The U.K. Is unprepared to feed its own people

[OfficiallyUnofficial]

AIBU to highlight this statement?*

Something the industry have known for while but the public just don't seem to get. We are at below 60% food security in the UK.

The U.K. Is unprepared to feed its own people

What a bloody scary statement, this isn't a BREXIT thread it's a "think local" thread. We have become so reliant on cheap imports, on retailers choosing what's best for us, never shouting British on products, so forgetful that our grumpy farmers are the only ones standing between us and starvation that this has quietly happened.

We are an island, the world is uncertain, God forbid there were war and blockades now. EU or non EU when will we start paying for food security?

*Sarah Boumphrey, global lead for economies & consumers at Euromonitor?

The EU is the reason most UK farmers are still farmers. Without the grants and support many of them would have gone out of business 20 years ago.

Bollocks.

Without the EU we wouldn't NEED all the subsidies.
Where do you farm?

I thought the whole point of the single market was to have a level playing field?

Well that's how they sell it to us....but it doesn't work like that in practice. It's very far from a level playing field.

When I see all the doom mongering on here I do sometimes have a wobble, but then I think of farming and I just wouldn't go back to the EU.

We are world leaders in farming efficiency, high welfare standards and environmental standards, and I HATE seeing that all spoiled by forced imports of low welfare crap at bargain bin prices.

*Without the EU we wouldn't NEED all the subsidies.
Where do you farm? *

I don't - I already said that I worked on the finance side.

But I know a lot of farmers and live in a rural area and am well aware of the issues that farmers face on a day to day basis. Maybe you need to educate yourself before declaring anything 'bollocks' yeah?

Well that's how they sell it to us....but it doesn't work like that in practice. It's very far from a level playing field presumably this applies to other sectors as well as farming?

Does anyone know how much the price of food might go up by? I'm a poor person who voted remain. My family will suffer because of the stupidity of others. I always try and make savings but our food bill is a huge proportion of what I earn because I don't earn much.

I don't need to educate myself on anything to do with farming or subsidies, no.

5 weeks ago I had a cheque in the thousands. It is for not farming a 240 acre block of hill.

Lovely. Another farmer on the EU gravy train!

Except that, if I could graze 200 ewes on there, scanning at a modest 150%, I'd have around 270 lambs after losses. 270 April lambs at a conservative £55 each makes £14850. And that's the most conservative estimate.

But yeah, I really need my subsidies.

We rent an extra 150 acres of arable in addition to our own. It costs £145 an acre, so around £22000 a year. The reason it is that high is because the owner wants the SFP. For doing sod all.

But again, yay subsidies!! We so need them.

It's easy to see farmers being paid massive amounts of money and think 'oh, good for them.' But it's far more complex in reality.

NameChanger22

probably it wont. not for a long time anyway. we already import so much food from both EU and non EU countries. Longer term - ie. 5-10 years - it might have an impact regarding customs and tax etc but I can't see it being an issue overall

I would love to see meat prices rise. Eating good quality meat 2-3 times a week rather than processed chicken ready meals every day would be no more expensive over a week, and far better all round.

Meat has become a throwaway product, which is wrong in my view.

I agree with your about meat WellErr

*I don't need to educate myself on anything to do with farming or subsidies, no.

5 weeks ago I had a cheque in the thousands. It is for not farming a 240 acre block of hill. *

I should explain for the benefit of those who don;t have a aknowledge of agriculture that these paymnets came about during a time of over quota production and are likely to be phased out in the immediate future?

Lovely. Another farmer on the EU gravy train!

I don['t think anyone has said that. Farmers work fucking hard in my experience.

Except that, if I could graze 200 ewes on there, scanning at a modest 150%, I'd have around 270 lambs after losses. 270 April lambs at a conservative £55 each makes £14850. And that's the most conservative estimate.

So do it then...

But yeah, I really need my subsidies.

you might not, but a lot of farmers do - not every UK farmer is a super famr in the SE. Grants pay for many things from transport to energy. A narrow view helps no one.

We rent an extra 150 acres of arable in addition to our own. It costs £145 an acre, so around £22000 a year. The reason it is that high is because the owner wants the SFP. For doing sod all.

How is he getting a single farm subsidy without a herd number? And why haven't you reported it?

But again, yay subsidies!! We so need them.

Fact is that many farmers DO need them. If you don't then go you, but others do just to stay afloat. I think your whole attitude is disrespectful to be honest. If you are in the tiny minority then great for you, but stop assessing others compared to your income.

"Meat has become a throwaway product, which is wrong in my view."

Agreed.

I voted to stay, but you have to askypurseld why every other field around my way (Somerset) had a Leave banner stuck in the ground. I know farmers have a reputation for being less progressive (there are usually Tory banners in the same fields during a GE campaign) in general but if the EU was so good for them why they hell would they not want to stay?

We have quite a large number of people from Eastern Europe in our area - many of them work for the same company as me, but I don't think I know any in farming.

not every UK farmer is a super famr in the SE

Yeah I know. Neither am I. Not even in England.

How is he getting a single farm subsidy without a herd number? And why haven't you reported it?

Ok - now I KNOW you don't work in farming finance

The landowner knows that the CPH holder will get SFP, so calculates the rent according to that.
It's how all land rent in the UK works under the current system.

