To be gutted that I won't be getting tax credits for 3rd child?

[GutenTag]

I'm just wondering what people's opinion is really.

We are trying for a 3rd child and I won't be getting any tax credits for this child as the government has changed the rules so that from next year tax credits are only paid for up to a maximum of 2 children.

I currently receive around £1k of TC for the kids and I would have received £4k for the 3rd if the government hadn't made the changes.

That would have meant an extra £250 a month. It's a lot of money for us. My DH works and I'm a SAHM. We have a £100k mortgage on a small house in a deprived area of town. We get by. We don't have much money left each month and I need to save literally for everything. I'm really really gutted. I really wanted 3 kids and this has meant that I'll be financially alot worse off now.

Of course I don't expect the government to "pay" for my children but it would have really helped, that's all. It would have eased the pressure off.

Just for the record we have never received any other benefits apart from JSA when DH was made redundant last year which was a godsend as we would have been homeless otherwise.

Do you think AiBU to feel/ think like this?

Tax credits annoy me - they are a subsidy for employers to pay low wages and to enable living costs to rise despite low wages eg BTL rents and house prices moving ever higher
When my dcs were young tax credits did not exist - were not needed.
I feel sorry for parents nowadays having to rely on them and facing having the rug pulled from under their feet by government policy changes.

I agree that 3 children is a luxury that a government shouldn't have to support but can I just point out that to afford 2 children would be impossible without government help for many.

A family I know (I don't know what help they get but it's impossible to survive on what I do know)
CIrca £1000 per month take home for 40 hours retail work by DH . Private rent approx £800 pm. Wife doesn't work but if she did would be another retail job.She could bring in £1000 max but if she had to pay childcare for 2 children how much would be left? They would both probably need to have irregular childcare hours too as their shop/previous shop was open 9am to 8pm. Hours are often only told 2 weeks in advance. The wife might be on a zero/4 hour contract and hours expected to work may vary. She has no experience in anything other than retail so would probably find it difficult to find other work.

I've only recently had my eyes opened to the realities of how some people are screwed by their life choices. It's easy for us to say if you can't afford it dont have it but it's not that straight forward for some.

I agree the cut off point should be 3 children but I do have sympathy for people who rely on tax credits etc (rather than see them as a bonus as suggested up thread) and make decisions based on these.

They aren't a subsidy for employers, some jobs just don't demand a high salary as no skill involved.

Many simply want x children, don't want a job or do a few token hours to get round the benefit cap. That's not employers fault but lazy entitled people who believe the world owes them the life they want.

Vi mean I agree that it should be capped at 2 children.

Our son has an ASD diagnosis and we don't claim disability benefits. I don't think we really need them, and the process of getting the diagnosis was so brutal (all those questionnaires where you are invited to tell them how difficult life with your child is) that the thought of filling in another massive form (well massive booklet actually) about how terrible life is was just not something we could cope with. For the amount of money available, I imagine there are very few people who go through all this just for the cash, and that there is such scrutiny of disability benefits that those receiving them will actually really need them. Like the family I know whose ASD diagnosis also involved dealing with serious and long-term continence issues.

I've known a few, OOA, I must admit. In the majority of cases the child didn't have a disability though.

My daughter has an Autism diagnosis too. You don't do it for benefits. She is very severely disabled and has an impaired quality of life. I do get benefits for her - high rate care and low rate mobility DLA as well as tax credit premiums. I'm quite offended that people think she is diagnosed for money though. She is diagnosed because she is disabled and needs help and support, just as someone with a physical disability does.

People aren't saying she is diagnosed for money.

Yes they did.

I don't get why the op js getting so much stick tbh, a good proportion on mumsnetters are SAHM who have partners on low incomes and large families whilst knowing that the tax credit system will pick up the slack. They arent any different to the op

No, I didn't. I said allegedly some families try for a diagnosis to increase benefits.(regardless of if the child has disabilities or not)

And the ops current award is miniscule, it's less than a hundred pounds each month which suggests to me her dh is on a sustainable wage (( they wouldnt starve if the tcs stopped )). Why doesnt everyone pick on the people on here who wouldnt be able to manage at all without the hundreds of pounds the recieved in tax credits each week ?? Imo knowingly having children in that sort of set up.is wrong.

