To be worried that these random terrorist attacks are our new way of life?

[Cguk81]

Having just seen the news about another horrific attack at a shopping mall in Munich I can't help but feel that this is becoming a way of life from now on. Will it ever come to an end or is it just going to get worse and worse and something we are all going to have to live with. I find it so terrifying.
And as I'm typing this I can hear Donald Trump's acceptance speech for the presidential nomination on the news which makes the future seem even more terrifying. How can I stop living in fear of the future? I feel like taking my family and heading for the hills.

Everyone is afraid and blaming someone else, another religion or whatever. But it really isnt helping. We heed to work with kids (coz these are kids) in schools to not get sucked in to radicalism and make our communities stronger. I dont see much of that happening. This isnt just an islamic problem. So much hate is prevalent right now on social media. Its fueling the fires

As a forces wife in the 80s I lived with the fear that the IRA would send a parcel bomb to our married quarter
We were instructed not to accept any parcels if we had not ordered them
I don't think Isis is going to post out a bomb to your house

OP I understand how you feel. I'm a Londoner and pride myself in getting on with things but have to admit, lately wherever I go I find myself scoping out exits and people watching more. I suffer mild anxiety - sporadic thankfully, I have so much sympathy who deal with GAD ongoingly - and this can sometimes make things worse too.

I don't think there's an answer, like many people have said you have to live your live and try to calculate risk sensibly without it taking over your life - sometimes easier said than done I know.

The level of news coverage and social media does desensitise us to a point I think - these random attacks get slightly less shocking and more "oh god please not again" and I sometimes feel like I'm just waiting to hear about the next one :-/

Having said that, yes it is different as terrorism like everything has evolved, but there have been dark times before - as many have said regarding NI etc - terrible, terrible times that people survived and came through and I think we should take hope from that.

Saddened to see some of the earlier comments in the thread about NI - for what it's worth, I care - I was only young at the time but I remember hearing about it often and it's always stayed with me. I don't understand the attitutide of some - that NI somehow wasn't as terrible. It's not a competition, suffering is suffering.

Fear & hate breeds fear & hate. If you are accepted in society and a part of the community, you're much less likely to attack that community than if you have been excluded from society in some way, whether through racism (physical, vocal, from the media, or even the unspoken more subtle forms of it), bullying, or through things such as being unable to integrate due to language or other difficulties. In those situations people feel totally excluded from society and in some cases may become angry at society (And to add to that, think about the fact that for some people, they are living in a country which is actually bombing their home country!). A minuscule minority of these people are driven to awful attacks whether through their own initiative or because groups like IS are able to get to them.

Despite all this marginalisation and exclusion from society, still the vast majority of these people are nice people who wouldn't dream of this kind of thing.

The best way I know to combat it is to accept that yes, it could happen to you or your loved ones, but instead of being fearful or hateful, to make an effort to reach out to those who are in some way excluded from society, and help show them that they are welcome. Whether they are at risk of 'radicalisation' or not, no one should be made to feel excluded from society without good reason (and in the event of good reason, that's what prison is for!).

Anyway I live in a very, very multicultural area in Germany (but am not German myself). They say there is someone from every country in the world living in my area of town or near enough. If I was as fearful as most of the people on this thread, I'd never leave the house, yet I do and I love how interesting the mix of people makes the area. Yesterday I was at a market watching Turkish and African bands playing while people from various different countries, but mainly Germans, danced with their children to the beautiful music. Last week I was at another market and for the first time in my life saw a trio from India performing Bollywood style dancing which had the whole very diverse crowd grinning and cheering them on.

I love living here and feel sorry for the few racists I've met here (you get them everywhere after all) as they are really missing out on wonderful people and experiences.

So that's a long way of saying that murder is very, very wrong, but the absolute worst way to deal with these attacks when they happen is to become fearful and hateful of other people. That will only breed more violence one way or another.

FWIW I subscribe to this magazine, which is quarterly and compiles more hopeful / optimistic news stories (I wouldn't say I agreed with the viewpoint on every story, but it is a breath of fresh air sometimes!)

www.positive.news

I think you just have to keep on living - move away from a city if it makes you feel safer, but one can't just stop because you're worried about something that could happen.

These terrorist attacks are horrible and scary, but when you think within living memory we've had the IRA (not dissimilar) and the World Wars where thousands of families sent away their husbands and sons to fight - they had to keep going, and looking at it totally dispassionately, the odds of something happening there were a lot higher.

