To think that a 5yo shouldnt be left all alone, even for a couple of mins?!

[upsidedownfrown]

Hiya, been years since I've been on here but hey ho, I'm back. Anyway, I won't go into loads of detail as I like anonymity and too many details could blow my cover!

In a nutshell, last week a 5yo and 3yo were left sitting on the doorstep of their locked house completely unsupervised for about 5 mins while mum went to get her car parked a couple of streets away.

I watched them from my house when I realised they were there as I saw mum leave and come back a few mins later with her car.

Not a busy road but a very easy street to get off of really quickly with alleyways and walk throughs to neighbouring streets.

It's been bothering me for days. I guess its made me feel uneasy. Obviously it's not my place to say anything but it's been playing on my mind for some reason.

Thanks all for your input. I won't say anything to the mum. Unless it happens again then I'll go for the casual 'oh I thought I'd wait with them cos they're so little and were on their own'.

I have a 5, 6 and 8yo. I wouldn't dream of leaving my 5yo for 10secs but that's because he likes to run after birds atm trying to talk in his bird language.... Hopefully that phase won't last long! My 6yo girl is a very sensible girl and in a couple of years I would probably feel confident if a situation like that arose. My 8yo on the other hand has high functioning autism, is distracted by shiny things and talks to strangers cos he's a bit overly friendly so it's gonna take a good amount more practicing before we get anywhere with him!

3 year old, no. 5 year old, probably. When my DC were 8, they had quite a lot of freedom: going on errands to the shops/supermarket, getting the bus a few stops by themselves (London transport so free for kids). Not really relevant to OP, but I do think it's important for DC to develop independence so it's not such a shock when they go to secondary school.

When my eminently sensible 4yo started school, I left him alone at home playing/reading while I took the 2yo to nursery (30 min round trip) - he was happy with that. My younger DC hated being left alone, so he never was. Parents know their kids - you don't know their kids.

That sounds perfectly sensible Treaclesoda! Our last head teacher was incredibly paranoid and had deep seated belief that if parents had to be at work then they must not love their children

I don't think it's much to do with "babying" that children under 7 shouldn't necessarily be allowed to walk by themselves, and far more to do with natural impulsivity at that age. DS1 and I watched one of his classmates in Y1 nearly get flattened by a bus because he forgot basic rules of the road and ran across to his mum without checking the road. Luckily the school bus was only travelling very slowly and managed to brake in time but FGS! His mum has had him out walking since he was very young, he cycles around etc. - so technically has done all that training in roadcraft - and yet he still did that.

DS1 is a daydreamer. There isn't a hope in hell that he's going to be allowed to walk to school, crossing 3 busy roads, only one of which has pedestrian lights, before he's 10 (unless he has a major personality change before then).

I was walking to school alone at 5 because the school was right next door. I walked to junior school alone after that (from 7 up) because all the children did, it was 5 minutes away and there was a lollipop lady on the crossroads to get us across safely. I doubt my parents would have allowed me to do so had there NOT been a lollipop lady there though!

Our school does have someone on the gate and they would definitely know if a child was walking to school on their own.

At my DC'S school they're not allowed to walk to and from school until YR5 so 9is. My DD is in Reception and until YR 3 they have to be collected from class by an identified adult that you record on a form. If they are going home with someone else you have to write the details in a book.

I think this is only partly about trust. Maybe some people's kids are very sensible but some will go chasing off after a dog, a cat, a balloon or ball, who knows what!

I think all kids are different and we all think we know our kids and what they would or would not do. But why risk it?

What we do not know if what other factors might happen, like if we got rear-ended while moving the car and ended up talking longer, might the kids go looking for mum?

Just so you know if you are worried about the safety of a child you can anonymously report the parent to the NSPCC. This may sound extreme but of course it does not necessarily mean anything would happen but it might mean they may receive a visit that tells them that some behaviour has been spotted, or so I am led to believe.

It sounds obvious but if you call NSPCC and wish to remain anonymous do not leave your name or identifying details. They actually say that on the phone so there is no confusion whether you want to be identified or not. I have not reported anyone but I did call them about a concern I had, about a child, and they put my fears to rest, so calling was actually very helpful.

Personally, I agree with ILostItInTheEarlyNineties re If she does it again, could you pop over to the kids and chat to them til mum comes back? You could then show her you were a bit concerned and she will hopefully rethink her actions. Although if this is a regular occurrence I may just be tempted to report her.