Fact is that many farmers DO need them

Ourselves included. In the current system.
The point I'm making is that if we got a fairer price for our produce and a cap on low welfare imports, we wouldn't.

Following thread with interest.
I live in a small market town in a very rural area and there seems to be a strong leave sentiment in the surrounding area.
I am sure the impact on British agriculture will be seismic and I just hope it works out in favour of the farming industry.

OH MY GOD - NO ONE IS GOING TO SELL US ANY FOOD AND WE'RE ALL GOING TO DIE.

FFs.

WellErrr

you realise that the SFP is an EU subsidy, right?

I think this is really fascinating and would love to know more about it. Despite the fact I live in a rural, farming area most of my knowledge of agriculture comes from The Archers less reliable sources and the only thing I knew about the CAP was that it was massively delayed taking over from the former subsidies and caused lots of farmers to go near bankruptcy.

You do know OP that Sarah Boumphrey from whom you have taken your quote is only a market researcher and has no in depth knowledge of this.

She may be also a Remainer: have a look at her Twitter feed and might be said to have an agenda, especially as she picks up a fair amount of work from Europe.

You might also want to have a list of the clients she works for: they're all listed on her firm's page. It's called Euromoniter.

People are going to sell us food. Just like they are going to sell food to the rest of the world because it's a market.

Is it a buyer's market or a seller's market? With China demanding more meat based products, what difference does that make?

How important is the price of grain?

Basically - what will happen to the price of goods in our basket? ( I think it was Thatcher who talked about that a long time ago)

you realise that the SFP is an EU subsidy, right?

Yes. That's the whole fucking point.

Just out of curiousity... where does one find one of these illegal immigrants who'll work for pennies? Because I could rent out my job to one of them and pay £20 a day, spend my days reading and baking and watching tv I'd make a profit, they'd make a profit and not have to do such a hard job!

Everyone would be a winner!

This is something that has worried me for years. The fuel strikes highlighted how last minute our food supply has become. Everything is centralised, standardised and bought from Tesco. A couple of days of 'strikes'/imports suspended and we're fucked. UK farming is fucked, and this is why.

The EU was born out of the need to feed everyone after WW2. There was rationing and food shortages. By joining together and creating a free market it would be easy to trade and feed the population. It was basically a good idea.

Farmers were given money to increase production, so they did. Fields were ploughed up, hedges removed, animals were bred and fed to make meat cheaper and available to all. This was embraced by the population and the cupboards were full.

Farmers were paid to produce more, so they did, got too good at it, and had to stop producing so much. Higher animal welfare conditions were announced - the UK basically did as asked, making our production more expensive than others within the EU that basically didn't/haven't improved welfare.

In 1992 farmers had to stop growing food on 15% of their land - which resulted in farm incomes falling and redundant machinery and farmworkers. Then the emphasis moved to conservation. Farmers got paid for re-planting the hedges that they had previously been paid to remove. Then in 2007 the EU realised that we didn't have much wheat left in the shed and set-aside went. Farmers were allowed to grow crops of their choice in their fields. But not for too long.

A couple of years ago new plans were made - farm payments are still area based, but also based on conservation/cropping - 30% of payment. It's too complicated to summarise, but areas of cropping and choice of crops is restricted.

Meanwhile everybody is still going to Tesco, buying strawberries 24 hours a day, 364 days of the year. We have unrealistic food choices and prices.

So what now? I have no idea. I don't think that farmers should get subsidy payments - I think people should pay more for food. Everyone has been paying taxes to go the EU to come back to the farmers - quite an expensive way of doing it. We've ditched the middle man, we need to sort it out for ourselves. Everyone needs farmers everyday. Where will our food come from?

Cross posted with loads while I was trying to sell some wheat. There's bugger all market for it at the moment, but at least there is a bit of trade now. It completely stopped after Brexit for the first time ever. Scary stuff.

I asked my greengrocer what she thought, because she sells a lot of local produce but also huge amounts of her stuff is European. She was very pro-leave, thinks we will all have to go back to eating more seasonally and locally and this will be good for the environment, and people should stop worrying because we were all fine pre-EU and it will go back to the way it was.
But we can't go back just like that, can we, because we've grubbed up the orchards and so many of the farmers have been forced out....

we can do it like this
weburbanist.com/2016/06/05/worlds-biggest-indoor-vertical-farm-near-nyc-to-use-95-less-water/

Totally agree with BillSykesDog and thanks for explaining Wellerr and Pumpkin

As a usually 2x full time working parents family with 2 kids and scarcely enough time for housework and shopping in 1 supermarket shop, let alone shopping around all the independent stores, how can we force the supermarkets to stock local and pay a fair price to their suppliers?

I already choose British where I can, buy the fair price milk when available (not all shops sell it). It pisses me off that the big stores are squeezing the supply chain but it's very hard to avoid them to be honest 😞

I really hope it's not too late for our farmers to recover.

adagio The Fr. govt. interestingly obliges the supermarkets to stock local food, it's good and fresh too, that could be done in England too.

The french have unilaterally banned nicotinoids when they heard the evidence about them. They didn't wait for the EU to ban them.