To think a year 7 project should be just that

[Babyiwantabump]

DD has come home from school in tears today as she thinks her project that she did over the school holidays is wrong.

She was told to do a 3D model of a plant cell. Which she has done - to a year 7 level.

It's due in tomorrow and I just caught her up trying to add more to it- she says most of her friends have added things that she doesn't know what they are .

From the sound of it they have just googled plant cell and then copied A level type details onto it.

Should DD have done this too? I've told her that hers is fine - the teacher hasn't taught her that much detail so she doesn't need it!

AIBU?

What your DD has done is fine I think the teacher will know that the other students have just copied from a picture on google especially if they ask them to explain what each extra bit does and they don't know the answer.

I would take this as an opportunity to talk to your daughter about doing her best and not worrying if it isn't perfect. It sounds like she's done exactly what the teacher wanted (I teach a level biology and I've no idea what some of the organelles on the higher level diagram do) and I'm sure she'll get good feedback.

If she's in tears over work already I'd worry about how she'll handle higher pressure things that actually matter. Reinforce the "try as hard as you can and whatever you get you should be proud" message and that'll stand her in good stead for future coursework/tests.

I expect that your DD's teacher will be delighted that she has followed instructions and used the knowledge she has been taught. The other kids won't have a clue about what their extra bits actually mean.

Cake models. Awesome.

DS1 did this over half term (also private school). It was any from a list of cells. He did a nerve cell with a toilet roll, an egg box and some wire bag ties. He did it completely on his own up in his room. No labels or anything because it was a model not a diagram. Teacher was very happy with it.

Anyway, your DD goes to a private school. Is this her first year in the independent sector? She probably needs to be prepared for the fact that all practical homework of this nature will have been completed to parent standard (with considerable assistance from said parents) . This is particularly the case if it's a selective independent IME.

Ah yes Atticus - DD has been at this school since year one - she does all her own homework but I am well aware that there are parents that do it for their children .

That was kind of my point with this thread . It is obvious that the children haven't completed the homework on their own. But isn't that the point of homework - to see what they have actually learned and taken in?

Not googled and used the first image that cropped up!

I went to the same school and one friend had her mum do even her A level coursework for her!

As a science teacher I would make each student explain their model and what each component they had added was for. Because that's the point of the homework !! To understand how a cell looks and functions. I would then point out to some students that just copying extra stuff out of a book is pointless if they don't understand !! Although did this once and had a kid explain in massive detail how a kidney worked (but he was a child genius and now does some kind of cancer research).

Hmm, not entirely sure on that one. They will google to find the information they need. Its just the equivalent of an encyclopaedia in my day. They are not required to do the homework from memory based on what they have learned in class without reference to any resources. It's not a memory test.

Certainly with my DC if they'd have been asked to do a model of a plant cell and had googled and come up with the two different images and asked me for guidance I'd have said "Well if you have time, why don't you go the extra mile and put some extra detail in it. That will impress the teacher" (not the same thing as doing the homework for them).

There's a big difference IMO between parents doing the homework for the child and the child producing work which is above "Year 7 standard" because they've found additional information and want to include it.

The important thing is that she understands it. Ds would have failed on the 3D part. We are not artistic in hour house & the best he'd have come up would have been 3D graphics on the computer.

He once did some music homework to a higher standard than expected. It was listing orchestral instruments & their families. He used a book we had but dh & I both have music degrees & before I let him list any less common instruments I questioned him to make sure he knew what they were & their ranges.

Oh and she came home in tears because she wants to do the very best - but because she had just followed the teachers instructions and some had done more I suppose she was worried hers wouldn't be good enough- anyone would feel the same .

Maybe I should push her to do more but I don't think she needs that just yet - it's too much stress for her age . When it gets to GCSE then yes but not now - I don't think so anyway.

Am I wrong? I'm genuinely worried now that I'm not pushing her enough.

Is she normally anxious? She shouldn't be crying. She should have confidence to know that what she did was good enough.
I enjoyed helping ds1 make a church in year 7. One girl made a cake and one boy made it out of matchmakers and then it was all eaten. Now those 2 were impressive!!

If you think it is important that her work is the very best in the class then yes, by all means, push her more. If you think it's important that she does her very best and you think this was that, then don't. Either way she should be encouraged not to cry about it: people will always excel at different tasks and one of these days her work will be better than everyone else's. I'm sure she won't expect every other child in the class to get upset!

I don't know, who's to say what is right and what is wrong. I would confess that I sit towards the pushy end of the parenting scale because if I don't push my children then nobody else will. I don't do their homework for them though.

I have two DSs. One will always push himself without any need for parental pushiness. If asked to write a paragraph he will always write three. If asked to draw one out of three diagrams he will draw all three. He strives to be the best he can be and he's always towards the top of the class and getting distinctions and honour points.

