I thought I was being kind

[Ninarina]

Hello all,
I have no one to talk to in RL so need some reassurance pls. My mum passed a few months ago and since then I've been helping my elderly dad. I do all the cooking and cleaning etc and don't go to my own home until I have cleared up after dinner. I have siblings but they are male so their private lives are more important. My dad mentioned taking me on a religious pilgrimage. I inwardly sighed as this is a place where there a huge crowds. My mum went one time and was scared and uncomfortable as my dad- tho he could afford it- paid for v basic accommodation. Females must go with male guardian. I know people say it's extremely spiritual and moving but I'm still grieving for my mum and probably have depression. I made no comment just non committal 'I will see' type thing. The next thing my dad was on phone to my bro calling me a 'non believer.' He's given me special 'blessed' water to drink to get rid of Satan in me. I would laugh but I'm so so hurt. I thought I was being a good daughter. I have started receiving counselling but he says this is wrong and I should pray instead. I just feel overwhelmed with sadness and don't want to see him again. Am I in the wrong? Why does he hate me so much? Thanks for reading

I'm sure that there are some Muslim women's groups that can offer advice. Please do go to counseling though.

Would any of your brothers, your father's friends or an imam at his mosque stand up for you if you explained the situation? Hajj is a big deal, and you shouldn't be forced to do it if you don't feel up to it (especially this year, the heat is horrendous in these parts right now! worse than previous years).

Good luck and hugs xx.

Could you inform your brothers that as your father considers you to be an unbeliever possessed by a devil, you realise as a dutiful daughter that it is wrong of you to contaminate his house with your presence, so they are going to have to pick up the slack

Take out the "could you". Just tell your brothers what nocoolnamesleft posted and leave them to it. He obviously has little respect for women.

Thank you for practical advice. Good to get away for a few days and be indisposed. I'm devastated he thinks I'm godless. I'm not the most ritualistic but I thought I was being a good Muslim through my actions! He goes to mosque and fasts all the time but expects me to be there when he's back/ ready with meals. Ironically he doesn't approve of women at the mosque- women should be at home in his opinion. You wouldn't think he's actually highly educated and outwardly liberal. He's hurt me so much even tho I don't expect much from him but I will not let him turn me into my mum. She was incredibly brave to put up with him but under these circumstances I won't last six months. He will destroy me if I let him. Looking back he's always been a bully and one bro with family is practically NC. But then he will present himself to others in a way they feel sorry for him. When people came to see him for condolences he was reciting poetry and crying and people were saying how lovely he is how caring etc.
I'm feeling v fragile barely slept last night. I actually envy my mum right now x

I thought I was being a good Muslim through my actions!

You are, and I'm not a Muslim, but from what I've been led to believe Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) was a pretty big believer in actions speaking louder than words. So I would rest easy in that respect.

Are you married? If so, you're husband needs to go talk to your father as well. Because if your father is only going to listen to the strict tenets of Islam, than he knows your duty to your husband comes before your duty to him, and if your husband understands what your fathers demands are doing to you mentally, than he can easily make the case that waiting on your father hand and foot and being emotionally abused by him is affecting him.

You are being a good person..,your father isn't the one who gets to judge if you are being a good Muslim!

You need to withdraw from your father to protect yourself.

Ninarina , you say one of your brothers has distanced himself already from your father . I would contact him and gain some strength from supporting each other over this .
You are not in the wrong here , your father is being a bully .

Do you have your own family unit to support you? Are there others within the community that you could turn to for support? You sound strong with a decent sense of self worth. You will find a way to build a life again. It sounds like you need female company and support in real life.

You are not a 'non believer' but you are in a potentially dangerous situation
Your brothers private lives are not more important than yours
Your father is an unpleasant man
Contact a support group urgently and consider nc with your father
TheSunsNotYellowItsChicken is an arse but has a point

Tell him that you help with a good heart but you find it wearing because you already run one household and his bulling is making it impossible to continue.

or if you need a more subtle route. Each time he bullies you, don't help him for the next day or two. Repeat this every time he bullies you until he gets the message that you distance yourself when he behaves badly. You only help when he's nice. You will need to be consistent as you would with a small child. You could also tell him that each time he bullies you, it makes you want to withdraw and it makes you need a break to cope

This worked a treat with my MIL as we had similar poor behaviour

My dad is in his 70s but capable of cooking for himself/ driving to shops.

so stop doing it.

When my nana passed (16 years ago) my aunts (there are no males) all did everything for my grandad, who was more than Capable of doing it himself.

