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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To think I absolutely do not owe him child maintenance?

75 replies

notagainnellie · 04/09/2016 20:48

He earns very little and I earn £45k before tax. He left following infidelity, not that it's relevant. He has seen the dc very little over the summer, especially ds2 who's not a cricket fan, to the detriment of his relationship with his dad.

I dropped them off today, reminding him that tomorrow is an inset day - Monday is his day during term time anyway. He did a huge sigh and told me it was 'ridiculous' that he has them every inset. He temps in schools, so obviously would not get any work on the first day back, while, as a teacher, I would not feel able to ask for the first day back after a 6 week holiday off . Anyway, I said nothing other than reminded him that we had agreed this during mediation. He then said that had been 'bollocks' and that he has checked and I should be paying him £60 a week cm, based on my income. I didn't want to argue in front of the dc, so didn't really reply, but I have come home and checked on the calculator and it seems he is right.

We agreed at mediation he wouldn't ask for spousal maintenance (had been a sahd) and nothing was said about cm. In term time he has them 4 nights per fortnight, though has had them far less then that over the summer - which I have been happy about, but it wasn't what he insisted he wanted .

The only thing he pays for is the meals they have when with him. I cover EVERYTHING else, and am happy to do so, but am fucked if I am going to be handing over £200 per month for a few plates of pasta. That could be going to their so-far-non-existent university funds. AIBU? I'm sick of the whole thing.

OP posts:

Original poster

notagainnellie · 04/09/2016 21:54

Just realised that Quitelikely's post may give the impression that it was me who had the affair. I know it has no impact on maintenance payments, but just want to make it clear - he had the affair, not me.

OP posts:

YeOldMa · 04/09/2016 21:56

It doesn't matter who did what to end the marriage, maintenance is a completely separate issue. He hasn't claimed residency so that isn't an issue whatever anybody else opinion is. CSA, DWP etc, all use "nights" to determine how many times a week a parent is responsible for a child so you are the Primary Carer. I think your Ex has got his wires crossed. I hope enough people have reassured you so you don't waste any more energy on this matter.

RunRabbitRunRabbit · 04/09/2016 22:05

Are you married? What does your solicitor say?

QuiteLikely5 · 04/09/2016 22:13

Yes but I am talking about the law!

I understand completely that he brought this on himself but it doesn't mean he wouldn't be entitled to nothing

Or are we just talking about what he deserves?

NeedsAsockamnesty · 04/09/2016 22:14

The only thing that does make a difference is ARE YOU THE RESIDENT PARENT or not?

Despite almost every poster asking your evading it nicely

Original poster

notagainnellie · 04/09/2016 22:21

I'm not evading it - if it means do I have them most of the nights (10 out of 14) and pay for everything, then yes, clearly I am the resident parent. It's not quite how it states it on the calculator website, but if that's all it is then I don't have a problem.

Haven't seen my solicitor for a while due to a delay in obtaining a copy of my marriage certificate from abroad (original was lost), but mediator indicated that the judge may query our agreement. That is a separate issue from cm though, which we didn't discuss. I do feel a bit reassured having read the replies, but the whole thing is very much ongoing, so still a source of worry .

OP posts:

Rachcakes · 04/09/2016 22:22

No. You're the resident parent (RP), he is the non-resident parent (NRP).
The NRP pays the RP a percentage of their income with a deduction of 1/7 made for every night a week the child(ren) stay with them.

So eg. Child stays one night a week at NRPs house, NRP pays RP 6/7 of the amount - usually 15% of take home for one child, 20% for two.

Rachcakes · 04/09/2016 22:23

Ah, cross posted.
But anyway, no. If anything he should be paying you % of his take-home less 2/7 for the days the children are with him.

Rachcakes · 04/09/2016 22:24

I say days. I mean overnights.

BombadierFritz · 04/09/2016 22:26

the csa calculator defines the two parents clearly
"The ‘paying parent’ is the parent who doesn’t have main day-to-day care of the child. The ‘receiving parent’ is the parent with main day-to-day care of the child."

thats just under 'step 6' on 'how child maintenance is worked out
www.gov.uk/how-child-maintenance-is-worked-out/how-the-child-maintenance-service-works-out-child-maintenance

LyndaNotLinda · 04/09/2016 22:29

Bullshit are you talking about the law QuiteLucky. The law doesn't operate on luck.

In any event, spousal maintenance is only award AFAIK if the spouse is unable to support themselves financially. Given he chooses to do fuck all and doesn't even see his kids that much, I think you have misunderstood the law.

mummymummums · 04/09/2016 22:32

No, you don't need to pay him. The courts don't have jurisdiction on child maintenance except in very limited circumstances (not applicable here from what's been said). The Child Maintenance Service does have jurisdiction but only to assess maintenance as payable to the person who the child lives with the majority of time. He's a chancer!
That said, if he chooses not to adhere to the agreement of when he has DC you can't make him. Even a court order is for you to make child available to see him xx times, but if he doesn't take it up you can't enforce. Though you could try to vary if he was consistently unreliable.

