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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Is it fair to be expected to pay half her Mortgage?

1000 replies

Tophat72 · 16/02/2016 19:46

Hi there. I'm looking for some impartial comment on what has become a huge issue between my partner and me.

We are both divorcees but although with similar salaries, have very different financial commitments. I have two children I am financially responsible for while she is childless and comfortably well off. She has her own large home and only has 5 years left to pay on her mortgage. I lost my house in my financial settlement with my ex.

I live with my partner in her home. Before moving in with her, I had to sign a legal agreement acknowledging that I have no claim whatsoever on any percentage of the house in the event of our separation. The house is hers and hers alone. Furthermore, I am not catered for in any way in her will. Should she die, the house and her entire estate goes to her sister and nephew...

My partner believes that all the household expenses, including her mortgage payments, should be split 50-50 between us. I however am adamant that given the circumstances, I should not be contributing towards the purchase of her house and I am only prepared to pay for my share of the other household bills (utilities, council tax, groceries etc)

This has become a huge bone of contention between us and sadly things are looking terminal.

Her position is that paying half of her outstanding mortgage should be looked upon by me as paying a modest rent as if she were my landlady. She also quite rightly points out that I am still living very cheaply and if I were to get a place of my own my monthly outgoings would be well over twice what I currently pay her. She feels that I earn the same as her and live under the same roof so I should pay the same.

From my perspective, I have absolutely no objection to going 50-50, but only if she is prepared to afford me some kind of proportionate security or stake in the house in the event of our separation or her death. I don't see why I should contribute 50% towards the ongoing purchase of a capital investment that I have a 0% share in. I feel as though she wants to have her cake and eat it, keeping everything to herself while expecting me to pay for an equal share of, well nothing.

I've tried to write this as objectively as I can. Obviously her friends and family support her position and my friends and family mine. For my own peace of mind, I would be really keen to read the thoughts of a truly neutral observer. Cheers

OP posts:
Spectre8 · 19/02/2016 01:15

well one thing most of us can take away from here is to make sure you get legal advice because its clear as day many on here think they know the law but really don't understand it well enough, and like the OP's DP open themselves up to a certain amount of risk.

I cannot even be bothered to respond to your post Lea because its a waste of time telling you what the law states and I have no interest in educating you in it either as you will just ignore what it says.

NeedsAsockamnesty · 19/02/2016 01:20

In family law it's down to the circumstances and many of the finer points of each circumstance can impact on that.

It is rarely x = abc

If I was the op and intending to go to court I wouldn't be thinking it was a slam dunk and I would expect an ethical Solisitor to advise me that it was not a dead cert.

Alasalas · 19/02/2016 01:23

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

NeedsAsockamnesty · 19/02/2016 01:27

Obviously we don't know but it is more likely to be a standard thing that mortgage companies use when single people buy houses but have someone living with them as a condition for the mortgage.

Monty27 · 19/02/2016 01:27

I don't think law comes into it (yet). Here's MHO

OP can throw money at a house that will never be his and why should it be?. (although I think OP is squaking about paying money, because he wants to live there rent free whilst financing his family). The partner is sorted in her life and so should you OP. Get your mitts of her assets. And is no way you would have any claim on that house and neither should you. So just move on if it's an issue?

I hope that was half at least, well written (tired).

YellowTulips · 19/02/2016 01:31

Lovely

Re:Yeah leave them and play twice as much in rent living in a much smaller home. That will teach her!

Actually yes.

He could rent or buy if he was not funding her. He can't do both.

The irony to your argument is he wins by moving out. He gets an assured tenancy or gets to contribute equity into a home of his own.

She loses the contribution he makes to her income.

MillionToOneChances · 19/02/2016 01:35

I'm staggered how many people have strong views on things they blatantly don't understand. Just as examples:

so if you continue you would have spent 9yrs paying half a mortgage, so i think its fair to have a % of the house if you split,33% seems fair as you would have paid roughly a third 9yrs of a 25yr mortgage

Erm, no! What about the equity she put in?