Quite frankly, they didn't help him. He had nothing to do. He started deteriorating mentally and physically as all he was doing was sitting in a chair waiting for people to do stuff for him. And even then it wasn't enough.

My (male cousin) offered to cut his lawn on a Tuesday. But he didn't arrive early enough (9am) so grandad phones his mum calling him all sorts. It made no difference to grandad wether it was done at 9am or 10am.

And yes he became even more religious than he was before. I think mainly because he didn't have anything to do. He also became very judgmental of everyone.

Quite honestly, if you are doing things for your dad, that he can do himself, I don't see why your brothers should help. It's your choice. He doesn't need caring for.

Once grandad got bad enough to actually need care and developed dementia, I also helped care for him. But I wasn't going to to do it while it was a choice for them.

You need to take a step back. I am sorry you are having such a bad time of it. But you need to take a step back for your own physical & mental health.

Oh and yes grandad would tell anyone that would listen that no one visited. Five daughters were in and out all day and 13 grandkids all visited at least once a week each.

Ninarina, please do seek help through a support group, either the one already given or another because you really do deserve better and I am sure your God would agree. From my understanding, Islam is supposed to be a supportive religion and women are not supposed to be bullied. The women are supposed to be revered but it seems that parts of it do get twisted to suit a male bully's manipulation. You are in a difficult situation living in a westernised society if your family want you to adhere to their traditional values and that will be very difficult to reconcile, especially if you are depressed which will make you very vulnerable. Maybe you could seek support from your GP too for the depression. You probably have an uphill battle ahead of you but armed with the right support, you can come out the other side feeling better about yourself. I bet any of the men in my family would think you are a wonderful daughter.

I read your post this morning, but haven't had time to reply until now.

In a way your F has done you a favour by so blatantly disregarding your mental health and emotional wellbeing, otherwise you'd have gone on gradually increasing your level of care to him until without realising it you'd given up your life to him.

However he's dialled up the ante too quickly, and despite being a dutiful and caring DD it's given you enough pause for thought to post here.

It suits all the members of your family apart from you to become your DF's carer. Your DF has someone to boss around. your DBs don't need to try to get their DW's involved or indeed themselves, and they can boss you around because of family traditions and structure.

Some people have urged you to try to speak to a women's group or help within your own faith. I think that's a great idea as ultimately staying in this dynamic is really unhealthy for you, but you need to find some sort of resolution that you can live with.

Good luck.

Your DF is out of line and a bully and from what you say, he always was. Remember actions speak louder than words, he can fast and do all the outward shows of piety but his behaviour behind closed doors shows what is really in his heart.

I am Christian and DH is Muslim. He has done Hajj and even as a tall fit bloke (who is also a mother tongue arabic speaker) he found the crowds etc. quite tricky. He was on a well organised tour with reasonable accommodation. I wonder how practical it would be for you to go with your father and no other males or females anyway - I assume things like sleeping accommodation would have to be separate. It would be different if he was proposing a family group where you would be with other women and your brothers would be there to run around after him.

I would push things on to your brothers a bit more. Say that your Father seems to be upset when you are around so you will leave his care to them so as not to distress him any further.

I would also look for help from somewhere like the Muslim Woman Network.

I wonder how practical it would be for you to go with your father and no other males or females anyway.

I agree with Chaz here. Just you and your 70-year-old DF doesn't sound like a very safe idea. You could very well end up getting separated by the crowds. If you are in a group, it is far easier to find one of four or five people than just trying to find one.

I am not entirely convinced by the organisation of the Hajj in terms of health and safety these days either.

Look after yourself here. You sound quite strong which is good, you absolutely shouldn't let your dad treat you like he treated your mother.

Thanks to everyone who replied with advice. I have decided that there is huge difference between duty and being a doormat so I'm going to spend more time at my own home. I need to reboot my career and spend time on myself. I still think it's outrageous my dad thinks I'm possessed as what kind of Satan just cooks and cleans and does laundry. I'm not even satan in my own home. I need some time away and have arranged to see an old friend this weekend. I will continue with counselling. Thanks x

Glad you're taking some "you time"!
I have a muslim friend who is often pressured into family responsibilities - even though she has about 7 brothers who are perfectly capable of doing stuff and don't have three young children to raise.

This is actually nothing to do with your Dads religious beliefs it's to do with him being a nasty controlling bully.

Please don't let him manipulate you or make you feel guilty. Also, pkease, please don't worry about what everyone else thinks - do what is right for you and ignore everyone else