his early 80s.

I was sad and thought about him a lot for perhaps 6 months. But after that ... not so much! Seriously. Whereas my step mother, who is very much younger, is still suffering terrible grief after 5 years. But I do look at it from the outside and wonder what she expected?

I have been thinking about celebrity death reactions a lot this year due to being in tears over Bowie and Cohen (but just a wee bit sad about Prince who was my big teenage crush). I lost my dad when I was 26 (cancer, long decline, time to prepare) and I think for me Bowie , Cohen and Lou Reed were father substitutes in a way - they were a generation older and wrote songs about stages in life I didn't get to share with my dad. Just to list a few examples - Bowie's Kooks when I had my son, Reed's Ecstasy Album during my relationship breakdown and Cohen's If it be your will when life's dreams are just are not going to plan. Now they are all "gone" as opposed to "out there somewhere" I feel bereft and strangely re-orphaned. Am I mourning for them or for all the things I missed sharing with my father ? Mostly the latter , with the celebrity death acting as a cathartic focus for a much needed cry whilst watching youtube.

I've bottled up emotions very well and to my complete detriment. It's very unhealthy. I'll cry at the news, sad stories, even ridiculously sentimental films, but close tragedies are overwhelming and harder to deal with. I'm not a wailer, never have been. I think it's healthy though to openly cry when sad, holding it all in, that isn't healthy.

Some people are more emotional than others - I found my dad's passing so hard and it was 21 years ago - my mum still cries often because she misses him so much and is so lonely without him ... it doesn't go away, it just changes over time I suppose - I miss him terribly still but can cope more than her because I have people in my house and she doesn't. I personally can't understand people who don't cry when someone really close passes - a dear aunt and uncle passed away really close together not long back and my cousin cried for a day and then seemed to take it in her stride ... I put this down to her being on anti depressants because I think some people who are lose the ability to 'feel' anything. Our hamster passed the other month and I was heartbroken. When celebrities pass, it depends who it is and in which circumstances - I can feel extremely sad if watching/listening to that person brings back fond memories where I feel like they have been a part of my life and I have 'known' them in a way. I am very emotional though and very empathetic with others.

mammamic I hope I got your name right. You and I sound very similar emotionally, you described me very well.

I'm exactly the same op. Can't understand why people get upset on anniversaries of the deaths of family. Surely you miss and think about them all the year round? But I know I'm unusual.

It can depend on your own circumstances. I was completely cut up when my 84 year old mother died, but it was less than 6 weeks after my DP had been diagnosed with what turned out to be terminal cancer, and I was a bit emotional all round. We missed the funeral too, because of a broken down train, and as a result (stuck in a field in the Midlands for three hours) nearly missed DP's second bout of chemo as well.

Missed DP terribly, but four years of alcohol abuse saw me through that, plus recognising the absurdity of life.

Some people have referred to not crying as somehow letting down the deceased. I don't see it that way as for some people they may not be crying because they are overwhelmed, the shock is too much, the deceased was very old and ill & it's a relief to see them out of pain. Not crying does not mean not feeling. And some of us just process that final life stage in a logical-thought-process way. Which is not to say we lack empathy. I feel I'm very empathetic, but this manifests in reading people well & going to a lot of trouble to avoid offence. So I take mild objection to the idea that tears = more empathy. Most people die when they're old and they've had good innings so it's not like they're missing much - I'm not sure I understand where empathy comes into play there? Not if you're immediate family that is.

Companyofcats, I went back to work within days of my mum dying. Partly because she was very old & had had dementia for years so the mum I knew had long since gone, and partly because I didn't see that staying at home was going to help anything. Also my worksite were complete dicks and I didn't feel like having to justify it to them.

I did feel people expected me to be distraught, & didn't quite know how to deal w me being more matter of fact about it. She was in her 90's, I'd spent years taking care of all her practicalities in terms of dr & dental care, paying bills, moving her to various levels of care etc, while siblings sat on their hands and then criticized that I wasn't upset enough for their metrics. That seriously annoyed me. If you're not going to help w elder care, then you need to be quiet. Heard this from friends who've had lazy sibs dictating their emotions. But that's another thread!

Grief is a funny thing. It effects people in different ways at different times. I really don't believe there is a right or wrong way to feel. When my mother died aged 58 it took me a couple of months to really cry. When I did i grieved for the future I had planned out, but would now not happen rather than for her. She had been very ill for some years and was in terrible pain. In many ways her death was a relief. When my nan died only a few months later she was elderly and it was no surprise, but I cried for my father as he had lost a wife and a mother in a very short space of time and I hated seeing him hurt.

There are only 2 celebrities I can think of I can say I was genuinely upset about dieing. They were both people who I feel made the world a better place by being in it and I feel their voices and wisdom are a great loss. For most celebrities I feel the same as I would upon reading about the death of anyone in the paper I don't know.

