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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

It's that time of year again... just use the right of way!

69 replies

jacks11 · 09/04/2016 16:57

I've posted before about people wondering through our fields (with or without their dogs), leaving gates open and their rubbish lying about. There is a well maintained right of way they could use, but no- they really seem to prefer to ignore this (and yes, it is well signposted) and use the more direct route through the fields. Not so bad during winter, but can be a pain during spring/summer. So it's starting up again and I am fed up.

There isn't much I can do about it, as the right to roam laws mean the public have the right to do so. In principle I wouldn't mind, but practical experience is that this is increasingly becoming problematic as so many people just do not seem to observe even the most basic responsibilities such as ensuring gates are closed behind them, not leaving litter and keeping their children and pets under control. It's not everyone, but a significant minority are really ignorant and irresponsible.

In the past week, we have had no less than 3 gates left wide open. There is livestock or horses in most of the fields but luckily no significant damage was done as not many escaped.

I have had to ask one family to take their rubbish with them rather than leave it (neatly tied in a plastic bag) and then watched gobsmacked as the mother later attempted to put it in our outside bin- she seemed surprised when I pointed out it was not a public refuse bin and to take it with her.

A couple were trying to let their small child "pat a lamb"- I hate to think what would have happened had they not been stopped from doing so. Same family also had to be asked to stop feeding the ponies (sugar cubes, apples), and father said "oh but she is enjoying it so much"- apparently I am "a miserable killjoy". They are not the first. This is not a petting zoo! Several of my neighbours have had similar- parents wanting their children to play with lambs (even calves!) for some reason. I have even had people (usually with their children) wandering into the yard to have a look at the horses and the lambing pens. I am genuinely gobsmacked that people feel this is appropriate without asking permission.

I already have padlocked the majority of the gates now to prevent them being left open. I have had to have signs warning of livestock in the fields etc. It annoys me that I have to do so. I am now going to look into methods to make it more difficult to get into the fields as it is getting beyond a joke.

Seriously, I am surprised at the number of people who just don't seem to know how to behave. Not sure what can be done though.

OP posts:
snowgirl29 · 09/04/2016 17:46

*how. Sorry.

jacks11 · 09/04/2016 17:48

quiet

Last year I had a man come to my door demanding I pay the vets bill for his dog after it was kicked by one of my mares who had a foal at foot. The dog was running off the lead in the field, got a bit close to the foal for the mares liking and got a kick. He was very angry when I pointed out that he was at fault for letting his dog loose in a field with livestock, that there was a sign warning about mares with foals at foot being in that field and also that he could have used the right of way, thus avoiding the problem completely. There are so many unbelievably stupid people.

OP posts:
AnthonyBlanche · 09/04/2016 17:49

Garden ground beside a house is exempt through, so people wouldn't have the right to roam round your garden.

That's awful Dolly. So many people are complete ignorant arseholes about anything to do with the countryside.

We don't have sheep, just some cattle and horses. Sympathies to all of you with sheep who are invaded by idiots.

jacks11 · 09/04/2016 17:51

Through

No, they are not allowed to access peoples gardens or farmyards/buildings. There are other exemptions, such as forestry where felling is being carried out.

OP posts:
ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 09/04/2016 17:51

YANBU.

The right to roam is a great thing and I'm very glad we have it. However, as with most things some entitled twats seem to think that these rights don't come with responsibilities.

Anyone interested in the act can see www.outdooraccess-scotland.com where it says:

3.32 Some animal diseases, such as foot and mouth, can be spread
by people, dogs or vehicles, though the risk of recreational
users doing so is very small. In exercising access rights, you
can help to maintain animal health and biosecurity by:
• never feeding or directly contacting farm animals;
• taking all litter, including any food or associated packaging,
away with you;
• leaving gates as you find them;
• keeping dogs under proper control and removing dog faeces
(see paragraph 3.55); and

ThroughThickAndThin01 · 09/04/2016 17:51

OP - do,you have to keep access to your land open for people to be able to use it all the time? Are you allowed to close any of it off.

I csnt believe I didn't know this. I love walking and am very respectful of sticking to paths and shutting gates if shut or leaving them open if they are open etc. But I smagine the general public are entitled tossers about it all in general!

My mind is boggling. It's nice for the public but must incur so much work for farmers etc.

ThroughThickAndThin01 · 09/04/2016 17:53

Thanks OP, x posted. I'm a bit shocked.

I wish you well mannered visitors over the summer.

ThroughThickAndThin01 · 09/04/2016 17:53

Thanks Anthony

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 09/04/2016 17:53

I think that if ThroughThick s garden had a public footpath through it then there is legitimate access along the path only, no matter what part of the UK you are in?

AnthonyBlanche · 09/04/2016 17:54

There really needs to a change in the law to make it an offence to enter land which has livestock on it without invitation.

We are fortunate that we're not too close to any town or village and our land is not an obvious place to go walking. We still get the occasional idiot though and have all gates padlocked.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 09/04/2016 17:57

There really needs to a change in the law to make it an offence to enter land which has livestock on it without invitation.

