Neighbour problems - renovating. AIBU?

[FunkyChunk]

I would really like some opinions on whether IABU, after an incident today I'm really shaken up and upset.

We bought our first home in March, a complete doer-upper as its all we could afford. It needed gutting, new electrics, plumbing, boiler, staircase you name it.
Our next door neighbours moved in the day after we got our keys, they are renting the other half of our semi-detached.

In the first couple of days, we were working in the house in the evening (around 7pm) when neighbour (lets call him A) knocked and asked us to not work later than 7 as his son goes to bed at 7.30. Fair enough, and we packed up - haven't worked past 5/6pm again.
Looking back now, its a little strange that he knocked as we were only stripping wallpaper (not noisy at all). He also didn't introduce himself or anything, was right into complaining. I was the one who actually stopped him and said "oh, nice to meet you by the way, what's your name?" Etc.

We have had noisy work done since, as is to be expected. We've told neighbours about what we are doing and are apologising every time we see them! DP and I are mostly doing all the work ourselves which means the weekends. We don't do evenings considering the noise we can make at times.
Our other neighbours are lovely, very much "don't worry, do what you need to do" even going as far as offering their drive for us to put a skip on!

Now, A is starting to come around EVERY time we work. Every time we have accommodated his requests as I think we are considerate and would like to keep things friendly. We've previously packed up at 3.30 (after only starting at 12) because he was having family around for dinner, for example.

A couple of weeks ago he collared me while alone in the garden and made me feel so uncomfortable I went inside and cried. Complaining along the lines of "we only have weekends here too, we've had enough" etc.

Today it came to a head. We started to work around 11.30. We realise its Sunday and people would like a lie-in (including us!) so we start late.
DP was screwing plasterboard to the ceiling in the living room. It wasn't actually that loud at all, as it was cushioned by the existing plasterboard and DP has a specific quieter drill that he can use. Its heavy and uncomfortable to use but he does to try and keep the peace! I wouldn't say it was louder than a TV being on.

We had only been going for 20 minutes when A FLEW to the front door and started shouting and swearing.
"I WAS IN BED AT 11.30 AND I CAN HEAR YOU START AGAIN! MY ONLY DAY OFF AND I DON'T GET A LIE IN! YOU'RE SO INCONSIDERATE, YOU'RE TAKING THE PISS!" etc.

He wouldn't let us speak, just swore and shouted and left. I've been feeling sick to the stomach all day.
We've really tried to bend over backwards to be considerate:
Not starting work until 10.30/11 at the earliest.
Packing up by 5ish and no evenings.
Keeping people informed.
We've even gone to the expense of adding thick, insulated plasterboard on each of the party walls to try and soundproof for them.

We haven't actually worked every single weekend. There have been days or even full weekends when we haven't been there at all.

I honestly don't know what more we can do, I'm absolutely gutted about today and don't want to go back really.

Do you think we are BU? What would/have people done in our situation?

3 months?? Pah! Screwy we've been doing ours for four years. It's nowhere near finished. I don't believe my neighbour would prefer our semi-detached house to fall down, it probably wouldn't do the value of his property much good.

Our local regs also confine noisy work to 8-6 on weekdays, 8-1 on Saturday and not at all on a Sunday. We have recently bought and renovated a house and our contractors were VERY strict about observing the rules, as they should be.
To me, DIY is something that happens occasionally, and even then if it's noisy it is basic courtesy to let your neighbours know in advance. If my neighbour was attempting to do the same kind of work we've just had done but only at the weekends I'd be fucking livid - it's not less disruptive because you're doing it yourselves.

Oh, and when I was a teenager the old man next door died and the young couple that moved in set about doing it up at the weekends, often with lots of shouty mates to help. Then they'd all party in the evenings. My mum was wracked with cancer at the time, they made her last few months of life absolutely miserable. If we ever asked them to stop, we'd hear them ranting about what nightmare neighbours we were.

I'm sorry but YAB a bit U. It's good that you've tried to accommodate the neighbour but try and see his POV. Whenever he is at home, in his spare, leisure quiet time, you are working and making loads of noise. Noise can be like torture and if a young child is involved, it's probably twice as disruptive.

I agree with previous posters, you need to schedule and try to compress the very noisy work for midweek, when they are hopefully out. If not possible at all, you need to let them know in advance you will be making a lot of noise for the next couple of hours or the morning of the following day, for example, but that it will then stop. They can then plan accordingly.

We've done the same as you, twice, and I'm afraid you need to take responsibility for what noise you make.

SchnitzelVonKrumm I'm sorry - that's really sad.

