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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

...were there any consequences?

73 replies

Tamesa · 29/07/2016 22:18

I have a 16 year old boy and find this really really upsetting. AIBU to wonder has the accuser suffered any consequences?
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/07/29/mother-of-son-who-hanged-himself--after-being-falsely-accused-of/

OP posts:
Mummyme1987 · 30/07/2016 19:53

Obviously you can't tell if it's true or not in any case really.

MrsTerryPratchett · 30/07/2016 19:56

It's not very common according to the CPS. Unlike rapes that never go to trial or get convictions. Those are very common.

...were there any consequences?
wombthereitis · 30/07/2016 19:57

It's wrong to say it's not common without any actual evidence to back that up Hmm

wombthereitis · 30/07/2016 19:57

To say it is common, rather.

SpeakNoWords · 30/07/2016 20:05

OP, do you want the girl in question to have suffered consequences and if so, what did you have in mind?

LifeInJeneral · 30/07/2016 20:07

My partner is currently in prison serving 6 years due to false allegations of rape by his ex partner. He was with his ex for 8 years and they have a son together but she was sleeping with his best mate. He found out they were in a hotel together and told her to come home, so she told the police that he had been raping her in her sleep throughout the whole relationship. She then told the police it was not true and she was blackmailed into making the statement by the police officer and raised a formal complaint against the officer (the judge pointed out this was a criminal offence to lie avout). She then dropped all charges and carried.on seeing them both for months until she got pregnant with the other guys kid (asked my partner to take her to abortion clinic to get rid)..decided to keep baby but stopped seeing him. Months later he tried to get access to see his son via a solicitor letter, a day later she went back to police and said it was true after all..went to court but of course no possible way to prove you are innocent so despite no proof and a lot of evidence of her lying (Including hand written diary etc) jury found him guilty of 4 counts (but not guilty of 9 counts). We have a 6 month old baby, he has been in prison for 5 of them. False allegations ruin lives, not only have I lost a partner I have also lost his support both emotionally and financially. Even if he gets his conviction overturned she will get to keep her £40k victims compensation. Her dad is a solicitor so she will have known about the compensation, pretty sure this was her motivation.
The thing is it's very easy to make up a story and in rape cases such as this you can't even prove whether a crime was ever committed let alone prove you are innocent.

Mummyme1987 · 30/07/2016 20:07

The accusations I was talking about were the ones not necessarily made to the police. It was a subject that came up during a conversation I had with a family lawyer. I was there about something else but he said accusations are often thrown about in family court including rape, abuse of the woman and children. He was very blasé about it when I looked shocked and said " it wasn't uncommon for false accusations to be made and were often sorted by the court". My total knowledge, as I've never been in family court but I assumed he knew what he was talking about.

LoreleiGilmoreIsMyBFF · 30/07/2016 20:16

I really don't like this thread. None of us know the truth behind the allegations, and speculation will not change the fact that a mother and her son are both dead. If the allegations are true, then the poor girl in question will likely never get justice for what has happened to her, and will probably be even less likely to persue it in the light of these awful events. If they are false, I imagine she feels pretty bloody awful right now. It is a tragedy involving three people. Surely arguments over whether or not the accusation was true are irrelevant? None of us know. Isn't it better to leave this family in peace and move on?

2kids2dogsnosense · 30/07/2016 20:18

Obviously none of us know all of the details about this - but I think that if he had been guilty, he would not now be dead. Any man/boy who is prepared to take advantage of a woman/girl will not be torturing himself about it, and I doubt that such a man would kill himself. It is unlikely that the accusation will have been known to others - the police are very discreet about these things - and it strikes me that he must have been so distraught and upset about someone he considered a friend - perhaps who he was even in love with - has made such a horrible accusation. I'm not a psychologist, so I may be totally wrong, I know.

Accusations can only be proven false if the case actually goes to court - and it will not go to court if there is no evidence. The police treat every allegation very seriously, and had there been evidence to take it further, then they would have done.

Some men rape, and equally some women make false accusations. The only person who really KNOWS what happened is the young woman involved, and whose conscience may or may not be clear.

SpeakNoWords · 30/07/2016 20:22

2kids you absolutely cannot say anything about whether or not this young man was guilty or not based on the fact that he killed himself.

I agree that this thread is unpleasant. It's all speculation and surmising as no one here knows any if the details at all.

MammouthTask · 30/07/2016 20:31

Aren't false allegation a crime when you are telling a lie on purpose to accuse someone of something they haven't done?

I think it's very different from someone accusing somebody of a crime and the courts thinking there isn't enough proof to say that person is guilty (aka the person isn't proven innocent. But there isn't enough/any proof they are guilty even though they could be guilty).

MammouthTask · 30/07/2016 20:33

Life I have seen a similar case than yoour DP but it happened because the man in question had been advised by his lawyer to lead guilty (to a lesser charge) on the ground that the sentence would be evry very light. Except that the judge decided otherwise....
Did something similar happen to your DP then?

mirime · 30/07/2016 20:33

I don't think that his suicide says anything about his guilt or innocence. And surely the police wouldn't take it further if the alleged victim withdrew the allegation - something which also proves nothing about what actually happened.

Mummyme1987 · 30/07/2016 20:38

Not sure what this thread is really asking. It's awful for everyone involved and the truth will never be known. Not much point to this thread really. Nothing has been proved so how can there be consequences? Bit goady really.

Pearlman · 30/07/2016 20:44

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

grannytomine · 30/07/2016 20:44

Ateno, in this country you are innocent until proved guilty. Nothing was proved against him. He might have done it but legally he was innocent.

cbigs · 30/07/2016 20:44

How can you leave your daughter though. She seems to be the victim in all this now. Awful

Atenco · 30/07/2016 20:47

I suppose the only reason that I have posted on the thread is because some people seem to think it is a proven that the accuser made false allegations and is morally responsible for his and his mother's suicide, whereas we are in fact totally in the dark about the truth of this matter.

As for suicide proving him innocent, I cannot see that.

mirime · 30/07/2016 20:48

Grannytomine - same goes for the accuser. She's not been found guilty of anything either.

grannytomine · 30/07/2016 20:49

LifeInJeneral, that is a very sad case. Is he appealing?

Pearlman · 30/07/2016 21:08

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

ToadsJustFellFromTheSky · 30/07/2016 21:24

What consequences did you have in mind OP?

The accusation wasn't proven to be false.

All we know is that she made an accusation but then withdrew it a few weeks later. He later killed himself.

Neither of those things prove that the accusation was false.

ToadsJustFellFromTheSky · 30/07/2016 21:28

The article said he had a history of depression.

Exactly.

He had a history of depression and low mood even before the accusation was made.

Just because someone has depression does not mean they can't also be a rapist. The two aren't mutually exclusive.

The fact is we don't know what happened.

He may well of raped her. Or she may well have made the whole thing up. We don't know because neither scenario has been proven and likely never will be.

Mummyme1987 · 30/07/2016 21:31

As I said above Pearlman, I was told it by a family lawyer.

ToadsJustFellFromTheSky · 30/07/2016 21:35

I wonder what the response would have been if it was the girl who killed herself after withdrawing her complaint?

Do you think people would be saying how horrible it was that she killed herself after being raped and couldn't go through with the investigation and trial? Do you think there would be people after the boys blood and demanding he should be thrown in prison for raping that poor innocent girl who has now took her own life?

Or do you think it is much more likely that people would still be on the side of the boy and still be calling her a liar? Because obviously she withdrew her complaint which obviously makes the accusation false and then oh, she killed herself because she knew she was a liar and she knew she would likely get caught?

I have a feeling it would be the latter scenario.