To think that parent and child car parking spaced should have an age limit of 5 years.

[buntingbingo]

Or be put at the back of the car park?

I have 3 dcs eldest is 9. Youngest is 2 months. Going to the supermarket is now a massive pain in the arse as there are never and p&c spaces.
I see people with giant kids who are perfectly able to walk, why do they need them? It's not the closeness to the shop that's useful, it's the extra width I need.
I end up struggling to get the baby seat out.
I think if they were at the back of the car park then people wouldn't bother with them unless they need the extra space. Or enforcing a lower age limit might stop the lazy people with big kids taking up all the spaces.
Rant over.
(Disclaimer. Obviously I'm not talking about anyone with special needs or disability, just kids capable of walking and perhaps shock helping to carry a bag or two)

These spaces appear to cause unneccessary aggresion in people. They are not needed ans should not exist. I understand. they are convenient.

We hae a 3 story parking locally.
The first floor is entirely disabled and usually empty
The 2nd floor is parent and child and may be 40% full.
The other 90% of us have to try find a parking onto the 3rd floor..

P&C spaces cause unnecessary aggression because they are, unnecessary. People who feel entitled to use them expect them to be ring-fenced in the same way that disabled spaces are, which is absurd.

IF P&C spaces were near trolley bays but AWAY from the store front I think they wouldn't be so coveted; non-idle people would still use them and this wouldn't be an issue.

Tbh Lying I would bloody LOVE them to be moved as they might then be left to parents with young children.

I don't think they are needed as such but they are wider and when you are trying to get a car seat strapped in while also sorting out shopping and toddlers they are handy. I don't have any car seats or toddlers anymore but I do remember the sheer relief when a space was available as I didn't have to worry about accidentally bashing into a car parked next to me. I could not have cared at that point WHERE the spaces were. They could have been at the other end of the car park for all I cared.

If all spaces were wider then they would not be needed at all.

One of my bathrooms has a shower that gets filled up with buckets of water when you want one.

My great grandparents coped very well with this.

Why do all of you bother with actual running water that is connected to taps and showers?

aggression because they are, unnecessary. People who feel entitled to use them expect them to be ring-fenced in the same way that disabled spaces are, which is absurd

I'm pretty sure they expect them just to be used in the way that the landowners request them to be used.they may well be a frippery but they are not your frippery to give or not.

Just the same as I don't want my brother parking in my space or my sister allowing the hunt to come through my garden or people using the through rights to meander from the path and have a fucking picnic using one of my sodding tables or let their kids play without consent on my children's outdoor toys.

When I had my girls I joined the Tesco baby club and they sent me a P&C parking permit which I was supposed to fill in with the kids' DoB. The permit said it was valid until they were 3. Suspect I may have been the only person in England who actually had one of those permits though.

TBH after a few months of stressing about getting a space (in our Tesco they were near a trolley park, which I needed because I didn't want to leave 2 babies in the car and couldn't carry 2 babies to the trollies) I just started doing my shopping in the mornings when it was quiet and if there were no P&C spaces I just parked across 2 spaces. There were plenty of other spaces at that time of day so not depriving anyone. I couldn't get the kids out the car without the door opened almost full and they were on both sides.

I'm really glad, from that point of view, that my kids are now old enough to get in and out the car themselves. I found it so stressful trying to manage with small vulnerable people, all problems x2 or worse because twins, and there are a lot of people who are just dying to tell you don't park here or you're doing it wrong or whatever. I swear to god if I don't remember all this and have sympathy for new parents when mine are up and away, something in my own soul will have died.

I think they are closer to the shops for two reasons at supermarkets ...
One there is usually a bit with some shelter - as anyone who has struggled getting two DCs out of a trolley full of shopping and into the car in torrential rain will know - that is an advantage. (Bad enough just putting shopping straight in the boot in those conditions without the additional which do you let get wetter the DC or the shopping) - farther away they would 'need' to build some shelter rather than utilise what is already there.
And there will be an existing walk way ...so if you have a dc too big for the trolley and a bit of a bolter you aren't stuck with abandoning a trolley (maybe with a non walking DC in) in the middle of a busy carpark whilst you catch the bolter ...
Even with older DCs I confess that I find walking on car parks stressful - drivers are distracted looking for spaces and definitely don't always look behind them properly before reversing - someone reversed into my car once when I was stopped at a zebra crossing on a supermarket car park - and similar happened to my DM ....and DP so it must be quite common. I am also very aware that you can't see a small child walking behind a car in your mirror and they are unlikely to react as adult - they won't know what the reverse lights mean or even react as expected if they realise the car is starting to come towards them...

Close to the shops means safer for children as less chance of getting knocked down. Wider spaces means safer for other people's cars, and again, safer for children as you're more likely to fit their infant carrier correctly or be able to strap them in properly. But let's not let any concern about children's safety get in the way of a good moan about entitled mothers.

There should at least be some enforcement! Anyone who doesn't need to help their child get in and out their seat should get a ticket/ told to move. It is one my biggest annoyance about shopping. It REALLY REALLY REALLY annoyed me when DS was tiny and i needed to take car seat out the car but no spaces big enough.

I'd say stop calling them parent and child, call them small baby spaces. Anyone that doesn't NEED to park in one shouldn't be allowed to park there. Some sort of parking permit you have to apply for - all under 2's (as they will need help getting in), under 5's if necessary (some are more than capable of doing up the straps and just need a quick check) and over 5 only exceptional circumstances. Or at least convert a couple of the loads unused disabled spaces to baby spaces.

