To be pissed off at having just seen my tenants spending a load of cash whilst they're behind on rent?

[JennylovesRosie]

I am fed up to the back teeth.

This is the third month now where they're falling behind.

(I know them by their appearance and we have a mutual friend on a social networking site)

I have just seen them paying for a spa and no doubt it'll be up on social media next week (they like to brag and display all their newly acquired gains in Instagrammed glory.)

Next month my kids won't have the birthday parties they wanted because I'm subsidising these idiots living expenses and incurring charges as for their late/part payments.

Has anyone managed to get tenants out despite then not being 2 months late on rent. The Lettings agency have told me I'm stuck with them . Can I fine them?

They got a 12 fixed contract in January and surprise-surprise they started to default from day one of it.

I'm so upset.

Not read all the thread, sorry.
Read the contract they signed. It's quite common to be able to charge interest for each day of late payment - the tenants may have casually overlooked/ignored forgotten that, so may be worth gently reminding them of it as you 'don't want to have to start implementing that clause on them'.
You may just have it hit them back where it hurts them, I.e. Their pockets.

Totally agree with Alleycat1

Some spiteful people on Mumsnet.
Try to be supportive or don't post.
Easy to hide behind the anonymity of Mumsnet. If you wouldn't say it IRL don't post.

The flip side of landlord bashing is that if you are a considerate landlord with a professional understanding of property maintenance, more often than not tenants who have had a hard time in the past start to think you are amazing just for getting the plumber around promptly or whatever.

IME it is often very inexperienced, junior employees in agencies who have never owned a property themselves who cause the most problems though, with delayed paperwork and stupid mistakes. One agency I used had a miserable so-and-so who thought it was fine to let herself into the property and walk around without the tenants being there (she had got the appointment time slightly wrong) leaving mud all over the carpet. Tenant was hopping mad and rightly so. She then proceeded to try to get us to pay a serious amount of money to fix an overhead extractor installation, banging on about safety in a really patronising way, and when DH said he would go over and see what the problem was for himself, we found the next door neighbours had put unsecured scaffolding all over our patio without permission, it had been there months, was a serious health and safety risk as the tenants' very young daughter could have climbed it and fallen off, and the agent's obsession with us paying a fortune to repair the electrics had blinded her to a major hazard, that had not been reported to us after the inspection or mentioned in the report.

We then found in our records that we had already paid the same agency to install the extractor fan a few months' previously and it was their workman who had made the mistake and not done the installation to the required regulatory standards. Then we found the workman was a relative of the dozy cow doing the inspection, and to add insult to injury, he had charged us top whack for some specialist paint as well, and not used this but painted the door with some leftover paint from another project, and this did not meet the specifications either (conservation area) so that needed redoing. We complained and got short shrift and were treated very badly, the miserable cow from the agency thinking attack would be the best form of defence, I think.

At one stage I wrote to the national headquarters of this otherwise highly reputable international agency suggesting the have a look at what was going on in their Cambridge office, and they didn't even reply. So we moved our business. It still grates, though.

icy121 Different for housing - emotional response.
Because peope need a home, they don't need a car. Being homeless is much worse than being car-less. Which one would you prefer?

People hate landlords because it's easy and socially acceptable to; good old fashioned politics of envy.
No, it's good old fashioned politics of people screwing over the poor to enrich themselves.

Your tenants sound like twats.

We agree on this bit... Because we know the tenants in question have money.

Paramedicswift As a tenant, rent should be your #1 priority - even before food and sofas.

Sorry, what? You write "food and sofas" as if those two are remotely on a par. Food is essential, sofas are not. And rent before food?

Think some people need to get down off their high horses, the OP has employed someone to advise her (which some wouldn't) she is asking for information given to her to be confirmed. How dare you all tell her what she is and isn't capable of being! Whether she is good enough or not, how amazing you must think you are to think you are at a level to be able to berate other adults for asking for information?

If it was one your own tenants not paying on time would that be okay because you have such vast savings that it wouldn't effect you?!

Your rental agreement most likely will contain penalty clauses for late payment (it's usually a smaller fixed instant say £20 plus daily interest on the amount owed at at base rate plus 5%).
You or your agent write to the tenants having set out and calculated penalty interest and amount due with 7 days to pay or you take them to county court to recover the debt. County court will cost you approx £100 and your time for filing and turning up on the day (if it gets that far).

There are also provisions within the L&T act for persistent (ie monthly) under payment or non payment. However you'd need more than two months worth and it's much quicker to write to them invoicing for late payment charges.

If you can prove financial hardship due to late payment the L&T act also allows for that even if they are less than the full 8 weeks behind. Again you'd need more than 2 months worth of late payment.

If they are deliberately under paying (which it sounds like) then this will bring things to a head quickly. Either they will pay up and never be late again or they will stop paying and you can go for an eviction.

If you don't want to handle this yourself, there a companies who specialise or your agent or any half decent solicitor can help you although it is cheaper to handle it yourself.

I hope it all works out for you.

The OP had to rent out her house as work took her elsewhere and she didn't have a buyer. Probably used up some savings moving and, as she wasn't expecting to become a Ll had no contingency fund. She is the innocent party here - and no, I am neither a renter nor a Ll.

