Royal College of Midwives backs abolition of abortion law that could see women terminate unborn child at any point

[ThatsMyStapler]

Surely the majority of people needing/wanting a medical abortion do so for very good reasons, and also as quickly as is possible.




Royal College of Midwives backs abolition of abortion law that could see women terminate unborn child at any point

Telegraph Link

he Royal College of Midwives (RCM) is facing criticism after calling for abortion to be decriminalised, without consulting its members on the issue.
The union, which represents almost 30,000 midwives and health workers, has said it gives its “full support” to the British Pregnancy Advisory Service (BPAS), the UK’s biggest abortion provider, in its campaign for abortion to be removed from criminal law.
Prof Cathy Warwick, chief executive of the RCM, is also chairman of the board of trustees of BPAS.
It is currently against the law for women to terminate a foetus after 24 weeks unless there is a medical reason to do so, while abortions earlier in a pregnancy are only legal if two doctors agree to it.
But the RCM is backing calls for the legal limits to be scrapped and abortion to instead be regulated in the same way as other medical procedures, at the discretion of doctors.




There is a petition to stop this, and they say;

"Your campaign is severely out of touch with what women actually think and want. A ComRes poll in March 2014 found that 88% of women favoured a total and explicit ban on sex-selective abortion, whilst another in October that year registered a similar figure of 85%. The March poll also found 92% of women agreeing that a woman requesting an abortion should always be seen in person by a qualified doctor. Whilst in 2006, a Guardian / MORI poll found that 47% of women wanted a reduction in the upper time limit, a 2012 Angus Reid poll found this number had increased to 59% of women."

[NeedsAsockamnesty]

I support the RCM and the BPAS.

And I do so as someone who has had a late term TOP

[MangoMoon]

I'm pro choice, I've had 2 abortions myself - one at about 12 weeks & one at about 8 weeks.

I don't think it should be a criminal act, I don't think it should be the 2 doctor rule either, but I am uncomfortable about late abortions for anything other than medical reasons (those reasons being either the baby or the mother).

[MrsTerryPratchett]

I believe abortions should be as early as possible and as late as necessary.

Absolutely.

I don't like the idea of late term abortions. I don't like the idea of abortion generally. But it's not up to me. My body is mine and decisions about it are mine. Your body is yours. Criminalizing women for decisions they make about their own bodies is barbaric.

[NoCakeLeft]

I don't support abortion after about 18 weeks, so even current law is a bit scary for me. The thought of aborting a baby that you can feel moving inside you is horrible. I had two abortions in my life BTW, so not against the abortions, just the late abortions.
And why should it be legal for a doctors to kill a baby just because it's inside the woman, when doing the same to a baby already born would be illegal?
What if woman pregnant with twins gives birth to one twin and wants to abort another mid labour? Should that be legal?
Obviously just a very surreal example, but would be possible to do.

[UnderTheGreenwoodTree]

It's worth noting that Canada (according to the figures) does not have massive numbers of late term abortions, despite abortion being decriminalised. Late term abortions are still rare in Canada, and mainly due to fetal abnormalities.

It is fairly clear to me that women do not, as a rule, seek late term abortions on a whim, or just because it is 'legal' - but only due to their individual circumstances - fetal abnormalities, maternal mental or physical health.

Termination of pregnancy is a medical procedure, not a legal/criminal one.

[AndTakeYourPenguinWithYou]

I don't see the point of the figures quoted. Who cares how many people agree with what? The only opinion that matters when it comes to what goes on in my uterus is mine, fuck anyone else's thoughts on the matter.

I support the RCM.

[MrsTerryPratchett]

And why should it be legal for a doctors to kill a baby just because it's inside the woman, when doing the same to a baby already born would be illegal? Because in one case the fetus is dependent on a non-consenting mother.

[AdjustableWench]

I support the RCM and the BPAS.

A termination should be a matter for a woman and her doctor, and no one else.

[HighDataUsage]

I think the laws that we have now is enough and don't agree with the RCM. I gave birth to my son at 24 weeks and he's now 7 and thriving. I realise that my views are shaped by my own personal experience. Having seen babies survive past 24 weeks at NICU units I think abortions past that stage is too horrendous to think about.

[Katie0705]

Even if the current law is abolished, terminations will still be at the discretion of the doctors involved. I can't see a doctor agreeing to terminate a healthy pregnancy, particularly in the third trimester and close to term as this would be compromising the Hippocratic oath as well as putting the woman at risk...both physically and mentally. Midwives have been fighting for the rights of women to be acknowledged for years, and it is the decriminalisation of termination that is a key focus of the debate.