Scenario 1) Say the house cost £500,000. She paid £400,000 from the sale of her old house and carried over a £100,000 mortgage. No way on earth does he deserve 33% of the house!

Scenario 2) I think this post may have been from before OP's update, so you could think of it another way. Say she bought her home for £200,000 years ago before she met OP (we now know this isn't what happened, but just to help people see how overly simplistic their thinking has been). By the time she met OP the house was worth £500,000 and she still had £100,000 of the mortgage left to pay. So he's helped with half of the mortgage for 4 years and anticipates paying for another 5. But he's only paying 50% of 20% of the value of the property, and if she's spent a lot customising the property to their taste without adding much monetary value...

On date X, when you start contributing to the mortgage, the house is worth £500,000.

Your contributions are £500 a month.

At the point at which you split up/she dies, you've paid £12,000 towards the house. At that point the house is worth £600,000.

You get out your £12,000 back, increased by the same percentage as the value of the house, so £14,400.

What about the interest charges OP's partner had to pay during that time? What about renovations she paid for that improved their living standards and made their life better but didn't add much monetary value? In short, we simply don't know enough to make a ruling on what's fair to expect to get back out in the event of a split or bereavement.

OP, I think it's perfectly reasonable for you to be expected to pay a contribution towards all bills, including mortgage. In fact, I think it would be very much in your best interests, if you anticipate this relationship being long term, for you to split all costs 50/50 so that you benefit from the drop in costs when the mortgage is paid off. If you'd moved into a house she was renting you wouldn't quibble about paying half and the cost would probably be much higher with no change of your 'landlord' later marrying you and sharing assets or willing equity to your children. But it doesn't sound like you're both in this for the long haul. It sounds like your partner is ignoring your concerns about longterm finances and you're benefiting from a low cost of living at the moment whilst squirrelling money away for a future life apart.

OP, I don't see how it's fair to build up your own house deposit by paying your partner less. It's not her fault you lost your home in your divorce, particularly since you gave up equity in your marital home to safeguard your pension and I assume you're not offering her a nice big chunk of that?? Can't you agree a compromise where you save slowly (at a rate of what it would cost you to rent a flat minus what you pay towards the mortgage) for the next five years and then ramp up your savings when there's no mortgage left to pay? Then hopefully you can buy a Buy to Let flat to make you feel more secure and hopefully bring in a retirement income for you both. Or if you're preparing for an imminent split, don't do it whilst shortchanging your current partner. Just leave and pay your own living expenses.

YellowTulips · 19/02/2016 01:36

Ala

Re: I think it's worrying that people label someone as cold/calculating/unloving because at the beginning of a new relationship they protected their financial assets. If she were my daughter I would have INSISTED she had done the same.

RTFT

I'd agree with you IF it was a new relationship. But it's not.

Notwithstanding the agreements they made at the start of the relationship at this point in a reevaluation is not unreasonable.

YellowTulips · 19/02/2016 01:40

Million

Your points are so full of holes I don't know where to begin.

Again RTFT

NeedsAsockamnesty · 19/02/2016 01:42

He could rent or buy if he was not funding her. He can't do both

He is funding his current lifestyle that is only afforded by his DP's assets.

If he was living alone he would be living within his personal means and as he was not living in her house he wouldn't need to afford to do both.

MillionToOneChances · 19/02/2016 01:45

Or, as an alternative, after 4 years perhaps it's time to put up or shut up. Get married and pool everything (pension, equivalent amount of house equity, income) or acknowledge that one or both of you doesn't see it as a full partnership and move on...

YellowTulips · 19/02/2016 01:46

Again RTFT...

He is not dependent on his partner.

The OP stated his lifestyle is better living with her but equally he could live independently.

MillionToOneChances · 19/02/2016 01:47

yellow I've read the full thread. Perhaps we disagree. Do you disagree with my view that some people are missing the point in their calculations?