What does the tenancy agreement say about them not paying on time? Is there where the 8 weeks has come from or is that law? (Sorry my knowledge is limited) if the tenancy agreement says they must pay in full on time then it will also say what happens if they don't. If your tenancy agreement doesn't specify this I'd definitely change this before having another tenant, I assume you won't be renewing these ones! Have you gone to speak to them about it? Perhaps going to citizens advice or the solicitor that drew up the tenancy agreement? Being a landlord is a shitty business, tenants (some of them) can be really hard to handle and cause you loads of headaches. Have you phoned your buildings insurer? Sometimes landlord insurance includes legal assistance? I really hope they just leave because they will probably be like this for the whole tenancy

I don't think my situation is unusual (that is not a lot left over to spare each month). No matter how sniper and patronising your response is going to be.

It's not unusual. It's an ideal, not a prescription or a judgement on you as a person. If you think I am trying to make you feel bad, that is certainly not the intention. People are sensitive when talking about money and saving. Nobody likes to be told what to and not to spend.

If you disagree with the ideal then that is fine. But in my experience, I am sharing what I have learned with you, take it or leave it - having some kind of savings buffer for an emergency - either I lose my job, my car breaks down or an emergency replacement needs doing, I do not need to worry.

In my life, I would not be comfortable with having less than 1 month living costs saved up. I want to know that I can afford my rent next month, the internet bill and council tax. If you depend on a car getting places and if it broke down, it would be bad, it is a lifeline.

It is not a continuous sacrifice. I only need to save 1 months expenses once in my life. Then it is always there, giving me that safety. Considerably more relaxed about money.

If I want something, I can buy it without worrying about food or affordability. I've already put it aside!

My priorities are different. I like the security knowing that If I wanted, I can afford the next months of life.

I think it's just as acceptable to pay rent late as it is mortgage late

No, it's good old fashioned politics of people screwing over the poor to enrich themselves

I just don't get why folk think like that. It's just like any other buisness. Either very ignorant or sour gapes. It's really like some folk begrudge other folk have more than one house.

Section 21. Get the fuckers out. I don;t think you need a reason; it is your house just give them notice to get the hell out, freeloading wankers.

Sorry, what? You write "food and sofas" as if those two are remotely on a par. Food is essential, sofas are not. And rent before food?

Yup. Rent before food. If you become homeless, nothing else matters.

You can eat really really cheap food like noodles or go to a food bank if you have no money for food but if you are homeless, you'll find it difficult to keep a job.

I would rather be hungry than homeless.

Jenny - bet you wish you never posted this now!

Ignore the condescending trolls (WTF people? She is asking for advice not a Roasting! Get over yourselves!)
TOTALLY empathise with you on this.

Any Landlord who says they have never had a bad tenant is just lucky.
You can do all the credit checks in the world, but these sort of people know the loopholes and think it is just fine to pay late, they do not think of the human being at the end of the line.

I would challenge the Letting agent first and ask exactly what credit checks/ references they got for this tenant... they have responsibility as they are charging you for their service I assume?

Are there any clauses in the contract re late payment?

I would be tempted to ask the letting agent to write a nice letter to the tenant in a formal manner explaining that their Landlady is not Donald Trump, and politely request them to stop defaulting as it is making it difficult for you to make your mortgage payments on the house. Keep all the emotion out of it. Appeal to their higher instincts.
A lot of people have it in their heads that their Landlords are loaded, when in reality people are stretching themselves to invest in property these days, not as a source of income so much as an investment because of how appallingly Pensions are performing.

(Cruikshank and co should go boil their heads, acting like uppity Head Girls being snotty and extremely unhelpful instead of using their so-called experience to advise this lady. Shame on you! )

Paramedic you don't only need to save it once- you need to resave it every time you use some of it.

Savings are not the safety net people may expect. One to three months grace really isn't all that. Its better than not having it, but dont expect it to protect you from financial difficulty

It's not unacceptable, it's life. If you can't pay it you have to use the law to the best of your advantage. That is smart, not unacceptable

I'm a tenant (not in the UK, thank goodness) and think that UK tenancy laws are a disgrace and a manifestation of the deeply weird British attitude that renting is somehow a moral failing - but in this case I feel for the OP and think the tenants are behaving disgracefully.

I rent from the equivalent of a housing association atm, but I've had private landlords before and, while one in particular was crap, none of them were rolling in it. I wouldn't want to be a LL.

Mrs Florrick - thank you for the BEST response on here. (JENNY - if you haven't read it do so now..)

HOORAH FOR COMMON SENSE AND NICENESS!!

Paramedic you don't only need to save it once- you need to resave it every time you use some of it.

I saved enough in April to pay the bills of May, the paycheck in May pays the bills of June and so on...

I never touch the emergency fund until I really need it.

MsHoolie has the right idea here...
Too many people assume landlords are all greedy who have lots of cash knocking around, therefore late payments don't matter.
They may not realise that some people are only landlords because it would cost them thousands to have sold the house, due to negative equity/mortgage cancelling fees etc. - these are the ones who really can't afford to take a hit on late or missing payments.

Handsoff the morals of it are neither here nor there. It happens. The OP should take whatever steps she can within the boundaries of the law to protect herself.

However she cannot, under the law as it stands, kick them out for being a week or two late. So she needs to work with those confines.

What the OP (and the majority on this thread need to do) is take emotions out of it and seek practical solutions to practical problems. Venting about what they're actually doing with the money is just hot air, it distracts.

The only things the OP should be focusing on are ...

1. Is the money in my account on the allotted date?
2. If not, what can I do about it?
3. How am I protecting my own finances from the fallout if they're late?