SIL is our Landlord...more of a WWYD

[albapunk]

Sorry this is quite long, NC as potentially outing.

DH and I live in a property owned by his sister. SIL property is perfect for us. When we moved in we had been claiming housing benefit on the previous property, SIL asked us not to continue our claim when we moved into her property as she had trouble in the past. She said she would adjust the rent to reflect this, stating she wasn't worried about making profit.

We agreed to £X amount, which is still a substantial amount of our income but do-able. DH and I have had a rough few years but everything is picking up and I have accepted a new job offer which means we wouldn't be entitled to HB once I start so we figured we could get by on a tighter budget for a few months.

No lease had been signed when we moved in, but it was a hectic move and the last of our worries as the landlord was obviously family. SIL received various letters and a final notice over council tax. DH went in to the office to change all the details over and put us as tenants so SIL is no longer liable as the house is occupied now. DH was told he would need a lease to do this but SIL refused to issue one and told him to tell the council that she has given him the property. DH questioned this, he is currently out of work until September, she is still paying her mortgage and there was no way he was claiming to own a property when he didn't. DH again asked SIL for a lease or a written agreement that we lived in the property and she as no longer liable, again this was refused and SIL said that we can just pay her the council tax (as if the property was still lying empty) on top of the rent.

Of course it kicked off between DH and SIL as DH doesn't want to commit fraud. DH and I would have no address and the council would have the property marked as empty so the council tax amount would be the rate set for landlords with empty properties .DH and SIL has a massive argument as DH was trying to solve the problem so we could deal with the council tax demands that are still being sent to SIL. She has now said she wants nothing more to do with DH, he is as good as dead to her and we've to move out. SIL owns a very successful business so DH thinks this has something to do with tax avoidance as a landlord.

WWYD in this situation? DH is devastated and I'm furious. AIBU to think that if you agree to taking on tenants, family or otherwise, they still require a lease, and be able to put their name on the council tax?!

I'd sign up to Vote OP. its your right and your SIL cannot stop you.

If she does its her thats in the wrong.

I'm sorry but this does look like a tax dodge.

how many properties does she own and let out?

I suspect it will push them one or both of them up into a higher tax bracket if they rent out their property legitimately to you and declare the income. this, I suspect, is why they are doing it the way they are.

totally unfair on you OP whatever the situation.

As she has asked you to move out I think you need to go to your local council and explain you need advice as you are threatened with homelessness within 28 days. They will then need to investigate the situation, to decide whether they have a duty to house you. They often have funds to help with finding a private rent deposit etc ( if social housing is not an option).
The investigations will mean contacting her and deciding the nature of your tenancy.
It will also uncover if she is doing anything illegal.
Of course, this may further damage your DH's relationship with her, so it's a tough call. Depends whether you think the situation is salvageable, but it doesn't sound like it.
Contacting Shelter and CAB definitely a good idea.

There are two issues: the relationship and the house/council tax. Sort them separately.

The SIL will calm down. It does sound as though she was giving you a good deal on the rent. She may be pissed off that you haven't really acknowledged that. Any dealings you have with her make sure you mention this, to try to keep her sweet if you want to stay.

Council Tax. She's liable as the owner, not you, so don't pay. Why are you saying you 'owe' council tax? You don't, as it stands you are her guests.

If she is reasonably well off then it's quite likely that 40% of her rental income would be taxed if she declares it.

You have an Assured Shorthold tenancy. As its not in writing she cannot use the accelerated to evict you. Stay put!
I am a little concerned (though my landlord and tenant days are rusty) that she might try and argue that you are mere licensees, on the property as her guests only (though I don't think she'd succeed with that as she doesnot occupy any part of the property herself, is that right?). Do what you can to create a document trail confirming your status as tenants and proffer the rent previously agreed.

i think there might be some confusion between what is required for registering for CT and HB.

In my experience, when it comes to taking money off you, the council is very happy to accept a simple phone call providing them with your details.
When it comes to giving money away, i've had to show my lease when claiming HB or other income/work related benefits.

Fact is, our personal data is accessible to the government agencies. When you have a credit check done -whether it's applying for a job, getting finance for a car or getting a tenancy - that information is shared. Having your work, schools,subscriptions,bills etc on that address under your name but with no CT or electoral roll registration WILL raise red flags.

i'd just go call and have yourself registered for CT, utilities etc. Her legal stuff is her responsibility. keep a bank record of the rent leaving your account to hers and keep on paying it.
Then let her get you evicted if she wants you out. You shouldn't have to be left homeless because of her greed. With eviction at least you've got the assistance of the council to get a new property.

she's an arse.

Hi everyone, thank you for all the advice! I've spoken today to MIL who disclosed some more information. SIL is no longer a registered landlord/has landlord insurance hence wanting to remain under the raider, not sure if this makes the situation worse, I'm just scunnered at this point.

SIL wants DH to say as the house was lying empty, that she has effectively given him (us) it to live in rent free, that he(us) is liable only for council tax as the occupier.

Not really sure what we are going to do at the minute, looking into alternative properties and ways to remedy the situation whilst still remaining above board. We do not want to be part of / responsible for her frauds as this could obviously affect us in the future.