Regarding landlords responsibility for gaps that cigarette smoke enters my property?

[Oldisthenewblack]

I live in a housing association flat. There appears to be some kind of gap at the back of the kitchen cupboard under the sink. The holes are where pipework emerges, so it's a 'necessary' hole. The problem is that the gaps around the pipework are just empty, there is no filler or cover there. These holes must somehow be connected to the flat next to me, as over the 15 years I have lived there, all manner of smells have emerged from this cupboard, food smells, paint smells...you name it.

I've always put up with this as I realise there are lots of things that have to be tolerated when you're living in close proximity to other people. However, a new tenant has just moved in next door, and I suspect he's a smoker as this morning, when I entered my kitchen, the smell of cigarette smoke hit me.

Now, just to be absolutely clear: I am well aware that what other people do in their own homes is their business. I am entirely unconcerned with whether someone smokes or not. My concern is that this smoke is entering my property and, if it continues, could affect my health. I suffer from asthma, take two inhalers to manage the problem, and cigarette smoke is one of the things that can really bring on an attack.

I rang the housing association this morning and was told, in no uncertain terms, that there's nothing they can do. They continually repeated that "we can't tell people what to do in their own homes". ENTIRELY missing the point that I have no desire to curtail what people do in the privacy of their own homes. The maintenance woman was extremely patronising and because of her attitude I'm going to put in a formal complaint, but aside from that, I'm asking: am I being unreasonable to expect the landlord to sufficiently seal gaps between properties so that cigarette smoke from one property does not enter another? Is it really My responsibility?

I felt I was being fobbed off. One member of staff, suggested that for example, if my neighbour were to smoke out of the window, it may still drift into my property via MY window. There is of course, no comparison, as I could close the window! It was just one of many silly things they said to me. None of which addressed the issue of my property being (in my opinion) inadequately sealed.

Thank you for reading - sorry it's so long!

Sorry, evict not evect!

You have put up with this for a long time. Might it be time to get a handy man in to fill the gap? I did that in my old flat to stop mice coming up from downstairs neighbour. It didn't cost a fortune. Problem solved.

You actually can't evict a tenant for smoking. You can stipulate it in a ast but it wouldn't stand up in court.

You could serve a S21 notice. And deduct monies from the bond to make good the repairs. But unless the tenant is doing something illegal or immoral (prostitution for example) it isn't grounds to serve a S8 notice which is the one to gain possession for breach of tenancy.

You could serve one if you liked. But if the tenant didn't leave it's very, very unlikely a court would award possession for smoking.

I'm afraid I disagree. A tenant would have signed the ast agreeing to the (not unreasonable) condition. Smoking causes a lot of damage, this damage would have been caused deliberately by the tenants by choosing to smoke in the property. What makes you so sure a court would say that this was OK and that the tenants could continue to cause further damage? I don't believe this has been tested in court but I really wouldn't be so confident possession would be denied. I think it would be unlikely to be tested anyway though, any ll with any sense would issue a s21 in the first place, a lot less hassle.

I had this in my home. (I owned it) next door were really heavy smokers and the smell filled my bathroom. It stunk. I got a builder round and he said there was nothing to be done. It was a terraced house 1900's and the party wall had a cavity. The floor boards were allowing air into the property and Unfortuntly also smoke. They couldn't come up with a solution. It was filling my airing cupboard.

I have no solution but total sympathy. I can imagine how bad it is.

Fakename your Clause isn't legally enforceable, although you could obviously give notice if they were on a. Rolling contract anyway.

You can type anything in a contract, doesn't mean the law enforces it for you.

Fakename your Clause isn't legally enforceable

As I said, I don't believe it's ever been tested.

It doesn't need to be tested. It's overridden by statutory law. It wouldn't get into court and I have no doubt people have tried
You can't tell people how to live in their home. It's nothing to do with the landlord.

