to think that we should pay more in tax?!

[MenMust]

I am wondering whether tax rates should go up rather than public services being cut. When I first started working tax rates were around 33% and now they are down to 20% and services are being cut. More tax should be raised from large companies and from the rich but I also think that if we want to keep our services including the NHS then we all maybe need to pay more in tax. any views on this?

No way. We pay 45% here and remember this doesn't include NI which is nothing more than a tax. If those that pay 20% tax want to have theirs increased, great. I doubt anyone that pays 45% does.
Incidentally, anyone with children that pays 20% tax or less is essentially a net beneficiary of the state, when you account for schools, NHS, infrastructure etc. Only those that pay 40% and above actually pay for it.
So no, I'm paying enough thanks!

sorry Chikara. from reading the posts so far, it seems that many prefer there is greater efficiency on spending and ensuring tax loop holes are closed and large corporates pay their fair share. I guess when you add together income tax with national insurance, VAT, stamp duty, council tax, inheritance tax etc, then people are paying quite alot in tax already.

I must point out to the PP who took issue with "the wealthy retired" that pensions are taxable at the same rates as earnings!

Other than that, provided that loopholes allowing corporations and indivuals to evade their tax responsibilities are closed I would welcome a higher tax rate and the improvement in services that would result.

Absolutely not. We have no visibilty or grip of who is using our public services. I visit many hospitals and GPS surgeries each week as part of my job and I hear people demanding in every language under the sun. Identity cards with biometrics for British and EU citizens and credit cards accepted from all others before our taxes are wasted. Might not be a popular view but believe me we are handing out taxpayers cash like sweets to those who have no right to it.

How about just getting the tax from people and companies who actually evade tax. Personally I really couldn't afford to pay more.

The best way to make sure that those in genuine need who can't support themselves and provide adequate services (NHS, schools, etc) is not to raise taxes, but to create more wealth through more people earning more - by encouraging companies to grow and more people to start businesses. This creates more income from taxes. Taxing the 'rich' is never going to work, and never has, because they amount to a tiny number of people.

Socialism - high tax economies- has failed the world over. Look at France, Greece, Spain - all broke.

High taxes are a disincentive for businesses and successful people. I'm old enough to remember when tax was at 90% for high earners and the country was in a terrible state under Wilson in the 1960s. You then get the brain drain and people who earn a lot, going to live and work overseas. Hello Switzerland.

High taxation does not benefit the worse off- it is bad for everyone.

MenMust - I think that's the majority view.

PollyPerky is right. I also remember Wilson's govt.
Marylou2 also has a reasonable point.

90% tax rates! wow! wouldnt have been much point in working!

I'd prefer it if the people rich enough to pay accountants to find them creative ways to not pay just stopped and paid their bloody taxes

If anyone is paying 50% tax then they must be paying tax on benefits or paying back tax owed on previous years

FFS!! Some people do actually pay 45% tax WITHOUT ever having claimed benefits or paying tax back 🙄

The Duke of Westminster's family are not liable to main rates of IHT at 40% but will be liable at 6% every 10 years research shows. This means on a £9bn London property inventory the tax every 10 years will be £540m and can be paid annually at £54m until the next revaluation 10 years later. At £54m this would put the family in the top 0.0001% of taxpayers, surely?

Google and Starbucks may be different because profits are massaged but can £9bn of London property be hidden? Doubt it.

Higher taxation just results in businesses and the wealthy relocating abroad so there is less revenue coming in to the Exchequer. You can't force them to stay here you know.......

Chickara that's inevitable, but I don't see a problem with it, I'd rather support a few layabouts than see one genuine case struggle. And there are vanishingly few true layabouts.

I think this idea that efficiency is the holy grail is a lie we've been sold, and is a big contributer to the ills of our society. Viewing people as commodities to be exploited.

Nope, I pay quite enough thank you. Usual MN race to the bottom.

Perhaps I'd feel a bit better about paying out shedloads on any incremental pay rise if the real problems were being dealt with (clue, it isn't people like me earning £50-60k in cities with higher than average living expenses not paying enough tax).

No way. How about cutting the vast waste first!

Your direct tax may be only 20% OP but if you factor in NI and all the indirect taxes like fuel duty, vat, stamp duty, tax on your savings interest (not that you get much these days), road tax, then I think you'll be shocked just how. Uch of your hard earned cash goes to the government!

A friend of mine who is an (incredibly nerdy) accountant worked his out to be about 70% a few years back..... Yes 70% of his salary ends up in the governments pockets!!!!

Fucking criminal, that's what it is.....

It's £43,001 before you start paying 40% ONLY on earnings over that

Employment income above the personal allowance (£11000) is effectively taxed at about 40%. If an employer is willing to pay an extra £100, there's 13.8% employers NI, so that means the employee gets a pay increase of £87.87. Less 12% employee NI on that leaves £77.53. Deduct 20% of £87.87 for basic rate income tax and the employee is left with £59.75. So actually employment income above £11000 is currently taxed at fractionally more than 40% of what the employer pays out.

Similarly, £100 added to the wage bill for a higher rate employee puts £51 in the employee's pocket, the effective tax rate is 49%, not 40%, once all NI is taken into account.

Yes definitely we should pay more tax and have better services.

I'd like to see and end to corporations falsifying their uk profits to avoid tax (I'm looking at you, Google, Starbucks, Amazon etc) and I'd like to see an end to the avoidance schemes and wheezes used by extremely wealthy individuals. Also, we should get a grip on rules of eligibility for taxpayer-funded services as its evidently not a bottomless pot. With these things addressed many issues would be alleviated. Further squeezing middle income earners on company payrolls should not be the first place to look for greater tax income, but unfortunately this seems to be easiest group for HMRC to manipulate/target.

No, I think most people pay enough already

The NHS is on its knees because of inefficiencies and wastage, not a lack of funding
£100m a year is spent every year on prescriptions for paracetamol, ffs. Same again for other over the counter medicines like indigestion remedies.
Remember that thing doing the rounds on Facebook last winter on how to get free Calpol from pharmacies?
I would far sooner people 'contribute' to the system by not taking the piss with things like that, than by increasing the tax take

No one pays 45% tax, no one, so stop bleating about that, you also don't pay NI on all of your earnings.

You only pay 45% on anything you earn over £150,000. You pay 40 % on

As far as I'm concerned if your earning £150,000 you aren't doing so alone, you are doing so because the society that you live in facilitates it.

Put it this way.

On £155,00 you pay £55,850 in Income tax and £6,433 in NI, so what you have actually paid on your total tax liability is tax rate of 40% of your entire income. Where as someone on £45,000 pays 25% of their entire income in tax.

You can't say "oh we work hard" everyone works hard. All of the tax rates have been historically higher but we should be taxing the higher income earners more, as well as the corporations.

Oh btw if you earn £155,000 the your income tax rate, minus NI, is actually 36%.

Its not 45%

sparechange There are many people who would be happy to buy paracetamol but can't get sufficient quantities because of nanny-state guidance not allowing packs of more than 16 in the cheap shops. It doesn't go far if you have arthritis and need 8 a day

The system is well and truly fucked up. We all need to pay more but equally the system needs to spend far more wisely, the NHS spends a fortune on those not entitled to treatment and fails to recoup much of it

I think the health tourism thing is over blown.

The estimates of it work out at about between 100 and 280 million a year, at the top end that's 0.2 % of the entire NHS budget.