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Letting agent trying to deduct for professional cleaning

68 replies

ShoeEatingMonster · 03/08/2016 15:30

We gave the keys to our rental flat back on Sat (technically didn't have to be out until the Sunday) We've been in our new place since the start of the month so it's been empty to allow us to clean.
Anyway, the letting agents did their inventory check out on Tuesday and we've just had an email through stating that the landlady has asked for professional cleaners to be brought in to deal with the issues in the report (see below) and that if we're happy to take it out of the deposit to let them know. I'm not going to quibble over what I think are very minor issues some of which aren't even us but my issue is that they haven't said how much they what to deduct. The carpets have all been professionally cleaned as per the tenancy agreement. The report is loooooong but I've copied and pasted to show their wording:

**The detailed report is as follows:
Entrance Hall:

The floor would benefit from mopping to remove prints from footwear.

Lounge:

The walls are very slightly scuffed at low level.

The skirting boards are a little dusty, especially beneath the radiators.

The white curtains are of slightly soiled appearance with a number of very small dot marks in a line on one curtain.

Bathroom:

The sanitary ware (especially behind the WC) could be slightly cleaner.

The mirrored door to the cabinet could be slightly cleaner.

There are some oval deposits/marks on the tiled window sill, probably from the bottom of plastic soap bottles etc.

Bedroom One:

The drawers are a little dusty within and some human hair is present.

The mirror to the dressing table could be slightly cleaner. There are four small sticky marks to the top left corner where a sticker may have been applied and removed.

One of the bulbs in the recess above the bed is not working.

There is a sizable darkish mark just to the front right of the dressing table. This seems not to have been removable during the cleaning process. Some other slight marks were noted.

Bedroom Two:

A further bulb in the four spot fitting has failed, making two in total. The fitting is a little dusty.

Kitchen:

A screw appears to have been added to the wall above the radiator.

Only three of the four window lock keys were present (they all appear to be the same profile so the loss of one has little/no impact).

The sides of the dishwasher door that are not subject to the washing action could be cleaner.

The glass door to the oven could be cleaner.

The top of the extractor hood is a little greasy and dusty.

A round glass wall clock appears to have been left together with three GU10 type light bulbs in a box.

There are some light liquid spill marks to some of the cupboard doors.

The external wooden door to the integrated washing machine is not aligned correctly. The hinges appear to have been changed at some point.

The skirting boards are a little dusty in places.

The vinyl flooring has light debris in some of the corners.**

We left that flat having cleaned it from top to bottom. I'd agree with the stain on the carpet and oven door which I couldn't shift but deny the rest. Especially footprints in the hall. The carpet cleaner was in before the checkout and presumably it was him the left the footprints cos they weren't there when we left. He also didn't put the alarm on which is being blamed on us!

I've emailed and asked for an exact breakdown of what they want to deduct. There is no set standard for cleanliness in the tenancy agreement it just says deposit can be used to cover cleaning costs. Considering it says at the beginning of the report that the flat is a generally clean state and they say things 'could be cleaner' surely that's subjective?
If he comes back with a set price we can agree on we'll pay to avoid the hassle but if not I will fight them. I am not agreeing to pay an unspecified amount for a job I don't believe needs doing. Any advice?

OP posts:
Cosmo111 · 04/08/2016 14:16

yellodraw over a year ago, he had the inventory which stated it but we weren't even given acopy. He was a one man estate agent. When we first went with him it was in a proper office with staff then he downsized. The property we rented was one his own mother owned.

ShoeEatingMonster · 04/08/2016 14:28

I agree that if there are ring marks in the bathroom and hairs in drawers then they should be cleaned. I didn't see anything when doing a final check but I may have missed it. As I've said I'm willing to pay for cleaning if necessary but I want a price upfront! Still nothing has come back to us.

To the pp who mentioned that it sounded negotiable I kind of agree. We've had contact with this particular agent once before when the tone of his email was very firm and constantly referred to the contract. This email was very different in tone which does make me think he is trying his luck.

OP posts:
Melfish · 04/08/2016 16:50

The flat we moved into was not clean despite supposedly being done beforehand and when we moved out they asked that we get professional cleaners in. I asked for a copy of the receipt to indicate that the professional cleaners had been in and strangely the agent could not find it, so we did not pay.

meercat23 · 04/08/2016 17:03

OP if you don't think you left those ring marks or hairs ask for dated pictures. Dated before the date when they emailed and told you they wanted it cleaned that is!

Tenants have the right to be present when the end of tenancy check is done and a very good reason for that is so that there can be no question about what the state of the property was at the point when the tenant handed over they keys.

If you disagree and they cant produce dated pictures the deposit service will not let them charge.

Sonders · 04/08/2016 17:27

An old LL of mine wanted to deduct 100 for 10 x missing bulbs at £10 each, plus a few other strange things.

Not only in £10 per bulb insane, but I did a count and there weren't 10 light fittings in the whole flat! I am quite argumentative so wrote something back saying the report is clearly false, and asked that they sent us proof of all the deductions.

They just sent us back our whole deposit instead.

BikeGeek · 04/08/2016 18:14

We got our entire deposit back in similar circumstances. As soon as I mentioned betterment and going to the arbitration service they backed down on every single point.

