Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to feel fed up that I'm being denied flexible working after childless colleague also requested it

86 replies

RooTwo · 20/05/2016 09:46

I have been working four days a week since I went back after maternity leave, with one of those days at home. Now I'm being told that I can no longer have this day at home; that others at work are requesting a day at home too and they can't have everyone having a day at home, so I can no longer have mine. AIBU to feel really fed up about this? I get loads done at home, work extremely productively, and it just means I can manage my work and home life more easily and things are just a bit less stressful in terms of managing the pick ups etc of three children.

I know that all employees are entitled to request flexible working, and that's how it should be, but for me, that day at home is just so vital, it keeps me sane as a working parent - I would never have thought to ask for flexible working/days a home as a childless 29 year old (as my colleague who has requested this is ...)

I'm trying to work out whether to go back to employers to challenge this and put in a formal request for flexible working (which had never really happened before).

AIB very U?

OP posts:
pitterpatterrain · 20/05/2016 11:07

It sounds like this is an opportunity for HR to get involved. We now have a well developed flex work policy for majority of employees (excepting front desk reception) after many years of individual agreements. The company has recognised that work life and styles has changed and the years of flex work being a female-only childcare related topic and are long gone especially as a PP mentioned with millenials.

We can request fewer hours, adjusted hours or regular time working from home.

It is something that can be framed as a benefit to the whole organisation and all employees not something that they should regret as others pick up on it and also put in requests.

Original poster
RooTwo · 20/05/2016 11:09

Thank you all for thoughts. HowBadisthisPlease the law has actually now changed so that all employees can request flexible working not just parents. I think that is right as everyone could have different reasons for needing it. I just feel that my situation is all a bit of a mess and I wish I had got it in stone or formalised earlier on/at the start, as I don't think I have much of a leg to stand on now, seeing as it was never an official arrangement. I've only been doing this for the last six months.

OP posts:
FoggyBottom · 20/05/2016 11:14

I would never have thought to ask for flexible working/days a home as a childless 29 year old

Oh I do love the childless women as scapegoats. So supportive - because of course women without children are just - well, there's no purpose to them, is there? They're just living selfish lives with no-one else to think about.

YABU.

It is a management decision about flexible working, and they can refuse on business grounds. If the management is too chicken-livered to make a decision then that is their policy, not the fault of those selfish childless women.

You should make a strong business case about the value-added of your flexible working, citing the productivity you deliver over 4 days, and the impact of working all 4 days in the office. Also that you will be less likely to look for other jobs if your working pattern is manageable with your family responsibilities. Show them what's in it for them, and what a good employee you are!

HowBadIsThisPlease · 20/05/2016 11:14

Oh sorry Roo. I didn't know that.

I still think you can fight this because it is still the case that you have the right to ask and be taken seriously; and that it is bad practice to penalise you for others' situations. I think you could write a very good business case for this based on your OP

"I get loads done at home, work extremely productively, "

I think you need to write this point up with some facts and figures included. Your experience of working from home already up to this point means that you can include times that you got certain pieces of business critical work done in under the usual time frame; you took calls at odd times; etc

FoxyLoxy123 · 20/05/2016 11:20

I think YABU but I can see why you're annoyed.

This is why you should have had it formalised. No one else has done anything wrong asking to work a day from home.

MyLocal · 20/05/2016 11:32

Personally I think the issue is with management. If you have proved the WFH one day a week works, then there is no reason why the management couldn't permit all interested parties to do the same.

If they agreed to this and it subsequently had an impact on the business then they are within their rights to revoke the arrangement.

I have WFH for 13 years, it helped me enormously when my DC were small. They are now grown up, but it now helps me enormously in caring for my elderly parents. I do not feel less worthy of having a flexible working arrangement now than I did 12 years ago.

StealthPolarBear · 20/05/2016 11:35

How bad I believe everyone has the right to request now.
That said I don't think it's discriminatory to turn one person down and not another.

Basicbrown · 20/05/2016 11:35

You aren't being denied flexible working as as far as I can see you haven't requested it? All that is happening is an informal arrangement is being stopped. You have a strong case if you jump through the hoops (as will your colleague have)

HowBadIsThisPlease · 20/05/2016 11:40

Stealth, yes I realise that now - didn't know before!

I have mixed feelings about this - while I do believe that childless 29 year olds have as much right to work efficiently and maximise their non-work time as everyone else - the management will have to make a case by case decision about which individuals will best serve the business with flexible working, and which without. It depends on what motivates people and what their targets / objectives are.

Agree, it isn't discriminatory to give it to some but not others, but the management may be too feeble to justify their decisions on this and might be bottling being fair to Roo because they think the other person is a bit of a piss-taker who is going to be running a dog-walking business / indulging hangovers on the side, and they are lazily finding it easier to say no to everyone.