Why? That would pretty much encompass all of rural Scotland, and most people are responsible users.

lamiashiro · 09/04/2016 18:01

I actually shouted at a cyclist who left a gate wide open last year after I was walking on a nearby footpath and saw him cut across a field. He came back and shut it, but was all huffy and said it didn't matter because he hadn't seen any sheep or cows so I had to tell him that wasn't really the point, you just don't leave gates open in the countryside. Sadly, some people will just never get it.

jacks11 · 09/04/2016 18:03

Through

As there is a right of way, I am obliged to keep this accessible and passable. As for the rest of the land, there are some rules but essentially I don't have to make it accessible per se, it's just that I do not have the right to prevent people from walking across my land and I can't take any action/erect fencing or signs etc that is solely designed to prevent or deter people from access the land.

OP posts:
WizardOfToss · 09/04/2016 18:03

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Fluffycloudland77 · 09/04/2016 18:04

QuietTiger

I kinda wish he'd shot the dog worrying the lambs.

Blush
RortyCrankle · 09/04/2016 18:08

It must drive you to despair that some people are so fucking stupid. Could you put up big notices that people who do not keep their children/dogs under control, especially around pregnant animals any action which results in the loss of young will result in legal action? It might make the fuckwits think twice. I would also put up huge signs saying that any dog seen on your land off a lead, with or without an owner nearby will be shot on sight?

TypicallyEnglishMustard · 09/04/2016 18:08

I agree, Wizard, I think tourists get a warped sense of reality when on holiday, and you're correct that th livelihoods of the locals do appear as an inconvenience to their holiday.

I live in a very tiny, very picturesque village, and I appreciate that, yes, it does look a bit like a storybook or a living museum or whatever, and is quite old-fashioned. Still doesn't mean I want people leaning over my garden wall, or walking in my garden gate to get pictures of the cottages.

AnthonyBlanche · 09/04/2016 18:11

Because itsall the livestock is someone's livelihood and the amount of damage caused by people wandering all over farmland. I also think that quite a large proportion of people are not responsible users.

jacks11 · 09/04/2016 18:12

Itsall

I have to say there is a significant minority who are not responsible users and the number of incidents we have had seem to climb year on year. I don't know why this is.

As I said previously, in principle I support the right to roam. Unfortunately, the practical experience of so many farmers/landowners is that the damage caused by that significant minority is becoming more of a problem. Sometimes the damage and inconvenience is very costly and there is often very little recourse that can be taken against the offenders (even if we can identify who they are). Conversely, where LA deem landowners to not be abiding by the law of access they can (and do) take action- which is right, but it really ought to cut both ways. So whilst I don't think it is entirely fair that farmland should be exempted, I can absolutely understand why some argue it should be.

If I'm honest I mostly dread seeing people coming up the footpath now, as there have been so many problems.

OP posts:
ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 09/04/2016 18:20

Because itsall the livestock is someone's livelihood and the amount of damage caused by people wandering all over farmland. I also think that quite a large proportion of people are not responsible users.

I have every sympathy with farmers, but the fact is banning the public from most of Scotland would be wrong and completely impractical.

It's a very tricky issue, but you can't just ban people becuase of an irresponsible minority. Should we ban dog ownership, or perhaps cars on roads?

jacks Is there anything your local access forum or LA can do to help. Are people being malicious, thoughtless or just ignorant? If the second two maybe some informational signage? Once kids can read they can fairly effective at telling their parents what to do Grin

If there really is a massive problem then landowners need to get together and petition for a change (not banning folk) Maybe some sort of scheme where the council compensated landowners for costs caused by people, like the Eagle compensation scheme? That would have the side affect if encouraging LAs to educate folk more, to cut their compensation costs.

AnthonyBlanche · 09/04/2016 18:36

But it wouldn't be most of Scotland itsall. If people want to walk off paths they can go to the huge areas of Scotland which are not farmed.

How would you feel if you had a manufacturing business and right to roam allowed people to just wander anywhere in your factory they felt like?? Oh and don't forget they can bring their dog and allow it to shit on the factory floor and let their children touch the machinery.

80sMum · 09/04/2016 18:40

Sorry only1scoop but I had to smile at your rerouting of the "bridal path"! Grin

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 09/04/2016 18:50

If people want to walk off paths they can go to the huge areas of Scotland which are not farmed.

IME most of Scotland where I have walked is hill sheep - or do they not count as livestock?

Oh and don't forget they can bring their dog and allow it to shit on the factory floor

I agree that the Dog Fouling Act needs to be updated. It is ridiculous that agricultural land is exempt.

let their children touch the machinery.

Perhaps some signage aboutvthe dangers of e-coli?

coldcanary · 09/04/2016 18:53

IL's are farmers with a public footpath running straight through the farmyard and last their front door, it's a real pain.
One time years ago me & then DP were house sitting for them and because we'd both worked a late shift we had dozed off on the sofa in front of the fire in the afternoon. Woke up to find a group of ramblers taking pictures of us through the window Confusedbloody weirdos..
They've had drunken idiots trying to tip the cows, kids trying to pet calves with the parents laughing at the obviously distressed mother, one person trying to take a hen with them, the works.
It's no wonder MIL is desperate to sell up and move.

AnthonyBlanche · 09/04/2016 19:02

Walking up a hill with a few sheep is a lot different to trampling through a lowland farm Itsall. And most people who go hillwalking are not arseholes. If you've not been on the receiving end of the appalling behaviour of the many people who now think they have the right to do what they like on farmland you won't understand the anger and upset they cause.