OP here!

I did realise this wasn't going to go down well but wanted people's opinions.

I clearly stated that I didn't expect the government to pay for my child. It would have helped that's all. There is a huge difference which I think alot of you don't seem to understand.

As for me working, I already have a job lined up in September when my youngest will start school. It's part time, not much, which is what I can only do as childminder for pick ups etc would be too expensive. I left my job when I had my first child because it wasn't feasible to go back to work due to childcare costs.

I don't agree with most of the cuts the government have made either, some have which have negatively affected members of my/ DHs family.

As for the current tax credits I receive I have only started receiving this from this year. Up until now I have only ever received Child benefit for the kids.

I am not some benefit scrounge popping out children for cash!

Well you certainly got some opinions OP.

silly I read that as some people push for a diagnosis for their child for ASD who do not actually have it for the benifits. Obviously children with disabilities should get help as it is a lot harder for parents to return to work as a lot of time suitable child care arrangements cannot be made

OP's back!
I hear what you're saying OP - if you can't afford it without the additional benefits, don't do it! It would be great if we could all do what we would really like to in life but it's not always possible! (Dreams of 5 DC and big house...)

GutenTag if you don't expect the TC how can you be upset that you won't get it for a 3rd child? Sounds like a contradiction to me...?

How is there a huge difference? You made the choice to stay home and have more children and claim benefits yet you don't feel your help is the same as others who have had children and claimed benefits?

If you couldn't afford childcare for one child then it sounds like you can't even afford one let alone three.

So you're basically skint and you want the tax payer to subsidise your life choices.

I clearly stated that I didn't expect the government to pay for my child. It would have helped that's all.

so why are you 'gutted' then? Seems like kind of an over reaction if it's not going to impact you that much.

You are starting a new job and ttc? Will you get mat pay etc?

I'm afraid, OP, that I agree that if you can't afford a third child you should either stick at two or find a way of improving your family income through paid work.

Families who aren't entitled to tax credits, and there must be plenty out there who are just over the threshold with a total earned income similar to your total income including tax credits, don't get a pay rise for each subsequent child.

I don't think it is fair that you should expect your income to be automatically increased just because you'd like more children when people who are just outside the threshold have to make stark choices about what they can afford.

My parents had to make the decision to stick at two children because they just couldn't afford any more. My own circumstances are completely different but money is a very real factor in my decision to stick at one despite an overwhelming desire for more.

how many hours does your husband work?....my niece is a sahm, her partner works 20 hours a week (3 children) so that he can get maximum tax credits....this is why the govt has made changes....to stop people working minimum hours to get maximum tax credits....it was not a well thought out thing in the first place....it was meant to help low paid families not to let people 'fiddle' the system, which is what has happened....its enabled people to come off benefits and to continue to get by on govt handouts by working the least amount of hours possible....and to continue to have any many children as possible because they dont have to support them....im only supreised it took people a while to cotton on to this fiddle....and that the govt took so long to cotton on as well!

I'd guess the new job would be to gain maternity pay and then the OP would not return. If she can't afford childcare now she won't be paying it when another comes along.

Children come with expenses, I anticipate in a few years when all the children are at school the OP will be moaning about costs.

You may want three but your children don't deserve a life of scrapping by just to fulfil your wish. You can barely afford two let alone three and if he husband was to leave or fall ill you'd have nothing.

Just read your update, OP regarding why you gave up work. My DH and I work opposite hours to each other to avoid childcare costs. It means we tend to operate like a tag team but it meant we could both work to support ourselves. Is there no way you could do this too?

It's such a bloody shame that a system devised to help those in need has been allowed to be abused by the few making it difficult for those in genuine need.