If one of the kids did run into the road, e.g. the little one, and the older one ran after to protect them, one or both could be injured. No amount of 'I never thought it would happen' can un-break a leg or bring back a life if someone is seriously hurt. To me it's just lazy, is it so hard to walk round the corner with two small kids?

I'd never leave a three and five year old unattended in the street, and yes, I was left in my pram in the front garden, I don't know if it was a safer time, it feels safer in the past and there were fewer cars.

People on here would seriously leave a 5 year old totally unsupervised in the street while they were well out of ear shot/eye sight. Just the thought of coming back and DS potentially not being there fills me with horror. Let alone a 3 year old!

Bloody hell.

I would also say that young and older children's behaviour can be erratic, so no matter how well you think you know your child, they can behave out of character. The risk is totally not worth it.

I would mention it to the woman next time you see her OP and point out her stupidity and the fact that next time you will report her to SS. I think they would consider that child endangerment.

X post Italian!

I walked to school with another 6 year old when I was in primary school, and to my knowledge, most children from that area did the same.

Obviously depends on where you live. In a nice rural area where all the neighbours have an eye on the streets, there's next to no danger.

Actually ... what could happen? Once the child is old enough to know to be careful when crossing a street, the only likely danger are malevolent adults. And a child isn't safe from those well into puberty, and no one really suggests to keep a 10 year old under surveillance at all times.
(And considering that most men who like to rape children take jobs where they are the ones who watch the children ... you know, leaving a child alone seems not so risky in comparison.)

Considering that you noticed they were sitting there, the mother correctly assumed the neighbourhood to be one where her children are watched over by others, and as they never left the doorstep, she was also correct in predicting that they would do as she told them.

I'd leave a 5 year old no problem, my DD is 5 and has been playing out unsupervised for at least a year and a half now. She and her 7 year old friend once biked off without me going home (my wheel had got stuck and I needed to fix it and they didn't hear me yell at them to wait) and I got home and found them both sat on my doorstep waiting happily for me.

3 year old probably not, unless they could be relied on to stay on the step.

My child is like Kiwi's I just knew he would never go into a road, I'm sure he was hit by a car in a past life even as a baby he would cry and look panicked when a car maneuvers or pulls onto a drive near us when we are walking. He was always able to from 2 years old scoot or ride he's balance bike in front of me and now tells me off if he thinks I didn't check a road for long enough when we step out. Some kids are just compliant and have a sense of danger.
I agree I wouldn't trust a younger child to walk to school alone because I don't think they can judge speed or distance before 7, but some children do sense danger. For the ones that don't I don't think it's anything to do with being babied.

Oh and I let my 5 year old cross the road to go to the park across the street - she has very good road sense (and its a very quiet road with a low speed limit and speed bumps)

People get so cross on here when you say what you did as a child as though it would have been impossible, but I did get the bus to school at 5 ( normal bus not a school one )got of at the other end walked to school and then did the reverse in the evening. I was met up at the bus stop by my mother. This is not a false memory because I remember the day my sister was born being met by my grandmother. I was 5 and 7 months. I would not of let my own children do that, but I did and so did the other children in the village. I can remember anxiously watching from the bus window to see where I had to get off.I think children must rise to occasions. When I watch some of the tiny children looking after their even smaller siblings in the Indian slums and see their capacity for survival at such a young age I conclude that small children are capable of much more than we now give them credit for.

'where all the neighbours have an eye on the streets'

So neighbours need to watch out for kids and... I am not sure many people feel able to supervise random neighbours kids or if necessary tell kids off or do much these days! If the kids started fighting/crying I expect many people would not feel able to intervene.

It's a nice idea, and I do speak to kids if I think there is a problem, e.g. 'are you OK?' but I think that gets harder to do, if one ran off, I know I would want to make sure they are OK etc but still, I don't expect neighbours to watch my kids except by actual arrangement.

Absolutely not. No way. Nuh uh. Would never forgive myself if something happened. But that's just me.

Yes, I'm sure as a matter of 'survival' children that old can cope but they're certainly more vulnerable than your average 10 year old and it's a nonsense to suggest it's an equal risk. My Dad works in Ghana and lives sometimes in Accra, sometimes in a very isolated rural village where he's working on a project as you can imagine he's come across loads of young children that are his granddaughter's age (4) and they've had to 'survive' but in the city alot of them are at risk of being injured or killed by traffic, exploited by bad people as they're too young to understand the risks they're encountering.

Exactly the same could happen to an 8 year old as could happen to a 5 year old!

Exactly the same could happen to a 14 yo too...

Assuming you're not going to hold your 18 year old's hand to go the pub, what age do you think it's ok for someone to be left for a few minutes...