MillionToOneChances · 19/02/2016 01:49

I didn't say he was dependent on her, I said he was safeguarding his needs and not taking hers into account and that she is doing the same. Something isn't going well in this relationship, and if it's otherwise loving they have a lot of talking to do.

LovelyFriend · 19/02/2016 01:50

Yellow I think you would benefit from RTFT as you repeatedly put it.

And relaxing a bit. This seems to be absurdly personal to you.

Monty27 · 19/02/2016 01:50

OP's partner doesn't really support him or his dcs. I hope I've read that right. Its win win for her and lose lose for OP.

I'd cut and run.

MillionToOneChances · 19/02/2016 01:53

monty, given OP doesn't have a deposit for mortgage and admits his costs would be higher if renting alone, I think there's a bit of win in there for him financially? Leaving aside the fact he presumably (hopefully) enjoys his partner's company.

Alasalas · 19/02/2016 01:54

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MillionToOneChances · 19/02/2016 01:59

Quote from OP: We began to fall out over a lot of things, primarily to do with what I perceived as a lack of intimacy and quality time together. As my general dissatisfaction grew, I began to think about the financial set up and formed my own opinion that I was being pretty much shafted. [...] I am religiously saving the money I am no longer giving her and it will be available to her should she agree to giving me some kind of security. Other than that, it will go towards a property of my own, rented or bought if and when I am shown the door.

Reading it again it sounds more and more as though OP is trying to renegotiate a settlement he was happy with when he saw a future with his partner (that she relied on when making her decisions about whether to pay the costs of moving to be near his children) now that he sees things as being on much shakier ground. Changing how things are done going forwards is one thing. Changing what was done in the past 4 years is another.

MillionToOneChances · 19/02/2016 02:00

Grin alasalas agreed!

Thegreenhen1 · 19/02/2016 02:31

I think to be technically correct you should pay half of the interest on the mortgage each month but not any of the capital.

What's the plan when the mortgage is paid off? Will your rent stop too?

StrictlyMumDancing · 19/02/2016 06:30

If you owned a property outright, would you expect your partner to pay you rent for the privilege of staying there

I've told DH not that apparently its abhorrent that he charged me above bills and food when we lived in his house, because you should never charge a long term partner rent apparently. He said because I no long pay a share of our now joint mortgage I'm a freeloading cocklodger.

OP's partner doesn't really support him or his dcs. I hope I've read that right. Its win win for her and lose lose for OP. OP has said she houses his kids for 2 days a week, whether she's actively involved or leaves the property for that time she is providing at minimum a home. He could live alone and rent or buy his own but it was tight, therefore living in her home and paying his partner less than market rate is also funding his lifestyle and presumably helps his kids out too. Its nowhere close to lose-lose for him. Its more like win-smash for him if he gets to either have a share or doesn't contribute further towards the household than just bills.

DontCareHowIWantItNow · 19/02/2016 06:38

OP has said she houses his kids for 2 days a week

No she doesn't. 2 nights every 2 weeks for which he pays for all extras including food.

StrictlyMumDancing · 19/02/2016 06:40

I missed this in the OP:
We began to fall out over a lot of things, primarily to do with what I perceived as a lack of intimacy and quality time together. As my general dissatisfaction grew, I began to think about the financial set up and formed my own opinion that I was being pretty much shafted.

So OP was happy with the arrangement when he was being screwed physically but now its not at the level he's happy with he's decided he'e being screwed financially. And people seem to think thats fine. Wow, just, wow.

alas has it bang on though:
^OPs request to re-examine their original agreement is not unreasonable but she is has declined.
OP therefore can feel negative about this as justly or unjustly as MNers argue (mostly between each other), but OP now only two choices: stay or leave.^
Or alternatively stay and try to bully her into giving him his way, which I'm beginning to worry may be the point of this thread.

StrictlyMumDancing · 19/02/2016 06:43

2 nights every 2 weeks for which he pays for all extras including food. ok, but that's still not supporting his kids though is it? She isn't saying no, they cannot stay here. Even if she was leaving the house for those times, she's providing them a roof to stay under.

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