The phrase that goes through my head is "if you want an omelette, you need to break some eggs". DIY noise is REALLY annoying, but it's a means to an end. Our neighbours are lovely, but they did a big renovation job and fucked off for the whole summer holiday. WE were woken up by the builders every single day of the 6-week break (when DD REALLY needs to re-charge). I kinda hated them for that, even though I think they're great neighbours.

You need to do what you need to do to get the job done.

Agree with PPs that you need to log everything - what you're doing and when and every incident with your neighbour. He sounds like an arse.

schnitzel I'm so sorry you went through that.

I had a similar experience, except I was having building work done so I could keep my dying husband at home. Extension with wet room.

My neighbours were so angry that they made it their mission to make my husband's last two years as miserable as possible. Banging the walls from 6am, screaming through the walls and making as much noise as possible when the curtains were closed so he could sleep after getting his morphine. My husband was often in tears, yet on his death bed, asked me to forgive them. I will never forgive then for what they did.

I'm upset that things may carry on along these lines when we move in. I can imagine that he will knock if we so much as cough!

It will and he will unless you nip this in the bud now.

You are not doing unreasonable work at unreasonable times and so disturbance is minimal. Fuck him. You do what you need to do within reasonable times - for instance, 7pm at night is not unreasonable to be doing DIY / maintenance at home. 11pm would be. It's all about balance.

Likewise in teh mornings, stop worrying about this 10.30 am / 11 am shit - I would say to start at work hours. Nothing wrong with you starting at 9am.

Something to consider - if he is such an ass about noise when you are stripping wallpaper, what is he going to be like with day to day noise?

Next time he comes around tell him that you aren't being unreasonable and your noise level is to be expected and reasonable and if he has an issue to report it - even if he does then it won't be upheld. if he continues with this shit then you can report him for harassment. I'd also find out who his landlord is and speak to them about this too. Doubt they want tennents who are goign to be a hassle.

He is being a knob so be a knob in return childish cow

Tell him not to trespass on your property again- and if he does, you will phone the police. And do it if he does.

YANBU. I'd have CCTV near the front door to catch the next outburst. I'd film his barking dog as well.
If you were really being a nuisance he'd go to Environmental Heath and they'd lend him a decibel meter.

Rules round here are similar

But that's noisy work, by contractors not any DIY at all

drilling, floor-sanding etc. Not wall- paper stripping

If DIY wasn't allowed on a Sunday then no-one would ever do DIY

YANBU in that he should not have spoken to you like that.

YABU about the DIY noise though. Our builders were in last Saturday (building inspector in on Monday). I had warned neighbours in advanced, explained it as one-off and still cringed at the noise. I feel sorry for you neighbour after weeks of this.

I am in a semi-detached and noise carries in the most unexpected ways, including "quiet" DIY activities. Don't assume your neighbour will here sound as you do. It may well be worse for your neighbour too if there are no carpets or furniture throughout to dampen the sound.

I would go round and try and smooth things over. It's crap being on bad terms with a neighbour - esp. If you're "attached". Perhaps make it clear about his shouting being unacceptable to start and then inform him of remaining renovation schedule. Noise is easier to cope with if its expected rather than anticipated.

I would definitely keep within local guidance about acceptable times for DIY noise and if you're allowed to work Sunday, give them one Sunday off a month maybe?

I would also go onto the Land Registry for the contact details of the property owner in case relations do break down completely.

Reading this I wonder what exactly noisy DIY is and when it is allowed to be done. Would cutting lawns with a noisy petrol lawn mower on Sunday morning be frowned upon?

I wonder if he isn't planning on staying there for long, so doesn't care if he has a good relationship with you, and just wants peace while he is there.

YANBU.

We don't seem to have any regulations in this area. DH is currently refitting our kitchen but has been starting after 9am and is usually finished by 6.30PM. He was working yesterday but didn't start until late. We are trying to be considerate but it needs to be done.

It is noisy work that has restrictions. Putting together a few shelves or plasterboard with an electric screwdriver is not noisy work. Piledriving, pneumatic drills/knocking down walls etc are noisy. My lawnmower makes more noise than a drill/driver with a few plasterboard screws. Neighbour is being a twat.

Most people work/commute 8-6 weekdays so how would any DIY ever get done if everyone assumes all DIY follows guidelines for contractors doing noisy work...

Y totally ABU. You are renovating a house evenings and weekends? Completely gutting the place? You can hardly equate that to a spot of DIY/putting some shelves up! No wonder your neighbours are fed up. They just want to relax in their home at the weekend. I'd be seriously annoyed with you too.