I'm the same and often wondered if I'm normal or not. In general I'm the most sensitive person I know and cry at the drop of a hat. If I read a tragic story in the news that involves a husband or children dying, I'm in pieces. If I think about anything happening to my husband or children, I'm a wreck. However if someone is older or I don't have contact with them every day, I seem to be emotionless.
I think the crux of it is that if I can relate to and imagine if that was my husband or children, it upsets me. I think I'm more upset for the people grieving and imagining what they're going through rather than the death itself. I think even when my parents go I will be fine as they've had a great life and we all die at some point. However if it was my DH, kids or sister I couldn't cope.
For me it's about the 'fairness' of the death too. If I think you had a great life, there was no tragedy, it seems more OK.

Tears and grief are different things. I cry at the drop of a hat, but real grief, real mourning, are different.

I cried when we had our cat pts, but got over it quite fast: I was sad about the cat but it wasn't mourning. On the other hand I don't shed many tears anymore for my DM who died decades ago, but one morning in the summer I was getting ready in the bathroom and, entirely out of the blue, I was completely poleaxed by grief for her for a couple of minutes. So I suppose that I am still mourning her.

When my father died, I only cried because I was thinking about my mother (my father and I did not get on). You can't invent grief: you either feel it, or you don't. I feel (and felt) more grief for a lovely old cousin who died a few years back, who was quite a father figure to me, than I ever felt for my father.

For me it depends on how I was already feeling before I heard the news when feeling upset about famous people. I was very sad about Bowie and Lemmy, music heroes to me. But in a short space of time 3 months) 3 people I knew died too. Not close friends but old friends, all too young to die & all unexpected.
I don't go to funerals unless it's family. I get very emotional, just the thought of someone I love dying makes me cry!

In the same vein I cry at weddings too! The video of my aunties wedding all you can hear is me crying!
If you met me socially you wouldn't know I'm soppy, I do everything I can not to show weakness in public 🙁

I agree, there's no right or wrong way, I think it's involuntary for most of us. I remember watching Bowie videos on TV and I started sobbing when Heroes came on, which took me by surprise. I can be a bit of a crier, but not for long and I hate people seeing me cry. I sobbed for about 30 minutes when my gran died and I did the same when our old cat died, in fact I probably cried a bit more for the cat than I did for my gran.

But I cried when my BIL died, even though we weren't close. I liked him but we had a strained relationship, so I can't explain it. I didn't want to cry, I wanted to be strong for DH. I can only put it down to empathy for the family, their grief broke my heart.

I'd say, OP, your logical side is more in the driving seat than your emotional one.
With enough imagination, which is what empathy is, really, we can see the tragedy in any death and be sad about it.
Some deaths need more imaginative power to empathise with than others. The death of someone we didn't know, the death of someone we didn't like. Some are obvious and easy, the death of someone young we did know, the death of someone good.

Abernathy, in regard to death, yes, I do come over all logical. When it comes to romance though ... fool for love :(

Crying at Heroes is natural. That song makes me tear up as (to me) it's very much about being in your 20's and thinking love and belief will carry the day & that the wall can come down. It makes me cry for all the lovely beliefs that I've lost.

I cried buckets when my daughter's hamster died but not a tear when either of my parents died.

Lizzie, that must have been very hard and I understand what you are saying. It really fucks me off that people who have been in your situation have to be concerned about work being dicks about the situation. I wish that people and organisations had a little more humanity. [Sad]

To the earlier poster who mentioned the trend to be 'jolly' at funerals. I've noticed that too and I find it really hard to deal with. The whole 'let's wear colourful clothes and listen to happy music because it's what he would have wanted!' thing. I totally, totally understand the impulse but it does make me feel pressured into not making a fool of myself by crying (at a funeral!)

The last funeral I was at, Pharell Williams' 'Happy' was played in the church and we were all instructed to wear yellow. I kid you not.

The funeral before that, everybody dressed up in colourful clothes and all the children in fancy dress. It was a bit disconcerting (to me) to see little kids dressed up as fairies and superheroes at a funeral.

What does everybody else think of this?

OP, you sound like my DH, who is one of the most well balanced and sweet natured people I know. He has lost his mum and very close friend and was extremely sad both times, but was back working and, at times, enjoying small things after a couple of weeks. He is still waiting for the 'real' grief to hit him many years later! I put it down to him being a chronically happy person who can't help but enjoy life, even when it's shit.

As a very slight disclaimer, but not excuse, I have lost a child among other tragic losses, & I do find it OTT when people go batshit over the death of their cat, for example - I think they are a bit shallow & cossetted. But I would never, ever, let anyone know that except on the privacy of a forum. And know I will be vilely judged for this)

I didn't cry at all when my mother died. I wept when my lovely cat died on Christmas day 2 years ago.