The other does the bare minimum to get by. If asked to write a paragraph he will write a paragraph. He'll do it well but he won't go the extra mile. He's in the middle of the class (bottom of top sets) and gets an average number of distinctions and honour points.

If I'm honest with myself I know which child will do better academically (although that does not necessarily translate to general success in life of course).

She's not normally anxious no - she's been like that for the past few months and I think it's hormone related as she hasn't quite been herself and she is starting to go through puberty so I'm putting it down to that.

I just want her to be the best she can be and that she is happy . I think that's why this worried me so much as she was visibly upset.

*and know she is happy - must preview posts!

I would ignore the other kids. There lies the way of great frustration, especially if the parents are involved.

Instead look at your dd. As a pp said, I have one who does the bare minimum. BUT he likes to get it right in class, and doesn't like to look poor in front of teachers, so his bare minimum is just enough to get a 'well done' rather than just enough to pass.

Look at your dd. Look at how she approahces things. Does she usually like to do a good job? Is she scrapping past? Sounds like she wanted to do a good job, so as a parent, encourage her, help her along, help her do her best. Any more pushing and you may tip her over into a perfectioniust cycle.

Can I also recommend a teenage multi vitamin, it does help with the hormone waves.

My Year 7 DD has recently done this homework. We made a cake, as did loads of others. We did add stuff to it that we didn't understand to make it look less lame.

The project that got the most praise was her friends which was simple but made out of a hollowed out melon and jelly. It is creativity they were looking for in her teacher's case not detail - which is a shame as my children (and I) are missed the creativity gene.

It would be odd to be looking for creativity in a Biology class though surely?

The learning objective in DS's case was to be familiar with the cell and to be able to remember it to replicate it in a drawing for a test at some stage down the line.

Teachers do know who has done homework. I've had some works of art over the years and they never win a prize - best marks go to the one very obviously done by the student who can explain what they have produced. Also, come exam time mummy and daddy won't be there and that's where it shows. The reason coursework has gone is because of so much cheating. Let your kids do their own work as they are the ones who need to understand it. Yes they might get punished if it's not done but they will quickly learn if you back the school up. Off to now do detention for 2 students who copied each other's homework, word for word, and thought I wouldn't notice.

ego147
I think the teacher should ask those pupils who did the more complex one to explain what each part does.

And then when they merely regurtitate the Wiki information, ask them WHY the plant needs it.

If they can neither explain the more complex parts nor spell 'regurgitate' correctly then they should stand in the corner with a 'D' hat on whilst the rest of the students take in turns to throw stationary at them chanting insults!

Back on topic, I think you're a little unreasonable here OP. Perhaps the children used Wiki or something else and didn't understand everything they've labelled but it can still be a useful learning tool or basis for discussion. Perhaps their parents helped more*. Whatever happened, does it matter? Have a little more faith in the teachers to guide all students through the curriculum.

*and if that is a help or a hinderance is another thread entirely.

My ds did this homework in year 7, and made a model out of Lego! It had exactly the same amount of detail as your dd's hwk. The teachers will know that anything more fancy has had google/parental input. It's absolutely fine as it is!

If they can neither explain the more complex parts nor spell 'regurgitate' correctly then they should stand in the corner with a 'D' hat on whilst the rest of the students take in turns to throw stationary at them chanting insults!

What happens to those students who don't know which is the correct version of stationery to use?

Bless her. I think she's done the right thing in sticking with what she knows, but this could open up an interesting discussion for the two of you.

In the future she basically has 2 options:

1. Stick with what she knows and has learned in class.
2. Follow her classmates' lead and do something more advanced.

BUT if she goes with option 2 she should also understand what it is she is including that is extra. This will demonstrate independent learning and will count in her favour.

I say this as I got caught out not being able to explain myself when I was in year 6. It was just once, but very embarrassing and I made sure to never include something I couldn't understand again. That said, I also went through a stage of dumbing my English homework down because the same teacher didn't believe I was reading 'adult' books when I was 10. My parents had to get involved and say actually yes, I had read The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy and Brave New World and my book reports were my own work. My DS is now year 5 and I make sure he understands the subject but leave him to work independently. He knows if it's not up to scratch he'll have to redo it because I know what he is capable of (9 year old boys can be hella lazy!).

But really as long as your DD understands the topic well enough to produce work that fits the brief then she is doing well. If she wants to excel she could push herself, but that is a choice for her to make. Some of the other kids could understand the extras they've included. Not all of them will, but some might, and it's not unreasonable of them to do some independent learning if they've made that choice.

I'm a Science Technician in a secondary school, I've seen more model cells than you can possibly ever ever imagine. Some in the form of cake...

Your daughter's cell is perfect for y7, it's all about the basic gross structures. 6th form cells will be a lot more detailed. If she wanted to produce a more detailed model, and could demonstrate that she understood everything she'd included, she'd get many brownie points for it, but it certainly wouldn't be expected.