I suppose the difference is now that there isn't that feeling if coming together against a common enemy - we should all be against extremism but people are worried that they'll become a target or be called racist if they do. I'm not sure what can be done about that really.

But even though it is worrying, my flowers need watering, I'm cooking dinner for my grandma next week, a friend is coming down for the day and introducing me to her fiancé - in real terms I just get on with things and hope for the best. Stuck inside constantly worrying is only going to hurt me, it won't do anything to the terrorists or extremists.

So we should only expect to have our children blown to bits in dept stores, night clubs because - we:

a) have an armaments industry,

b) it doesn't rain enough anymore and

c) best of all, "There's not enough work for everybody?

Is it just me, or is anyone else out there gasping in disbelief at the utter idiocy of this?

Of course the Islamist murder events we're seeing almost daily now, has everything to do with water shortages and evil Western capitalist interests. Nothing at all to do with the Jihadists desire to expand the domination of Islam to all corners of the world, which is in line with Prophet Muhammad's incessant effort to spread Islam through ceaseless wars against the non-Muslim communities and territories in his life-time. Nor has it anything to do with the justifications for constant violence via Jihad against Khafirs, that's embedded in the doctrines of the Koran, Sira and Hadith? No, It's down to water shortages and western apathy. How silly of me. What was I thinking?

You see folks. Islam, by developing a philosophy that denied the existence of physical laws, no laws of nature - cause and effect. A philosophy that's entirely anti-science, is not the main contributing factor to poverty and lack of educational achievement in muslim countries or why no muslims has ever won any Nobel prizes to this day? This is all down to the Western apathy over climate change and US foreign policy - got it?

We know that Bin-Laden and the (all but 1 Saudi born) 9/11 nutters were all uneducated, unemployed, paupers who had to slog round all day in arid fields, trying to feed themselves?As was the perpetrator of the massacre on the Tunisian beach last year, who murdered 38 people? (A university educated, electrical engineer in reality) But obviously a victim of evil western capitalism too!

Sana Ahmed Khan, convicted December 2015 of plotting to become Britain’s first female suicide bomber on the tenth anniversary of 7/7. A teaching assistant, brought up in middle class comfort in Reading, Dad a chauffeur, Mum a JP, school governor and council manager. She becomes another victim of grinding deprivation forced on her by the evil West. Get the picture?

Jihadi John - brought up in affluent NW London, a graduate of business management from the University of Westminster and was regarded as an excellent salesman at the IT company where he worked. Another one?

Lee Rigby's murderers - medical students.
Bilal Abdullah, the Glasgow airport attacker - an NHS doctor.

What of the Blackburn shop keeper murdered by his coreligionist. Because he committed the appalling crime of wishing his customers a “Happy Easter”?

MI5's 2011 report revealed that two-thirds of British terror suspects were from middle-class backgrounds. “There is no simplistic relationship between poverty and involvement with Islamic extremism,” said the report. But we'll ignore that - in favour of a 'muslims are our victims' narrative.

Its truly amazing how, via this type of self loathing, leftist discourse, manages to translate murdering fundamentalists, to hapless deprived, poverty stricken, uneducated victim, with no access to clean water - perpetually suffering at our hands. They had no choice but to become IS butchers and murdering Jihadits you see. We drove them to it, obviously!

To be deadly serious - this blather about poverty, the arms trade and climate change is very insulting to people who live in genuinely tough circumstances but are never remotely inspired to murder innocent civilians.

The West, particularly Europe, has bent over backwards to welcome Muslims in ( I can personally testify to that) , yet in every country, especially recently, this tolerance has been rewarded with rape, sexual abuse/harassment of women, robbery, muggings, mass murder events - galore and a refusal to integrate.

Islamic Jihad is offensive, has been going on for some 1400 years and is still going on to this very day. Right now there are, most likely, Christians being slaughtered somewhere in Nigeria. Jihad is embedded in Islamic doctrine. I suggest you email your hero, Mr Nye, blinkowl, and ask him what he knows, (besides Marxist conspiracy theories on Western "guilt") about the true nature of Islam, ie the rise of the Khalifs? Doctrines that are entirely hateful of non-muslims, nihilistic, blood thirsty and taken 100% literally by so many muslims world wide?

