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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To be upset with NHS over DDs weight?

444 replies

Fudgefudgefudge · 04/11/2016 17:38

DD is 4 and is in reception. Recently she had her vision, hearing, weight etc measured at school and yesterday I received a letter from the NHS saying that they are referring her to Morelife. Having googled it I'm mortified, I had no idea my child was that overweight! I checked the NHS site which measures their BMI and using the measurements they provided it shows DD being obese and on the 99th percentile Sad

Now I breastfed DD up until her 1st birthday and she was a big baby back then but over the years she's slimmed up if you know what I mean and to me she just doesn't look overweight. She has a healthy appetite and I am well aware of how to eat a healthy balanced diet etc but I do allow a treat for good behaviour. And DD is a very active, she would rather run than walk and I don't drive so she's used to walking places.

AIBU to be upset about this? What do I do? Ask the GP their opinion? It's made me doubt my abilities as a mother as I never even considered she could be obese.

OP posts:
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7
Natsku · 07/11/2016 13:45

Now why would you present the statistics in that way, making the differences seem smaller. Either present the unhealthy statistic in all categories or the healthy in all categories and the big difference in health between normal weight and overweight/obese/morbidly obese is very visible. Being overweight doesn't necessarily mean someone is unhealthy but they are more likely to be unhealthy and much more likely to face future health issues because of their weight.

Children aren't (or shouldn't be) put in diet classes due to one measurement. The aim with children is not to make them lose weight but to keep their weight stable while they grow, by increasing exercise and cutting out junk food/inserting healthier food into their diet. Following a nutritious diet is not the same as 'dieting'.

Chippednailvarnishing · 07/11/2016 14:09

People are evolving to be taller with larger frames

And that argument would be fine if we were all healthier. Except we're not.

www.diabetes.org.uk/About_us/News/Number-of-people-diagnosed-with-diabetes-reaches-32-million/

hoddtastic · 07/11/2016 18:46

it is hardly surprising there is such a load of fat kids when there are so many parents prepared to make excuses why their kids are massive... From heritage, to birth weight...

I am 5" taller than the average woman, DH is tall (but not enormously tall, 6'2ish?) it stands to reason our children will be taller than the average child (they are). They don't have to be fatter/chunkier/insert euphemism- they can be, if I overfeed them, but it doesn't follow that tall means fat, without overfeeding/poor habits of exercise.

If you look at a skeleton of a fat person, and the skeleton of a slim person,there is very little variation, other than in height.

so many excuses.

crashdoll · 07/11/2016 18:48

I don't know why some people fall over themselves to justify why being overweight/obese is ok. Fine, for an adult, you make your own decisions but for a child? I didn't hear anyone saying "tell the 5 year old she's fat and send her to weight watchers". OP was encouraged to support her DD to create a healthier lifestyle which she said she found helpful.

I don't think that name calling or fat shaming or pointing out the bleeding obvious "do you know it's unhealthy to be 5ft 2 and 28 stone?" BUT there is a vast area between the black and white attitude that some people seem to show.

I'm the furthest thing from a perfect and healthy parent and person but justifying the rise in obesity isn't helpful by saying "oh but they could be healthy and overweight" isn't helpful. It's a really serious issue and it's not a failing or criticism on the part of society or the individual.

crashdoll · 07/11/2016 18:51

As of article published in July 2916, the average woman is 164cm which is slightly over 5ft 4.5inches,

user1478450549 · 07/11/2016 18:53

Youre upset with the NHS because you didn't know your child was obese? When they have told you and given you a way to help her?

Why are you upset with them?

hoddtastic · 07/11/2016 18:56

and, for clarification, the photo of the kid that I assume was being referred to earlier as being fat was a kid who had thin limbs but a sticky out tummy, when i mentioned the kids tummy stuck out her mum said she had recently had abdominal surgery (hence the sticky out tummy) So, that kid who was slap bang in the middle of the centiles had a sticky out tummy because of surgery, not because 'average' kids of five are meant to. At least be factual when you are posting (although this is a long thread so I can understand how some of that was missed maybe)

scaevola · 07/11/2016 18:59

thefatfifty

You've quoted adult BMI ranges and they do not apply to children where overweight starts at 91 and obese at 98.

Outliers when using the children's ranges are very rare, because they allow for exactly the sort of variations you describe.