If you cannot afford a place that's in liveable condition, or have a budget to get tradespeople in during working hours, then that's your problem really, and it shouldn't impact negatively on your neighbours relaxation time EACH AND EVERY WEEKEND.

Stick to doing the work on Saturday mornings and give your neighbours a rest.

AwakeCan'tSleep, my sentiments exactly (and I have done up 7 houses and only ever worked on a Sunday when it was some kind of emergency and even then have been hugely apologetic to my neighbours).

Also, several posters have posted up above along the lines that we should all be glad that neighbouring houses are done up as it increases the value of our own homes... but they don't seem to put any value on someone's right to have a reasonable peaceful day once a week.

I really don't understand what the YABU people expect the OP to do. Leave the house as it is in a dilapidated state? Give up work so they can do renovations at a time more convenient to the neighbour? It's until 5 or 6pm for crying out loud! It's hardly into the wee small hours. Ask yourself what you would do if your home needed a major renovation and you didn't have the means to either quit your job, or to employ contractors. What a bunch of whingers.

Lucy has it. This is only DIY in the sense that this is a major building project that you happen to be doing yourselves. Which saves you money. The cost of that is being borne by your neighbours.

If you were me and happened to have no DIY skills, you'd have to employ a builder and they'd be bound by the local restrictions, quite rightly.

I wouldn't object to a neighbour putting a shelf up on a Sunday. I would object to them carrying out an entire house renovation every weekend. On one level, they are both DIY. But what matters is the impact you are having on your neighbours.

Yeah, sorry OP, I'm with Awake. Living next door to this evenings and weekends for months on end would drive me batshit. Very unfair to the neighbours.

The OP has clearly stated they don't do any DIY in the evenings, and it hasn't been every weekend, or even all weekend on every occasion.

It's your home and you you have work to do on it. You are being very accommodating in your work time. I don't think you're doing anything wrong.

We are renovating our home and work and have the same limitations as you. We save quiet jobs (painting, tiling, building flat pack, wallpaper stripping none shared walls etc etc) for evenings and early weekend mornings and do noisy jobs at a reasonable time. Houses need to be repaired and maintained and people need to live next to each other. There's always noise.

I hate listening to other people's music, barking dogs, revving motorbikes and the like. But I've no cause to complain when it happens at an otherwise sociable time. If I didn't want that I would have to choose to live much more remotely with everything that comes with that.

Yabu,this is not diy! Its totally gutting and renovating a house on weekends.
My neighbours did this last year and i spoke with them on 2 occasions before getting the council involved.
I told them i didnt mind work on a saturday after 1pm but anything on a sunday was taking the piss! I was starting to dread weekends at my own home!

Just to confirm again that we don't work ANY evenings.

Work is confined to around 5/6 hours max and mostly on Saturdays, we pack up by 5 at the latest usually. It isn't always noisy and we have had complete weekends off, as well as the odd day here and there. Last weekend we were only there for about 3 hours on Sat as we had other plans for the rest of the time.

I appreciate that some of the jobs have been noisy. Very loud. But we've always told them what is happening and tried to minimise the noise as much as possible as well as not starting at 8am etc. It's just the nature of it, I really don't know what more we can do? As I said in my previous post, we've finished much earlier on occasion, when neighbour had guests coming for dinner for example. We are TRYING to be reasonable and considerate as much as we possibly can.

The noisiest work is actually coming to an end, we are almost at the stage of decorating. We have plasterers in this week (beyond our capabilities) and they finish work at 4.30.

I'm going to speak to DP tonight as I know there are a couple of loud jobs left. He needs to make holes in the outside walls to reposition our toilet, as well as adding extractor fans in kitchen/bathroom. He will also need to channel the walls in the kitchen for the new wiring.
He does have a complete week off later this month, I'm going to ask him if he can do these jobs during the week to save the quieter things for weekends. I know he was planning on tiling the bathroom but we'll have to re-jig it.

I'm still feeling really shaken up by yesterday and his aggressive behaviour. I feel like I don't want to go back there which of course isn't an option!
I know it isn't neighbours problem that we can't afford a better house/builders in to do all the work (which would have cost us about 50k more). But short of never having our own home (mortgage is much lower than rent prices which we can't afford- London) I don't know what we can do.

Also when we bought the house we were told that next door had been unoccupied for 10 years! REALLY bad timing

Tell them to get lost! As long as you're doing the work in legally acceptable hours they don't have a leg to stand on. Better yet they should be working harder so they can actually afford their "own" house!