BombadierFritz · 04/09/2016 22:36

it is possible your ex has selective reading skills and has decided that he has them 104 days a year.therefore has them 'day to day' (see link). however, that is not true if you have them more nights than him and do the usual mundane type caring. (as it explains further down in link)

www.citizensadvice.org.uk/relationships/children-and-young-people/child-maintenance/child-maintenance-2012-scheme/child-maintenance-eligibility-and-rules/the-2012-child-maintenance-scheme-who-is-the-parent-with-day-to-day-care-of-the-children/

I just asked why he hadnt asked for main residence as I wondered if even as a sahd you did most of the day to day care anyway and he was more a sit on sofa dad!

Minisoksmakehardwork · 04/09/2016 22:40

My understanding is spousal maintenance is payable for a period until the lower earning party is self sufficient. But that person does have to show that they are doing this and not just sitting on their laurels hoping their high earning ex will continue to bankroll their previous lifestyle. This might mean a previously joint home has to be sold, employment sought and so on. But there has to be enough evidence to support the spouse needs those payments.

Child maintenance would be separate from this and paid by the non-resident parent to the resident parent for the benefit of the children.

If your ex had very regular custody, then it could be argued as the lower earner he would need spousal maintenance to keep a sufficient sized home until either the children reached (say) 18 or his own income had increased to such that he could be self sufficient.

He would still have to pay a percentage of his income as child maintenance to you as the resident parent. But I don't know if they'd take SM into account for income when calculating CM.

It sounds like you/he have got the two payments mixed up. I'd also ask whether you did a clean break settlement when you finalised your divorce as SM would be a moot point if so.

NNChangeAgain · 04/09/2016 22:46

if it means do I have them most of the nights (10 out of 14) and pay for everything, then yes, clearly I am the resident parent. It's not quite how it states it on the calculator website, but if that's all it is then I don't have a problem.

Who pays for what isn't part of the definition of "resident parent"

It is solely based on the number of nights per year the child spends with each parent. And yes, that is number of nights, not days, not evenings.

So, over the course of the year, do your DCs spend less than 3 nights a week with their dad? If so, you are the resident parent, and the number a nights a year they spend with him dictates how much he is liable to pay you in CM.

However, if "on average" they spend more than three nights a week with their dad, then he is the resident parent.

Iggi999 · 04/09/2016 22:48

I remember the OP's previous posts and am very glad to see he is out of the house and only able to mess with you from afar.
Have some

Iflyaway · 04/09/2016 22:51

I would tell him to fuck off.

Spousal maintenance?! What, did he not grow up?!

He chose to have two children. Now he has to take care of them, and himself too.

All adults are responsible for their own lives. Even when they decide to do something else in life. Like leaving the family.

You and him only have a responsibility towards your children.

You sound well rid.

SabineUndine · 04/09/2016 22:59

It looks to me as though he'd quite like you to support him financially and he's trying to bully you into doing so. You don't owe him anything. I used to have a friend who worked as a supply teacher and she did it because there was next to no responsibility involved and she could take off as much time as she wanted. Sound like your ex at all?

GabsAlot · 04/09/2016 23:01

do people still get spousal maintenance here?

anyway it depends how long u were together etc-im sure he could find a job

the cm is separate to all that

mummymummums · 04/09/2016 23:04

Very important is to get a financial order in the context of any divorce proceedings. Including dismissals of future claims. If you don't do that, his claims lie dormant and can potentially be brought in the future - likely if you do well for yourself and he doesn't!

Rubies12345 · 04/09/2016 23:15

Spousal support is rare in the UK - I'm assuming you're in the UK

Memoires · 04/09/2016 23:22

He's clearly not the RP so how on earth does he think that you should pay him cm? As said upthread, it should be the other way round.

Keep notes of when he has them, especially over the holidays. Start your notes with how much he had them this last holiday. It'll be useful later, and probably save you a heck of a lot of bother.

OhGodWhatTheHellNow · 04/09/2016 23:28

Gabs during my divorce proceedings, albeit some time ago now, ExH was playing silly buggers re the assets settlement and the Judge, losing patience, stated he was 'minded' to make an order for spousal maintenance if ExH couldn't agree to an equitable split, so it was definitely still A Thing.

ExH stopped the arsing about at that point.

GabsAlot · 05/09/2016 00:03

so maybe he meant u should have the spousal maintenance

anyway it rarely gets given these days you would have had to be married and supporting him for a long time

M0nstersinthecl0set · 05/09/2016 07:48

Why hasn't he had them, when he says he does? Because (if like my ex) he's lazy, sees himself as poor hard dine by victim (or wants others to) but, at the end of the day doesn't put his children and their needs high enough as a priority to push for 50/50 time.

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