And of course, because of measurement programmes such as this one, the growth charts which underpin BMI can be adjusted precisely to ensure that things like a general sizing up of the population is allowed for. (Though of course the weight difference from 'big bones' is only a few lbs, if that). But it takes a generation or few, and cannot account for the changes in the last decade or so.

Also, even for adults there is a range, which allows for things like frame size (and nork size). Yes, it's screening, not diagnostic. But it's very rare to have an 'obese' BMI and be healthy (both short and long term) unless it is accounted for by high musculature, which children do not have, as it develops to that level only after some years of exposure to adult hormone levels and continuing high physical demand.

PetalMettle · 07/11/2016 23:00

Hoddtastic I don't think the pp was referring to the little girl in the ballet outfit who had the surgery, but another little girl who was in a pink swimming costume, and a number of posters did say was overweight.

Thefitfatty · 08/11/2016 05:46

Now why would you present the statistics in that way, making the differences seem smaller.

I'm not sure what you mean. I simply stated how many outliers there are, and that it's not "rare." But rather quite common. Approximately 75 million people in the US.

Children aren't (or shouldn't be) put in diet classes due to one measurement. The aim with children is not to make them lose weight but to keep their weight stable while they grow, by increasing exercise and cutting out junk food/inserting healthier food into their diet. Following a nutritious diet is not the same as 'dieting'.

I agree, which is why I think the first step when you get a letter home should be to take your child to a GP who can assess their health properly. Going to things like MoreLife, or suddenly focusing too much on their diets can lead to life long eating disorders and self esteem issues.

Obesity is rising, but so are eating disorders among young children. And I think weighing children at school is a big reason for that. BMI is faulty, the only reason it's used is because it's easy, not because it's accurate. Accurate health assessments are far more costly and require more attention. Much easier to divided height by weight and tell someone they are unhealthy. There should be more of a focus on healthy lifestyles, and less of a focus on a person's actual weight. Especially children's.

And that argument would be fine if we were all healthier. Except we're not.

Again, that depends how you look at it. In the past our life spans were shorter and the major diseases were caused by poor sanitation and malnutrition. Now, we've traded in diseases caused by lack of nutrition for diseases caused by "too much" nutrition. However, we also have the medical abilities to treat these diseases, which weren't available in the past.

In most terms, we are living longer, better quality lives than our ancestors.

We've gone from one extreme to another, and finding that balance will be hard, but overt focus on weight isn't the answer, especially as yo-yo dieting and stress is just as linked to ill health as being obese in the first place.

If you look at a skeleton of a fat person, and the skeleton of a slim person,there is very little variation, other than in height.

So Michael Phelps shoulder width is the same as your average joe on the street? No. His "wingspan" is actually longer than his height, which is unusual. If you read up on forensics you'll see that human skeletons are actually very different. Broader shoulders, higher foreheads, longer leg bones and arm bones, larger or smaller hand structure, etc etc etc. People aren't just up and down, they are also wide. So you do get different frame sizes. If all human skeletons were the same what would be the point in reconstructing them to help find out the identities of murder victims, we'd all look the same right?

Outliers when using the children's ranges are very rare, because they allow for exactly the sort of variations you describe.

No. It's just as faulty as the adult ones. It does make some allowance for growth, but generally it underestimates the amount of unhealthy fat carried by "healthy weight" children and overestimates the amount of fat carried by "overweight" children. Ideally all children should be getting regular health assessments and have access to healthy foods and lots of exercise. But, again, much easier to place kids on a graph and tell them their unhealthy or healthy without further assessment.

Generally healthy eating habits and exercise need to be promoted to EVERY child. Not just the ones with "unhealthy" BMI's. And BMI needs to be tossed out the window in favor of more accurate measurements, like waist to hip and waist to height measures.

Yakitori · 08/11/2016 05:56

DDs both had "sticky out" tummies until they were aged five or six in spite of always being in the middle of healthy weight range, so that's no guide at all.

And BMI needs to be tossed out the window in favor of more accurate measurements, like waist to hip and waist to height measures.

Would that work with children? Mine would be the same measure chest, waist and hips!

bruffin · 08/11/2016 06:01

They have always weighed children at school, so that cant be the reason for the rise in ED.
However going on MN and threads likevthis there is now an obsession on good and bad food which wasnt around before. All this nonsense about carb heavy food and puddings etc being bad. We had puddings like that every day when i was at school in the 60s . Children may be less active which is more of a problem but that is down to parents driving their kids to school etc

bruffin · 08/11/2016 06:02

Threads like this bring the orthorexics of mn out in force

Thefitfatty · 08/11/2016 06:13

Would that work with children? Mine would be the same measure chest, waist and hips!