Of course the Islamist murder events we're seeing almost daily now, has everything to do with water shortages and evil Western capitalist interests.

I strongly disagree that there are daily atrocities linked to Islam. DAESH has become western societies "bogeyman" - a way of rationalising and justifying horrific events which are beyond our comprehension.

Take the Munich shootings. Nothing to do with DAESH or terrorism. A disaffected young man, who had received inadequate mental health care to address the issues he had. Yet, while the authorities were still looking for him, he was publicly branded a terrorist, along with non-existent accomplices, and reports fabricated as to his associations with Muslim extremism.

Yes, there are incidents where Islamic extremists have groomed vulnerable individuals who have gone on to commit mass murder and end their own life. Those people are not terrorists, they are victims of Islamic extremism, not perpetrators. They are not terrorists. Extremist grooming of the vulnerable in our society is not terrorism.

We are ignoring the fact that extremist groups have moved away from coordinated acts of violence to cause terror and have instead developed a form of psychological warfare in which members of our own community, who have been failed by us, are being turned against us in order to further extremist causes. All the while we refer to those victims are terrorists, we perpetuate the problem.

The moment you choose to hurt someon you move out of the victim zone into the predator zone. A line is crossed.

I think they are very much a part of our new life for now, yes.

I also think that climate change will play a major role as it unfolds.

bakewell No, we do not live in a society that believes that.

We live in a society that accepts that poor mental health, or any other imbalance of power, creates situations in which victims can be manipulated, persuaded or groomed into carrying out actions for which they are not held responsible.

There's always going to be something to worry about.
Continuous news coverage and all the speculation on social media makes the world seem more frightening. When the Munich shootings were happening people were speculating and making things up and some seemed to be revelling in it. As if they were hoping that things would get a lot worse.
People carried on with their lives during the IRA bombings, it was bad but imagine how much more frightening it would've been if there'd been the internet with continuous coverage and people with smartphones posting pictures of atrocities etc.

Well the lib Dems live in that mental space but many of the rest of us have a different view.

bakewell Legislation protects those vulnerable members of society who have been "groomed". It's not a LibDem ideal - it is written into law.

From crack-house closures to the sexual offences act, much of our recent legislation in England and Wales acknowledges and protects vulnerable and fragile individuals who have been manipulated into facilitating or carrying out what would otherwise be criminal offences.

Branding a vulnerable young man a terrorist, in order to avoid acknowledging that society has failed him, is short-sighted and dangerous. Communities should be challenging the authorities that have failed their most vulnerable, not ignoring the fact that there are those who take advantage of vulnerability.

Timeforannchange, have you even read supersoft's post or are you going to engage with the points she's made? Or are you just going to ignore the facts she's pointed out: that the majority of those who have joined Daesh and/or carried out terror attacks in the west are middle class and educated? Abdelhamid Abaaoud, the ringleader of the Paris attacks, went to a private school in Brussels and came from a well-off family. What debt does the evil west owe him? Or can you explain why we don't have Hindus, Sikhs or Buddhists blowing up Europeans even though they or their parents will have faced the challenges all immigrants face? No, didn't think so.

Yet another interesting and balanced thread being derailed.

vulnerable individuals who have gone on to commit mass murder and end their own life. Those people are not terrorists

While I understand your point as a whole, I don't agree with this. The act the person carried out caused terror, and in a way that links into a political ideal - surely that makes them a terrorist? I do agree that they are also a victim though.

shins I was not aware that supersofts post was in response to mine.
I have never mentioned the armaments industry, the environment or unemployment

I don't disagree with the fact that proven terrorist incidents, such as the ones in Paris, are linked to middle class, educated individuals who cannot attribute their radicalisation to deprivation in the west.

laura I'm not convinced those acts do link into a specific political ideal in the mind of the perpetrator though - we don't know how vulnerable individuals are being manipulated.

Are they being converted to the cause of the extremists? Or are they misled into thinking that committing mass murder will bring them something they themselves want?

Good points shins. Specific examples are what's needed. Sweeping statements help no one.

I strongly disagree that there are daily atrocities linked to Islam

Its my honest opinion that this kind of statement is the manifestation of the constant threat and brutality that fundamentalist Islam has produced in us here in the West. A mindset akin to that of the abused dog. The battered wife and the sexually abused child. A form of Stockholm syndrome.

