To be scared about unauthorised absence?

[lakeful]

We currently live abroad but will be moving back to England in the next year, have two DCs who are in primary school. I sometimes have to do foreign travel with my job my DH (who is self-employed and very flexible) and DCs have occasionally come with me. I'm talking a period of maybe 4 weeks in total over the past two years. Where we live now, schools do encourage attendance but things are more relaxed than in England and there has not been any problem with me taking them out of school. I have been reading up on the English system and am a bit alarmed! Would I really have to get a Head Teacher's permission to take my own children abroad? Would I really be fined if I did this without their "authorisation"? And is it possible that they authorise children to miss school for reasons such as mine?

The trips sounds very interesting. However it's bollocks to think you can do a little bit of work with them and that will catch up with a week of two of missed school. And who is providing you with this work?
Why not stick to trips in holidays only for a while?

I'm perfectly able to do a bit of school work with the in the week they are off. They're not doing a medical degree or anything its a bit of maths and english.

That's not very respectful of the skilled and qualified teachers to who you will entrust your DCs education!

I live offshore so the schools are packed with expat kids - attendance is important yes, but the schools (have to be) understanding that children will potentially need to travel every now and again, and the teachers are prepared for it. They set external homework for those travelling and/or reading etc, so they don't fall behind. Similar, I think, to when I was a kid.

Fair enough to be a bit about letting kids skip school for any old excuse, but if I'm going to a family wedding or funeral or my flights abroad are $700 cheaper to take them out of school 2 days early then damn right I'm going to do it. And parents shouldn't be shamed for doing it.

I believe my children have learned more in the few weeks they have spent in developing countries than sitting inside a classroom. Teachers aren't the only ones who educate.

No, but it'll be the teachers putting in weeks/months of work to bring them up to speed for their end of year tests/SATS.

All of which will be broadly based on our national curriculum.

TBH probably a lot of teachers and heads would probably agree with you about the "educational value" of travel to situations you describe though often the same description is used for trips to Disneyland

But they are simply no longer allowed to authorise absence any more.

If you take your kids out of school for that length of time you might not be fined but would almost certainly return to find that they have been deregistered and lose their place. Unless the school is undersubscribed and the HT is very very understanding.

You've got a very unusual situation. What other arrangements can you make for the children's care when you travel? Have you considered boarding school or private ed?

Can anyone (genuinely here) tell me what a primary school child actually learns in one week of school? How would this be so hard to cover? And Iggi if you are going to so strongly state that it is "bollocks" maybe you could back that up with some statement about why? Thank you Danger for your words about the nanny state those are my thoughts entirely.

The dcs won't have much fun though if they are going to be doing schoolwork the whole time they are away, so as not to miss anything. And there's lots more than maths and English to do.

You've got a very unusual situation. What other arrangements can you make for the children's care when you travel? Have you considered boarding school or private ed?

How is it unusual?

She has a DH who I assume is capable of looking after his kids and getting them to school

Nice to see you consider your "trips" more important than your childrens' education, OP. What a ridiculous question. Send them to school like everyone else and stop being such a prima donna.

HanYolo thank you for your considered and respectful response. Is the situation the same for private schools or not? I am actually genuinely trying to make sense of it all and understand the system, which is completely alien to me. And for what it is worth, if I was taking them to Disneyland, I would not dream of doing this in term time.

This is one that will always come with very strong mixed opinions. I like yourself think it's good to occasionally let the child experience new places and other cultures, but some people don't. Whilst schools have no choice but to adhere to the law, I can tell you for certain that quite a few teachers are actually of the same mind also. It's also not really that big a worry for a child to catch up on work if they were to miss a week if the school was to give them some pre-set work to take away with them. The problem is that this can no longer be done, because if parents are taking kids out of school for a week, they can't be honest about it for fear of being fined.
Unfortunatlely though, no matter how many people believe, like myself, that you're doing no harm to the children's education with an occasional trip abroad, it won't make a difference, everything you've heard about the law in UK is true. It's the reason my mum has not been able to take a family holiday in 7 years, instead her or her husband take one of the three kids one at a time during school holidays, otherwise it would cost a fortune. I myself am also trying to get plenty of holidays in with my DS before he starts school too.