Roo needs to find a way to communicate on this issue which non-confrontationally challenges this laziness and coaches management into a more sophisticated way of thinking

StealthPolarBear · 20/05/2016 11:43

Yes sorry huge x post on my part

ghostyslovesheep · 20/05/2016 11:44

I'm pretty sure the law ONLY states that a company has to consider a request for flexible working - I don't think anyone had the right to it

I certainly don't think working from home should be used to cover gaps in childcare - working from home should be the same as working in the office - sat at a desk working without distraction

I have completely flexible working because of my job - I manage my own diary and I often work from home - I also often work over and above my contracted hours, away from home and on none working days - but it's working - if one of my kids is sick or off I take time OFF work

Anyway you have the right to request it OP as does a 'childless 29 year old' Hmm - the company has to consider your request ...they are under no legal obligation to grant it if they can argue it doesn't meet their business needs.

WriteforFun1 · 20/05/2016 11:50

I don't have kids and I have had this agreed
however, in my previous place, they hated it and when I left, my replacement was told she wasn't allowed it

people with kids weren't allowed it either

some firms are just incredibly stupid about this kind of thing

When I left I looked only for places that would let me work at home and work flexibly.

Sorry you are in this position - I don't know why more firms don't allow it. It sounds as if you and your colleagues could work this way - as mine do - and it would be fine, is that correct? I would try selling it to them on the basis of being more productive etc. I know I'm more productive with the commute chopped off my day and without the surrounding noise of the office.

Babettescat · 20/05/2016 12:08

Flexi working requests need a form filled in and sent to line manager and HR and a written change to contract follows if they grant it.

I'm sorry but it doesn't sound like you had that at all so applying now may not change anything. Apply though - everyone can.

blitheringbuzzards1234 · 20/05/2016 12:10

It seems jolly unfair that they've now said that you can't continue having that day at home just because another person has put in a request. If as you say it's very productive for you and you get loads done . . . I expect your boss is thinking that if he opens the floodgates everyone else will want one too. Seek help from HR dept if you have one.

HowBadIsThisPlease · 20/05/2016 12:13

"I certainly don't think working from home should be used to cover gaps in childcare"

No but it is very useful to people with children (and others) because it takes out the time of the commute. Mine is 90 minutes each way. Because of childcare constraints, the days I'm commuting that's at least 2 hours off my time at my desk

heron98 · 20/05/2016 12:21

YABVVVVVVU.

I'm childless and have requested flexible working. I have asked because my DP's business is extremely busy, we can't afford to take on more staff so I will need to work there for free one day a week.

you have no idea what other people's circumstances are. Even if this colleague has no other reason than "she wants to" work from home, she has the right.

frenchielala · 20/05/2016 12:46

I hate the idea that only those with children are entitled to work from/flexibly home or part time. Childless people may have all sorts of reasons for wanting a flexible arrangement. This attitude really annoys me.

NeeNahh · 20/05/2016 12:55

I would never have thought to ask for flexible working/days a home as a childless 29 year old

I am a childless 32 year old who works from home 1-2 days a week Grin

It means I save on commuting costs, can sit with deep conditioning treatments in my hair and hang my washing in my lunch break. It's bliss.
The fact that I have chosen to use contraception so I don't have children doesn't mean I would choose to commute every day when I don't have to!

I don’t really understand why you are being made to come in while others work at home though. Surely everyone in your team should be treated equally.

Are you sure that you are as productive as you think you are when you are at home?

ilovesooty · 20/05/2016 12:55

Why shouldn't the childless employee run a dog walking business alongside her work if her request is granted?

Floisme · 20/05/2016 13:05

I work part time. My reasons should be irrelevant. I could be running round after children and parents or lying on the settee watching reruns of Friends - either way the impact on my employer remains the same and that's the only issue that should matter to them.

wombthereitis · 20/05/2016 13:13

It sounds like they would be in breach of contract, both express (verbally agreed between you and your line manager) and implied (you've already been working this way for ages).

m.acas.org.uk/media/pdf/q/k/Varying-a-contract-of-employment-Acas-leaflet.pdf

Contact ACAS for advice.

urbanfox1337 · 20/05/2016 13:15

Get everyone in the job to demand a day off every week, threaten to destroy the company if you don't get what you all want.

FoggyBottom · 20/05/2016 13:24

Get everyone in the job to demand a day off every week, threaten to destroy the company if you don't get what you all want

It's not a day off every week, it's a fractional/part-time appointment, with one day working from home.

If the company can see a business reason ie increased productivity, happier loyal employees, then they could do it.

But the OP needs to make a business case. It sounds like she could make a good one.

And OP if you want to argue with your manager that your request should not be connected to your colleague's request, then you must make absolutely no reference to your colleague's request, or imply that your need is greater than hers. You can't have it both ways. You should each make your case on the business merits of flexible working.

TrillKitten · 20/05/2016 13:26

Not that anyone else's motives matter, but when I was 29 I had some family and mental health issues that made it much easier for me to have flexible working hours. In fact, I think I would have had to stop working altogether and sign on if I didn't have that to help me through a rough period. Cast your mind back to pre-DC, it wasn't all roses I am sure. Kids are not the only thing that complicates a persons life. Also, can we all just agree that 'I wouldn't have, so they shouldn't' is a poor basis for any discussion.

Iggi999 · 20/05/2016 13:28

I'm not sure I entirely agree Floisime, the impact on my employer if I was not allowed to work part time is that I would be stressed and tired and my work would suffer. And ultimately I would look elsewhere and leave. The friends-watching employee wouldn't have such an impact!