But I'm an optimist, I believe that there exists a vast majority of rational, intelligent people out there, who do not invest in conspiracy theories and deny the unfortunate truth : that Islamic jihad, which is 1400 years old, and for which ISIS just the latest incarnation of. Has given us the world the threat of the the Shariah and Hadith doctrines, Dhimmis, slavery, mass kidnapping and constant war and continues to do so.

There have been sover 19,000 Jihad attacks since 9/11, all over the world - Nigeria, Philippines, Brazil, Madrid, London, Paris, Brussels, Germany, Amsterdam, Thailand the list goes on.. Muslims kill not only Khafirs but also their fellow co religionists, in general, an Islamist will just as readily kill a Hindu, Sheikh, Buddhist, Jew, Confucian Christian and even the secularists, just as readily as the do each other. We are all Khafirs all of us non-Muslims and therefore deserve to die. However Muslim on Muslim violence is immense and happens in Syria today just as it did the Iran/Iraq war. All of the violence and battles created by expansionist Islam before 1922 was state sponsored by the Khalif, but nowadays the difference is , it is non-state - Jihad is the difference - That's all..

It is a very real and present threat to the world.

supersoft I'll rephrase my comment as it was poorly worded

I strongly disagree that there are daily atrocities linked to Islam that take place in or are brought to the attention of the western world via the media

Yes, there are daily atrocities across the globe linked to Islam.

But there have been many recent atrocities in Europe which are being attributed to an Islamic cause erroneously. A disaffected young man in Munich, a petty criminal in Nice, an attempted kidnapping of a soldier in the UK. No evidence that the perpetrators were committed to and motivated by an extremist Islamic cause.

Yes, there are daily atrocities across the globe linked to Islam Fair play to you for the correction there. Though I still think you are clutching at straws somewhat. There's no official inquiry or outcome yet about Munich, save for a few statements relating to the findings so far and they do not prove anything.

RE : the Nice murderer, ISIS praised his actions on social media. They have often used vehicles during attacks, packing them with weapons and explosives. and have encouraged this practice by posting tutorial videos on their website. The Nice murderer shouted ‘Allahu Akbar' as he opened fire on innocent civilians and the French Police are still working on whether or not he acted alone ( I'm quite sure I know what this bloodthirsty freaks motivations were) but until the Police conclude we ought to reserve passing judgement, I suppose..

This was said of Omar Mateen on several left leaning web forums I was watching. Also by the Islamofascists ever-reliable, ever-useful idiot, Owen Jones who's little hissy fit, storming off live TV when his infantile PC world view was challenged, showed him up.

Mateen was on an FBI watch list, had pledged allegiance to ISIS, and is understood to haveresponded to an ISIS callfor their supporters to kill as many Americans and Europeans during the month of Ramadan, as it will guarantee them the highest place in Paradise. He dutifully did so by murdering 50 gay men. What this case does illustrate and prove beyond doubt, is the massive issue of reconciling Islam with modernity and not how homophobic the West is, as the fool Jones would have us believe.

I really don't know why you make the claims you are making? Saying "somewhere out there in the ether there's a faceless, nameless gang of conspirators trying to mislead us". Is not helping us get to the cause and addressthe problems we face. No one, not an individula or a state can succeed in that kind of environment.

We've had constant war and economic slavery even without Muslims. Millions of us were murdered in WW1/ WW2. There's a very good reason why birthrates in the West have dropped off a cliff and has much more to do with NWO than jihad.

Having been caught up in 2 IRA bombings in my life I can see where the OP is coming from, it makes you extremely wary and paranoid for a long time but ultimately you have to choose between being scared and not letting it rule you however tempting it might be.
I was in Manchester the day the bomb went off, at the time I usually spent most of my Saturday in the corn exchange yards away from M&S where the bomb exploded. That day I had gone up to Afflecks to meet some friends. We ran for our lives that day. As soon as they opened the centre again loads of people went back. I remember seeing the front window of Dolcis with all of the shoes still there & the glass been in.
In London many many moons ago I heard the sound of a bomb going off in the city so clearly I can still hear it now but we had a day and a half to be tourists and needed to make the most of it. People were still everywhere doing the tourist thing with us.
My point is we cannot let fear rule out lives. I still go to Manchester & love London. I would go to Paris tomorrow despite what has happened because we can't predict what will happen and I refuse to let that uncertainty rule me.