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AIBU?

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Original poster

Is my definition of smart casual unreasonable... DS17 thinks so!

62 replies

kurlique · 29/07/2016 11:29

DS has work experience in an office looming and he has been told to dress casual smart... To me this means trousers - not jeans - with a shirt - not a T shirt - and shoes - not canvas deck shoes. DS was a bit eye rolly about no jeans but has conceded to this and the shirt wasn't an issue but he thinks that I am unreasonable when I say that it is not ok for him to wear his "smarter" (ie clean and not wrecked) black Vans canvas deck shoes. Now it is a long time since I worked in an office but canvas shoes just seems too casual to me. What do you think?!

OP posts:
OliviaStabler · 29/07/2016 12:28

No canvas shoes.

Acornantics · 29/07/2016 12:28

Definitely proper shoes, no jeans but yes to open necked shirt or even a smart polo shirt. I work with a lot of young 20s colleagues and they don't wear jeans/trainers apart from dress down Fridays.

Dress for the job you want, not the one you have is perhaps a good starting point. ...

LikeDylanInTheMovies · 29/07/2016 12:36

I'd say shirt with collar (polo borderline)

Chinos, corduroy or dark smart jeans

Nothing obviously trainer like, but casual shoes (deck shoes, desert boots, camper style) are fine.

No large logos and relatively muted colours.

carabos · 29/07/2016 12:38

Smart casual to me means no tie, no jacket, no t-shirt, no trainers. The right sort of jeans can be smart casual IMO.

MatildaTheCat · 29/07/2016 12:38

This reminds me od ds doing work experience. He was told that trousers and sports jacket type outfit rather than a suit. How his face fell when he discovered what a sports jacket was not his Nike hoodie Grin

He now works in a techy office and wears jeans and shirt and is considered very smartly dressed.

ChicRock · 29/07/2016 12:40

Smart casual to me means no jacket and tie.

He needs to wear suit trousers, open neck shirt, proper shoes.

NapQueen · 29/07/2016 12:41

Surely at 17 he should be deciding for himself? Sure, he may be too casual or too smart but that really isn't your concern - his reputation and his decision.

Walk away op.

LikeDylanInTheMovies · 29/07/2016 12:48

nap at 17 it will almost certainly be his first visit to a professional workplace and after 11 years of having to wear a uniform it is not unduly clingy to offer advice on what ambiguous phrases like 'smart casual' mean.

PersianCatLady · 29/07/2016 12:49

You know this already but just to confirm you are right and he is wrong.

LikeDylanInTheMovies · 29/07/2016 12:54

Dress for the job you want, not the one you have is perhaps a good starting point

I tried that. Doesn't work. Apparently an astronaut's helmet, spacesuit and moon boots make working in a call centre difficult.

bbcessex · 29/07/2016 12:59

Going against the grain here.

I think a polo shirt, chinos and black vans would be absolutely fine for smart casual - especially for work experience.

My DS went to work experience in a media office - went smart the first day with 'proper' shoes, then completely scales it down to jeans and Converse for the rest of the week to fit in.

LellyMcKelly · 29/07/2016 13:08

Shirt, trousers, and proper shoes on the first day. After that, if it's acceptable office attire he can put on the jeans and Vans. It's better to be dressed too smartly that too casually when you want to make a good first impression. He should look like he's taking the job seriously, not like he's off down the skate park.

PigletJohn · 29/07/2016 13:16

some fantastic bargains
here if you happen to be the size they have left over and are trying to get rid of.

VaginaJones · 29/07/2016 13:20

Let him wear what he wants, one of the parts of working in an office is choosing something appropriate to wear. Plus if he get's it wrong it's no biggie as it's just a weeks work experience.

Togaparties · 29/07/2016 13:29

I would say that shirt, trousers and smart shoes would be business casual, smart casual to me is a step down from that so smart jeans/t shirt/ trainers

FlibbertigibbetArmadillo · 29/07/2016 13:38

Best bet like everyone else has said is go in possibly too smart and adjust.
My DP works in a smart casual office and he wears dark grey or black jeans and a good quality shirt no tie.
He goes in in converse coz he leaves his work shoes in the office as not comfortable to drive in.

Original poster
kurlique · 29/07/2016 14:06

Some 17 year olds are not that mature and mine definitely isn't. He has never been into an office environment before so how exactly is he meant to have an appropriate frame of reference from which to make a decision without guidance? If it was smart he would have no problem he knows what that means and he wears a suit for sixth form but I think it is clear just from the responses here that smart casual is a really grey area. He is pretty shy and call me clingy if you want but it was bloody difficult getting this placement and I don't want it to go badly because I left him completely unsupported.

On the back of the responses here we have discussed it again and he has agreed to go for some black non-suit but proper shoes... Shops here we come! (Will also be rather handy for going out with aged PILs next month!!)

OP posts:
YelloDraw · 29/07/2016 14:31

Business casual = suit trousers, shirt, no tie or jacket required.

Smart casual = smart trousers or smart jeans, polo or short and nice looking shoes - so you could wear nice canvas shoes, boat shoes etc. Don't have to be polished school shoes!

A 17 year old lad in nice jeans with stylish shoes and a nice polo shirt that suits him will look fine.

Charlesroi · 29/07/2016 14:31

Tell him to take it from one who's been in to lots of 'smart casual' (I bloody hate this vague term) workplaces - it's much more comfortable to overdress on your first day and adapt down than go the other way.
In some offices it means no tie/suit, in others it means clean jeans and matching socks.

I wish him luck on his placement!

PersianCatLady · 29/07/2016 14:32

Let him wear what he wants, one of the parts of working in an office is choosing something appropriate to wear.
Personally I wouldn't do that as I would hate for him to start his work experience badly.

I am surprised that they didn't say more to him than smart casual.

Is the office somewhere where you can pass by or pop in and have a look at what the members of staff there are already wearing?

BackforGood · 29/07/2016 14:42

On the first day, go in the suit trousers and shirt and shoes he wears for school, and then tell him to look around.
I suspect he'll find that is what they are all wearing, but if we are wrong, and people wear jeans . t-shirts. canvas shoes, etc., then he still has the rest of the placement to 'unsmarten' himself.
Always better to be too smart if unsure, rather than 'underdressed'

whyayepetal · 29/07/2016 14:43

Agree with Yello but would probably advise that he goes with business casual for day 1 - first impressions and all that jazz. DD17 did work experience a few weeks back and was told that her effort with her smart appearance and timekeeping was appreciated. If only they saw her at home Grin

CatsCantFlyFast · 29/07/2016 14:51

yello is correct. The very name tells you that it's smart casual wear. Jeans are casual wear, so smart jeans are fine. In my experience smart casual wear in offices includes jeans, with a shirt (or potentially polo shirt) for men and leather shoes (not trainers)

MackerelOfFact · 29/07/2016 15:25

This is the sort of outfit that would pass as 'smart-casual' most places I've worked (creative industry, so probably more casual than some):

This young chap
This veritable dude
This gentleman

PigletJohn · 29/07/2016 15:57

wot no sox?

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