To ask how you afford private school fees

[Elephantslovetofly]

We have a young DD, and although it's a while away yet we are thinking about school. The area we live in does not have a good local school, and we are considering an independent school for her

Disclaimer - I went to a private school and for what it's worth had a great education. I enjoyed being there and did well in exams. I believe my parents decided to send me there also because of a lack of a good local state school. I might have done fine at a state school, but will never know I guess

We are probably 45 min drive from the school I went to - further than is ideal. DH doesn't mind driving her there if we decide to send her there though (if she is fortunate enough to get a place)

The issue is whether we can afford it. The fees are about £9k per year for junior and £12k for senior. Assuming we therefore need to find £1k per month for fees

My cheeky question is this - if you have a child at private school, what does your household earn and how difficult is it to find the money each month to pay the fees? Our income is about £60k, and at the moment I don't think we can do it (along with our other current expenses). Wages might go up a bit before we would need to start paying, but if this is always going to be a pipe dream i'd rather get over it now

I know we could move closer to a good state school, but am exploring my options at this stage. Don't really want to move, as we have a good house here and are settled

Thanks for reading

Yy bertrand.

Bitter much

Sadly anyone questioning the injustice of the system gets called bitter or told they have a chip on their shoulder. Easy way to shut down an argument.

We chose private school from the start.

Not because we didn't have any experience of state school, or because the local state schools were particularly awful, or because we were seeking some end game result.

We chose it because we thought our DC would have a better day to day experience, and because we had the money.

Some say this is a morally dubious course. But would it have been morally superior to spend that money on something else? Would it have been morally superior to send my DC to state school, where they would have still been rich and advantaged? Would that have helped the disadvantaged? Would my DC's company have kept those kids warm at night or changed their lives?

IME from visiting a hell of a lot of state schools in the UK, is that the main barrier to better social equality in education is the inconsistent provision of state education. The inconsistent application of policies and the inconsistent use of resources.

bertrand get thee to London.

I do live in London and I agree with Bertrand. I've lived here my whole life.

I think it's rather the other way around.

I think their is bitterness aimed at the choices some of us have made.

I only see the insults and scoffing at those of us that have chosen to privately educate on this thread.

The Op asked a question. She has some answers which were helpful. Cue .... the usual clan wade in with all the same old idealistic twaddle.

I don't need to aruge that I live by bad state schools in order to justify working hard enough to pay fees to send my children to good schools. I see it as a moral good to buy the best education youc an for your child. The moral high ground is with the fee payers. I feel no built at all. Few women on this thread will pay as much tax as I do which goes towards state schools. The fact my children are not sitting in class rooms with state school children is not some huge penalty for the children of parents of state school chidlren on this thread. There is no golden dust or halo on my little darlings which means a local state school missing a huge benefit from having them in the class. It is quite hard anyway in our bit of outer London to talk about your "local" school. People go all over to school from here - i nto Central London, to the grammars in Bucks, to Watford "Grammar" which is not strictly a grammar school, to the Catholic schools and all the rest.
It doesn't help to compare our local comp with my children's selective schools due to the selection so it's not comparing like with like and unfair on the state schools.

'There'

The primary schools around here aren't particularly bad. Dd attended one of them for reception year.

maybe well perhaps you happen to live in catchment of a great school. Or perhaps your definition of a great school is different to other posters.

Seems to me that in defence of the state system some people will defend some pretty dire schools...which in turn is a definite barrier to improvement.

I have to say that I don't agree that the teaching in private schools is any better than state overall. I've had children in and out of both sectors and there are good and bad in each.

I also think that private schools vary vastly in how good they are which is why you have to be careful not to waste money. They don't all have state of the art equipment as described by one poster up thread.

No I don't. I suspect my standards are lower because, as I said, I went to a school with a 30% GCSE pass rate.

My sister went to a quite famous, excellent state school and hated it, again due to the high pressure academics are everything attitude. Another reason I wouldn't send my DC private, and would probably also be put off one of those famous brilliant state schools (like Greycoat Hospital school for eg).

User. I think it's a cheek to say 'I work hard enough to send my children to private school'

A lot of people work hard. Hard work doesn't always equate with an affluent lifestyle.

Some of us send our DC to non selective private schools

But don't live in London

Of course

Please can we have a moratorium on "bitter"? Oh, and "chip on the shoulder"? So deeply tedious.

Mini

"You can't defend the principle of an unequal education system which compounds disadvantage and further polarises society, you can simply say 'I don't give a shit about children generally, just my child'."

This is absolutely missing the point. Wanting the best for your child (whatever that may be) does not mean whatsoever that you don't care about others. Both are possible.

I would say though that successful society is based on each of us maximising our utility and striving for better.

------

"Is it morally right and defensible to spend twice as much on the education of the most socially advantaged children as on the most socially disadvantaged children?"

Why isn't it? Are you suggesting absolute equality of outcome? Next time you're filling up your car with fuel, consider what the poorest in the UK (let alone those in other countries) could do with that £100. Should more be spent on education in the UK? Perhaps. That has nothing whatsoever to do with what people spend their net income on. When I have paid my taxes, I could spend my money on my child's education, bottles of Bolli or whatever I choose. It's up to me and has no effect on your family.

"Is it good for society? I think the answer would have to be 'no'."

Except that better educations benefit us all: that example of surgeons was a good one, or consultants, or scientists.

maybe your argument is getting decidedly confused.

You say you agree with mini that independent schools are inherently wrong because they provide a small number of pupils with an advantage.

You then say that state schools are actually preferable and cite people doing 'better' there.

This is a common approach on MN. Anger at those who access the advantages, yet a desire to dismiss said advantages. I'm often told that I'm buying my DC their successes, yet similarly that I'm wasting my money .

Who quoted "chip on the shoulder"

No haircut, I was just saying anecdotally that it's not necessarily the case that every child will do better at private.

Obviously most do, otherwise there would not be the divide in society that there is.

If I really believed private schools were inferior I wouldn't be angry. I would just think it was daft anyone would bother to spend money on them.

Fair enough maybe.

And that's a view I can see has a merit, even if I disagree.

I find it quite interesting on such threads how quickly they deteriorate into expressions such as 'idealistic twaddle' etc. I also find it quite interesting how some posters are describing state schools with criminals / extremely disruptive children that should be thrown out (rather than helped) etc. It is amusing to me what people imagine happens at state schools. There is a fantasy (obvious on such threads) that they are at worst utter jungles or at best mediocre and not really valuing education or difference. Perhaps it's hard to believe that there is value and merit and interest in classes of society that are not yours. I find that attitude quite phobic actually. But very interesting to think about.

I am always fascinated by how many private school parents seem to live in the catchment of extraordinarily awful state schools. Considering that most troubled state schools are in areas of significant social deprivation, what are these affluent middle class people doing there?

I have wondered this many times before!

Tbh, i'd rather spend the money on moving to a less deprived area.

And in response to the op, I don't think you can afford £12k fees on a £60k income without significantly affecting your standard of living. We have a similar income and live comfortably...we could probably do it if we really, really tried but it would mean stripping away all holidays, treats, savings and going down to basics on many things. Not worth it IMO.

I base my views on state education from the very many I visit as part of the widening access scheme.

Provision is inconsistent. Wildly so. And often nothing to do with cohort.