It would obviously have to be adjusted for children, but height to waist should be fine. Generally the sign of unhealthy fat is a protruding tummy (obviously not in cases where the child has had surgery etc.) But again, for kids, we really need to look at overall health checks and not a simple mathematical equation.

Thefitfatty · 08/11/2016 06:15

They have always weighed children at school, so that cant be the reason for the rise in ED.

Not entirely no. Like many things there are probably a lot of factors. The amount of fear, hatred and disgust towards people who don't have a healthy BMI also probably plays a large part, as does our societies focus on looks and eternal youth.

bruffin · 08/11/2016 06:24

Children arent told their bmi,its sent as a letter to the parents.

Thefitfatty · 08/11/2016 06:28

Children arent told their bmi,its sent as a letter to the parents.

No, but when suddenly there parents become overly concerned about what they're eating, how much they're exercising and what they weigh, I'm sure they pick up on it. Also there's plenty of BMI calculators online. I'm sure most tween's know their BMI's.

OhTheRoses · 08/11/2016 07:18

They were given a slip f paper in 2008. Just the ones whose BMI was above. Wandsworth if you wish to dismiss. Not noting the school - it's outing.

christinarossetti · 08/11/2016 07:28

Surely being aware of what your children are eating, how much they are exercising is part of parenting regardless of the size or shape of the children?

Over or under concern may lead to problems, of course.

BitOutOfPractice · 08/11/2016 07:34

"I'm sure most tween's know their BMI's."

I bet they don't.

HeCantBeSerious · 08/11/2016 07:59

We had puddings like that every day when i was at school in the 60s

Made from scratch, not from packets with all sorts of bulking agents, preservatives and other junk. My husband's favourite pudding as a child in the 80s was Angel Delight. I bought him a packet last year and he said it was nothing like the original now. So many ingredients changed it's not the same stuff at all.

BabyGanoush · 08/11/2016 08:05

Fitfatty, fascinating about bmi for tall people

At 6ft, I hover close to "overweight" (bmi of 24) but feel relatively slim (size 12 at 6ft does not look fat)

DS2 was "overweight" at age 5, but also over-tall, I got this nonsense letter from the nhs about his weight

He is 6ft at 13, and not an ounce of fat on him, bmi lower now.

Nhs bmi does not seem to make sense for those over 6ft

Thefitfatty · 08/11/2016 08:19

Nhs bmi does not seem to make sense for those over 6ft

BMI doesn't make sense for many people.

www.medicaldaily.com/body-mass-index-bmi-calculator-healthy-weight-obesity-372852

I can't remember where I read it now (googling furiously) but at the time it was designed people were shorter, less nourished and had less muscle mass and the ranges set as (underweight, normal, overweight, obese, morbidly obese) reflect that. So short people are made to feel smaller than they are and tall people fatter.

Thefitfatty · 08/11/2016 08:23

DS2 was "overweight" at age 5, but also over-tall, I got this nonsense letter from the nhs about his weight

My DM had the same issues with my DB. He was very chubby from birth to about 8 or 9. She would get letters all the time, although my DM strictly monitored everything we ate and we were not allowed treats at all. We also had to get a lot of exercise every day. Between about 9 and 16 he went from tall but not abnormally tall to 6 ft 2. By the time he finished growing at 21 he was 6ft 4.5. He has horrid stretch marks from how quickly he grew, and we had to special order in shoes for him.

My DS will be as tall, but "luckily" Hmm at almost 5 he is not a big eater. Some days I wish all he wanted was McDonalds, at least than I know he's eaten something!

OhTheRoses · 08/11/2016 09:06

It starts with the obsession with baby weighing at special clinics manned by health visitors and their hca assistants. You can't suddenly turn celebration at weight gaing and bouncing baby pride into then withdrawing food. When mine were born in the mid 90s the weight charts were barely fit for purpose and the hv's did not comprehend the difference between a mean or an average.

The problems start far before school. My DC are 22 and 18. There have been no more obese children amongst their contemporaries than amongst mine 35 years earlier.

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