Actually im a bit confused by your "don't believe it's been tested" claim. Why would be relevant whether or not you think it's been tested?
You could never know what goes on in eviction hearings all over the country. It's not really making a point to say that is it?

I would approach this in an entirely different way,

Do the flats have integrated smoke alarms?

Flats have to meet building rules and regulations, and building reg are very tight regarding smoke from a fire been able to travel from one flat to another.

I would forget the "smelly problem" and ring the council and ask for the building inspector(from building control(planning)) to come and advice about a possible construction problem, which luckily you noticed because harmless cooking smells and tobacco smoke was coming up,

It is a serious construction issue if there is a way for fumes/smoke to rise, the property does not meet UK building regs.

the housing people are idiots, as if they had sent someone out with some plaster and sealant, they wouldn't now have to review all their properties to check they meet building regs.

I bet they do meet their health & safety responsibilities though- no reason to think they don't? Theyre nowhere near as high as people might imagine You don't even need a fire alarm In many communal blocks.

are you sure?

smoke alarms are now mandatory in all private rentals, as they should be. Are HA properties exempt from this?

that said, there's no way to stop the tenant disabling the alarm.

We had a similar problem (with the person living under us). The smell of smoke coming from the kitchen cupboard, where the pipes entered, used to really stink up everything. If it wasn't that we weren't in the UK I would think it is the same place!

And no, it is not necessarily faint. At all! It used to really stink. I have no advice but you have my sympathies.

Yep very sure. Smoke alarms inside flats (which isn't related to OPs issue) is a different thing to the construction of the block and fire alarms communal areas though.

You cannot choose which building reg your building meets, it's a very clear regulation about fire and smoke barriers between floors, and a floor that lets up other smoke is going to fail to meet building regulations.

So get building control to condemn it, and they will have to fix it.

That's not going to happen quote. I don't even know why you think it might.

Thank you to the people confirming how horrible it is to be subjected to other people's cigarette smoke (or smells in general). As at least two of you have confirmed, it can be very strong indeed, affecting your quality of life. Quote - I will contact the council about this simply because I'm curious now as to what they will say. Other than that I will find a way to deal with it myself.

We filled some holes in in our kitchen last year when next doors pet snake decided to enter our flat. (we didnt know they had one or whose it was because they didnt own up that it was theirs until we had done all the donkey work. I had a thread on here about it at the time.

When we do have the windows open (we didnt for a few months because it took me a while to get over it) i can sometimes smell their cig smoke but its preferable to their snake. Im also HA

I used to sit in my lounge bf-ing in the summer with the windows open and could smell if someone walked passed smoking. I do have double glazing.

Thankfully I don't have passing traffic.

Just do as suggested and get the swelling foamy stuff.

Fakenamefornow I worked giving legal advice to landlords and letting agents for 3 years. The tenant is entitled to quiet enjoyment of the property. That includes smoking if they wish. You can type an AST up stating no pets or no smoking or no children or no shagging on the kitchen counters but if you served a S8 notice relying on that reason and subsequently filed for possession you would not be awarded it.

The only thing you actually need on a tenancy agreement is start date, end date, rent due date and amount, property address, name and address of tenants, name and address of landlord and the fact that it is a shorthold assured tenancy. The other billionty clauses you see are just fillings as there are standard rights and responsibilities for all tenants and all landlords as prescribed by the housing act.

I have every sympathy. This is why I am very glad all the flats in our building have smoke detectors wired to the mains - I think this is a requirement for new builds but I don't think it is enforceable on older properties. I think there is also a problem in that current building regulations cannot be applied to existing properties.

I don't understand the focus on smoke detectors and fore alarms- a smoke detector shouldn't (if working properly) be activated by someone smoking, particularly if that person isn't even in the same unit.

Mine activate if you smoke in the same room as them. That means the neighbour, who also has the smoke detector cannot smoke. We did have someone smoking in the internal bathrooms once and that permeated down the central air vent pretty unpleasantly.