However I have now given up and for the main reason of never being able to find a suitable space in the local Sainsburys car park I switched to online shopping. I pick up any extras from the shop I can walk to from home.

Oh Christ on a bike.....

....actually scrap that, he'd probably park his bike too near a parent and child space and get a fine, entitled son of god.

Convert disabled spaces to baby spaces?

Are you the lovely couple who parked beside us in the disabled spaces at beach tonight with no badge because you had a baby in a big pram?

(Who were very close to getting told that having a baby is not a disability )

There were spaces further up street of course.

I'm not listening to anyone with such a twee username as GrumpyMummy

Hahaha Cock!!! hilarious!

Just looking for the smallest violin in the world!

Close to the shops means safer for children as less chance of getting knocked down.

If you can't supervise your children across the distance of a supermarket car park so that they are safe, you really shouldn't be taking them there.

Why don't people put reins on children who have a tendency to bolt/wander? Ds has to wear a harness or reins every time we leave the house as he has no understanding of road or traffic safety. I don't understand why those with much younger children don't do so if they have the same problem.

My main concern is that you are leaving your 2month old in the carseat to do the shopping

If you can't supervise your children across the distance of a supermarket car park so that they are safe, you really shouldn't be taking them there

This

And also why not tell them to sit still until you open the door for them? And if they can't do as they're told, use child locks?

Parents of children with additional needs should have access to disabled spaces. All the rest have no more need of a wider or closer space than many of the rest of us. P&C spaces should be removed and replaced with wider spaces for anyone who needs or prefers a wider space for any reason. They definitely should not be interchangeable with disabled spaces and for the use of children up to 12 like they are in my local Sainsburys.

Or at least convert a couple of the loads unused disabled spaces to baby spaces.

Yes of course, those disabled people should have far less spaces. FFS don't be such a twit Grumpy

*If you can't supervise your children across the distance of a supermarket car park so that they are safe, you really shouldn't be taking them there

This*

Oh bollocks to that. I find shepherding a 7,5 and 2 year old across a busy carpark stressful and risky, even if they are well-behaved. Cars pull out without notice, and come from all directions. Which is why I rarely take mine to the supermarket, but you know, sometimes there isn't any choice. So shoot me.

In fact, God forbid anybody try to make parents' lives easier with small kindnesses. Much better they be left to suffer inconvenience to satisfy the self-righteous. Especially if, God forbid, their kids aren't visions of angelic loveliness and obedience at all times, and especially during a stressful supermarket shop.

honking ...reins you are 'lucky' your DS will wear them ...
DD1 has ADHD. She was (is) oppositional.
I also have a DD2 - she is a breeze in comparison. I tell her not to do something and she stops, she doesn't carry on doing it even more. If I get cross with her for doing something silly she gets upset and says sorry - she doesn't do it even more or something worse because she is angry. And she cares about consequences. So a threat usually (within normal young child understanding) will have an effect.

DD1 was a bolter ...and a disappearer - I lost her countless times. And she was an only child up to the age of 6.... only one to think about.

Reins believe me I tried - from walking age - I tried three different kinds (we didn't have the animal backpack type ones then but I don't think they would have worked) resulted in massive tantrums and a refusal to walk. Sit down and scream refusal to move. Nothing you could do about it (except carry her wearing them kicking and screaming). She would sometimes wear them but if they impeded her at all she would tantrum. Not really want you need happening in the middle of a busy carpark with a full shopping trolley...
The only thing that had limited success was a wrist rein as a game and she would pretend to be a dog. But that lasted about 5 times before she got tired of the game. Would even refuse to hold hands on occasions - I remember an awful occasion on an escalator in M&S at age 4 - she decided she didn't want to hold hands and so I held it more firmly and she started screaming I was hurting her hand... the look a woman gave me.
Just don't take them shopping or leave the house without them wearing them ...DP worked long hours, if I did that I would never leave the house - she was sat in the trolley and the pram way past walking age as it was a way of keeping her under control and she (in general) didn't mind and I used to tell her I was jealous - wished someone would push me around...

She didn't need a disabled space - and as she was diagnosed at just turned 14 it would have been a bit late for that.
If others find it so easy - I'm genuinely pleased for you - just don't use P&C spaces ... leave them for the parents who do find them useful...
Yes we could live without them ... life would be harder ...and it is hard enough.

I have lost count of the amount of pedestrians I have almost knocked into while trying to slowly reverse out of spaces as they appear out of nowhere and march past. I probably do it too, as I'm not perfect unlike many on this thread clearly I would prefer to minimise the length of time that small and even less visible people are walking through an area of parked cars.

Those who say children with SN should use disabled spaces.... do you know how HARD is it to get a blue badge for a neurological condition? Scotland are starting a 12 month trial tomorrow, but even the paperwork for that is ridiculous. 13 pages, and a 3 page report from a medical professional that isn't a GP. The majority of children I know with a diagnosis of ASD don't have an appointed person who could vouch this for them. 'Luckily' my DD1 also has ADHD but we only see her nurse every 6 months, and he would know nothing about her road safety awareness as he's never had her outside of the building. Should he write a report claiming about her difficulties around traffic etc, when all he does is review her meds? Who else could I approach to do this?
It's not as simple as 'You have a disability, use a disabled space'. I am disabled (I hate writing that, but it is true ), but don't claim disability benefits, therefore I am not entitled to a blue badge. Maybe I should just stay at home even on the rare occasions I feel well enough to be out and about, because, god forbid, you have to walk an extra 5ft holding a baby.