To wonder if women have really achieved any level of equality or is most of it just lip service!

[AquaAqua]

I just wonder this as at times I feel inequality is so ingrained in society that regardless of how much we move forwards women still have a tougher time. I am an academic, I am equally and in many cases more well published than my male counterparts, experienced, run a number of high profile projects and have never taken time off sick. However I was recently passed over for promotion in favour or a less experienced and less published male and one of the reasons given (the main one really) was it was felt I lacked commitment. In conversations I have been told part of this was about I have children, I may have more and it was felt I wouldn't give the same commitment as the other colleague as I will always prioritize my children. All the senior academics in this department are male, and though they will engage with me it is quite often in a very patriarchal way - I was recently asked if I would bake the cakes for another colleagues meal for example - I've never brought in cakes etc was just assumed I would. This was matched with a few things happening in the week where school, nursery and doctors all contacted me regarding our children even though DH is first contact and does school runs etc. In one case they phoned me after DH had collected Ds from school, as they felt it was best to talk to 'mum' about an incident where another boy had hit Ds. This finished off with a comment from DMil today about the fact we have just got a cleaner to help me out - no mention of DH, just the comment that I needed a cleaner as I couldn't do my work and keep the house right! Must say DH is superb, but gets equally frustrated how some people cut him out of the process with the children and bypass him for me. Sorry just a general rant - I'm annoyed about work and now as a result feel I see sexism everywhere!

Worldwide, women are in no way equal to men.

In the U.K.? Nearer equal than in some places but we still live in a patriarchal society and are subject to sexism from many angles.

I think we have come a long way. But it's not yet equality.

I haven't suffered at work. I actually get paid more than my male counterparts. Because I negotiated. I have never been asked to bake cakes etc or given 'women's work'. In fact I think most of my colleagues would find this ridiculous.

Why I do come across low level, everyday sexism I challenge it. Mil told me I was lucky to have a dh who does so much with the kids and around the house. I pointed out that, that would mean he should be grateful that I went to work and shared the financial burden. Dh then jumped and pointed out that it was his house and children too and told her I didn't have anything to be grateful for.

When school called me instead of dh, I asked them why as he is first contact. When they called me to say another mum was worried as she hadn't seen me on the school run for a while (I had finished mat leave and gone back to work so dh was doing the school run) I asked if they did welfare checks on the fathers that never did school runs.

In future I would like to see just as many men give up work to look after kids as women do. That will reduce the perception that women of child baring age are a risk compared to men. I would like more men sharing mat leave, taking time off sick when kids are ill.

But also I would like to see more women being willing to do this too. In 15 years of managing people and in ny social circle, I have come across many women who won't entertain their male dps being the sahp or going part time.

I often feel that too many men and women like the parenting status quo of it being mainly the women's job.

Oh Boundaries of course, I absolutely agree in comparison UK we're better than many places. I am just annoyed at myself for fooling myself into believing I had the opportunity for equality in my workplace/ life - when sadly it isn't. In comparison to other countries maybe it is minor in comparison - but the lip service approach adopted by our country undermines the central principles of equality.

Yup, totally agree Aqua - the lip service also allows the privilidged group to say "but you are equal. It covers inequality sand leads to "feminist" becoming something of an insult.

I agree, a lot of it is lip service.

Quite honestly, I can't see a time where there will ever be equality. That doesn't mean we shouldn't be pushing for it at every turn, we should, things should be as equal as possible. But I just don't think society has it in it to get there. The Patriarchy stands to lose far too much.

I work in what was traditionally a "male orientated" career. My first line manager is a woman, as is the second. The head of the organisation is a woman, the MP in overall charge is a woman as is the prime minister above her. The head of state is also a woman. Not exactly a patriarchy is it?

Nah, we don't have anywhere near equality.
That being said a lot of important things have changed,
i'm very recently separated however I encountered sexism many many times while with him (and to be fair, not from him).
I once had a lad from ''energy watchuk'' or something come to my door and give me a sales pitch about switching to save money etc. I was looking to switch so was interested. I was in front of him and H walked past several times doing bits and bobs, each time the salesperson would talk over my head to H, And when H brought out one of our energy bills (to see what we were paying per kw) I was totally cut out of the conversation. H reminded him that I was the sole bill payer, my name was on the bill, so a switch wasn't something he could consent to and as he (salesperson) wasn't interested in talking to me about possibly switching to 'E' (different supplier) he could go on his way.
I later found out energy watch are meant to be impartial, are they fuck (may as well had a T shirt on saying ''I work for E'') I digress, There have been many many times where STBXH took priority over me in household matters even though I was the one who ran the household finances and most of the bills were solely in my name

Today 19:09 funnyandwittyusername

I work in what was traditionally a "male orientated" career. My first line manager is a woman, as is the second. The head of the organisation is a woman, the MP in overall charge is a woman as is the prime minister above her. The head of state is also a woman. Not exactly a patriarchy is it?

You could have just said "I'm alright jack"

The fact that Teresa May is only the second ever female PM points to it most definitely being a patriarchy...

Not at all. Is there equality? No. But there certainly isn't a patriarchy either

So funnyandwitty - if not equality, but equally not patriarchy (i.e. a system which favours men) - what exactly have we got?

I would say we live in the legacy of patriarchy. We're just making our way out of it but a lot of people want to pull us back into it because things were so much simpler then 🙄

Funny, I'm assuming you're going to come back with some left of field definition of 'patriarchy', or you're deluded.

Capitalism and a class system in my opinion

"Lord Davies's target of 30 per cent of women on boards is slowly being met - with more than 25 per cent now in place (a number that has doubled since his initial report in 2012). But there are still twice as many men named John who are CEOs or chairmen of FTSE 100 companies as there are women of all names."

There are 7 women bosses of the ftse
[[http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/work/just-who-are-the-7-women-bosses-of-the-ftse-100/ ]]

I could continue. Men are in charge.

Tooth- would the dictionary definition do you?

It's just lip service. Did you really need to ask?

Look at the recent US election. Did you notice how the two candidates were held to a completely different set of standards? That is the reality.