Things they wanted to charge for including marks where pictures had been up on the wall, cracked grout in bathroom floor tiles, wear marks (not dirt) on a cream hallway carpet.

BikeGeek · 04/08/2016 18:18

We got our entire deposit back in similar circumstances. As soon as I mentioned betterment and going to the arbitration service they backed down on every single point.

Things they wanted to charge for including marks where pictures had been up on the wall, cracked grout in bathroom floor tiles, wear marks (not dirt) on a cream hallway carpet.

TortoiseVTurtle · 04/08/2016 18:26

We took our last letting agents to the small claims court because they falsified a cleaning invoice. It was a made up email and name. The address used was another house being let out by the same agents- I went round there.
I could have used DPS but I wanted to do it through court as I thought it would be worse for them.
Unfortunately the judge didn't come down as hard on them as I would have liked and they still operate a successful letting agency in Tunbridge Wells.

NameChange30 · 04/08/2016 18:34

Tortoise You could see if the letting agents are members of an industry association, and if so report that way. You could also report them to trading standards.

TortoiseVTurtle · 04/08/2016 18:36

I tried, they were useless, plus they said that as we had taken them to court, they would now not be able to do anything to Martin&Co them.

Fuzzywuzzywasabear · 04/08/2016 18:37

We got our whole deposit back in similar circumstances LL repeated refused to provide costs for deductions, one of which was lines in carpet caused by carpet cleaner Hmm
The flat was newly renovated when we moved in and she refused to take wear and tear into account and wanted back as new Confused

We were prepared to pay what was fair but wanted quotes/costs etc. She refused.
In the end we raised a dispute and our whole deposit was repaid.
Do the same it sounds like they are trying to get you to pay for the redecoration.

TrickyD · 04/08/2016 18:37

I agree with those like Pan who say a professional deep clean trumps a well meaning but amateur effort. When we let our first property, DH and I had spent three days cleaning it, but nevertheless arranged a professional clean so that we could ask tenants to do the same when they left.

We thought we had done a very good job but there was no comparison with the work of the experts.

I am now glumly awaiting the results of the agent's chasing our latest outgoing tenants for the way they left the place and their explanation of the disappearance of a gilt over-mantle mirror and one full length one amongst various other issues.

TrivialPursuit · 05/08/2016 11:11

My previous landlord demanded that we replace a carpet which had a large stain on it. The new tenants had seen it and made it one of their conditions.

That would be fair enough, except the stain was there when we moved in as evidenced by the photos the landlady had provided at the time. She'd been so intent on showing us how lovely it all was, that she'd glossed over the existing flaws.

The same landlord also wanted us to pay for the cutting down of a tree that had self planted there 10 years earlier because, again, the new tenants had made it a condition of the tenancy.

I don't doubt some tenants have a flimsy idea of looking after someone else's property, but there are definitely landlords out there who think they can bully their tenants into accepting unfair agreements. The problem is when one tenant gives into unfair demands, the landlord is emboldened to try it on with subsequent tenants. Maybe they even convince themselves that they are in the right?

celeste83 · 05/08/2016 11:24

The key in tenancy agreements is the wording. 'Keep in good repair' means just that, keeping it in the condition you found it, whereas 'Put in good repair' means you have to make good any problems that were already there when you moved in. It maybe you are expected to clean up to a better standard than how you found it depending on the wording.

TrivialPursuit · 05/08/2016 11:25

Unfair contracts are invalid and that would include ones which charge market rent but require "put in good repair" .

ShoeEatingMonster · 05/08/2016 11:49

Well still no word from the letting agents so we've sent an email today basically saying that because they haven't responded to our request for a breakdown of deductions we assume this means they are not making any and that the email is to be taken as our written request to return our full deposit within the 10 working days. Also that if they want to make deductions we need to see a breakdown, copy of the inventory check in that we had to give them and proof of professional cleaners prior to the start of the tenancy etc.

I walked the dog past earlier and saw which I presumed to be the cleaner as it wasn't the landlady.

Let's see what/if they come back to us with.

OP posts:
poochiepants · 05/08/2016 12:08

Have rented lots, here and overseas, and really the property should be left in a fit state to rent out immediately and there shouldn't be anything that the LL has to do to get it to that state. Sorry. I've always made sure all of those little things are done, and even gone back if we've left ahead of the final date to double check. You don't know how reasonable or otherwise the LL will be, so I always assume the worst, and I've not been caught out yet.

There have been a couple of times I've moved back to the UK ahead of my DP, and he has been caught out ££ by not giving it such a detailed check-over!!! He should have listened to me.....Confused

It really wouldn't take you long to do all of that so maybe suggest you will organise it i.e. do it yourself (marks that don't come out, you'll have to negotiate on).

And next time, when you do the moving-in inventory check, take photos of anything that might come back to haunt you at the end of the lease and send the photos by email (then they are dated) to the agent or LL, then you are covered to argue your case at the other end.....if the checking agent takes photos, you should still take and send photos too.

Good luck!

Tallulahoola · 05/08/2016 13:43

A letting agency once tried to do this to me. I pointed out that when I moved in to what was supposedly a professionally cleaned flat I found a pair of dirty knickers under the bed Shock

Still had to argue with them for weeks before they finally gave up trying to charge me.

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