[Darrowisred]

Abortion past 24 weeks is barbaric and I do not support it. It's a baby by that point, having had experience of a nicu with babies born at 24 weeks, there is no doubt about that. There comes a point when it's not just about the mothers rights but also about the rights of the child to not be deliberately delivered prematurely then left to die. How can anyone support that - it's like going back to the 1950s.

[Andrewofgg]

AHellOfABird Tongue in cheek indeed. I've been clear in my own mind all my life that whether a woman has an abortion is not my business; not because I haven't got a uterus but because I haven't got that uterus.

But you can't break up the fence until you get off it on one side or the other. Either you allow a sex-specific abortion which a woman says she wants or you don't. If you do you may well be giving effect to the patriarchal wishes of the menfolk in her family (themselves products of their environment and culture) and if you don't, so much for her right to choose and have her choice respected.

And that's the dilemma in the here and now, isn't it?

[AHellOfABird]

Andrew, no fence for me; I support abortion whatever the reason whilst deploring any culture where one sex being valued above the other drives the decision.

Sex selective abortion is possible within the current law, of course, given timing of the second scan. Whether or not women are being asked for a reason by one of the two doctors, I don't know. If so, I hope that the possibility of support if the woman is being pressured is offered by the clinic (as per the BPAS link above where at least one woman was put in touch with relevant residential services to help her continue the pregnancy)

[exLtEveDallas]

As early as possible as late as necessary and for any reason.

Criminalisation has no place here.

[sashh]

But YANBU. I think it's disgusting that anyone could leave it so late and still have that option. Anything past 12/13 weeks is too late imo.

And could you tell that to a suicidal 14 year old who has just managed to get to Europe from Syria where she has been raped by a number of ISIS fighters, then again as payment for travel to the coast, and then made a the dangerous sea crossing to a Greek island and finally walked to Calais paid for access to a lorry by again being raped and when she finally gets to a Britain she is denied an abortion because she is 14 weeks pregnant?

Abortion should not be illegal. No woman should face prosecution because they have undertaken a medical procedure. Women in the UK are being put on trial for this 'crime'.

[RhiWrites]

Decriminalising abortion is like decriminalising suicide. People shouldn't be punished for being in extremis. No one has abortions for fun.

[ForalltheSaints]

Abortion time limit if anything should be reduced given that babies born at 22 weeks have lived.

[katemiddletonsnudeheels]

I don't think for a moment someone would end a pregnancy for fun.

I do think once something is legal and thus condoned people can enter into it innocent of the full ramifications of the action.

I think we do need to break the silence on abortion. So many women have had one yet few talk about it, unless on message boards such as this.

This is on TV now.

[MyBreadIsEggy]

I have always thought that a woman's body is her own, and the decision whether or not to continue a pregnancy is her own - but only to the point where it would be impossible for the foetus to survive outside the womb if it were born.
I can't agree with the RCM on this - I think that the 24 week limit is already to late. My friend had a baby on Sunday at 26 weeks, and he is doing amazingly well in the NICU, he is breathing by himself - the thought of a baby in the same state of health could be terminated is awful to me.
After reading this thread, I can't help but think about the doctors involved in a late abortion - surely it must be a very difficult thing for them to carry out? Their primary goal in their job is to protect life, and a late abortion directly contradicts that, considering babies born at 20-odd weeks can survive with exceptional medical care these days.

[HapShawl]

I support BPAS and the RCM

Abortion is a medical issue for women, not a criminal one

[HapShawl]

I'm sure it's not an easy procedure to undertake, mybreadiseggy, but perhaps they are protecting the life of the woman?

[MyBreadIsEggy]

Hap oh yeah I totally get that - and it clearly would need to be a dire medical reason (for mother or baby) to carry out a late abortion, I just can't imagine how horrible it would be for all involved.

[Rosebud05]

Abortion is clearly a medical issue rather than a criminal one.

There's a document called '32 reasons for not lowering the abortion time limit' that gives 32 examples of women who have contacted BPAS post 20 weeks pregnant.

Can't link because I'm on my phone, but common reasons are girls and women not realising they are pregnant earlier (often due to contraceptive failure), being terrified and in a state of denial, not knowing how to seek help, not realising how far along they are, being in a domestic abuse situation etc.

I find it impossible to agree that these women should be criminalised. It so easily could be me, you, your sister, your daughter in that situation.

[SomeonesRealName]

I support RCM and BPAS.