I like yourself think it's good to occasionally let the child experience new places and other cultures, but some people don't.

And then there's a ton of other people who think they can experience that, during the 13 weeks holiday they get per year.

xenapants is name calling actually necessary here? That's just pathetic.

Worra, yes just re-read OP - thought for some reason the DH was working away too. Derp

No reason for them to go at all then. Flexible self-employed father can look after them. It's a choice, not a necessity.

Private ed only option if you want to be able to take them out whenever you feel like it for any length of time

Fpmd thank you for that, its very interesting and helpful information. Its clearly really having an impact on families and being strictly enforced. I get that people have strong views on it but don't get why people feel the need to be so attacking on here. I have probably attracted a lot of teachers to post with the thread title.

The rules only apply to state schools as far as I know.

DD's private school seem to operate under the olds tyle don't take the mickey and we will authorise it rules. Any absences for DD have been authorised eg 1 or 2 days tacked onto a half term or a few days to go to a work conference with DH when I was scheduled to be in hospital. At the start of the year they publish exam weeks and say please keep absence to a minimum.

Some families have taken full weeks or even 2/3 weeks with no ramifications.

Depends on the age of the children.

My DD is 10, so in year 5. This week, only four days as it's the start of the school holidays, had maths, English, PE, science, topic work, guided reading and writing, music and art. I've probably missed something.

You think primary kids do a 'bit of English and Maths' and yet you ask what they do in the space of a week? I know from volunteering in a reception class for three years previously, that they learn an awful lot. The pace of learning is fast and things are not revisited in depth but the skills they learn are used further down the line.

My DD missed one day of school recently and the homework for Maths last week was covered on the day she missed (due to a hospital appointment) and now she has no idea how to do the homework she's been given.

I do think that if you can't stick to the rules or put the same effort into your children's schooling then home educate. You can either leave your dc at home with your dh while you go abroad or you can time your trips to fall into the 13 weeks of holidays they get each year.

But I'd advise against railing against the system before you are even in it. And I'd be interested to know how you'd facilitate your dc's learning when they reach exam level.

Sorry Fpmd but "pre-set work to take away with them"

Teachers don't have time for that!

Your choice how you educate your children - state education or home education, if you want state education then you have to accept the rules and restrictions! If you want the flexibility of taking your children away with you as and when then something is going to need to give.

I don't see why you are having such a hard time accepting that for 39 weeks the year you need to ensure the children are in school

HanYolo thanks for clarifying re: private education. We might need to consider exploring that further. Yes it is a choice and not a necessity, its just currently a choice we are free to make (and actually make very rarely in the scheme of things, my kids have excellent attendance overall). Its just that when we move back, there will be this whole legal process involved and its quite a change. I find it a bit insulting that people automatically conclude that my stance on this means I don't think my DCs education is important because nothing could be further from the truth.

Why is UK so strict on this? And fines per day? Was there lots of issues before with absences or is it a money making thing

Not UK. Just England.

Disappointed is that really true? Not Wales or Scotland?

I agree with a lot of what you say OP, however if you choose to enrol your children in the UK state education system then you need to abide the rules, even if you disagree with them.

Thanks Shiny I do realise that, I was just looking for advice from people who are living there and have direct experience of it and how the rules are enforced.

I'm cynical. I'm inclined to go with money making.

A bit like the council enforcers who can impose fines on litter louts..... But if two people, alongside each other, drop a fag butt simultaneously on the street, one in a suit, one in trackie bums and hoody..... Who are they most likely to slap the fine on? The one most likely able to pay. Mr trackie bum doesn't get followed across town and harassed to accept a ticket.

Fact.