AIBU to not know how to get my 8mo to bed/sleep?

[HariboFrenzy]

Pfb started teething at Christmas. Since then sleep has been awful. It feels like unless I am with him all the time he whinges and cries. I try and follow a bedtime routine of tea (porridge) followed by bath 30 mins later then dressed for bed, then bed. But.he.will.not.sodding.sleep. He's still awake now. When he does eventually sleep he will wake between 3 and 4 and be awake for 2 hours. I'm starting to feel really low as I'm knackered and never get any time away from him That sounds awful but there's no regular nap time where I can just sit down and have a break.

Tell me what I can do to make help him sleep. What sort of routine should an 8mo have??

Sounds awful, I feel for you. What do you do while you are waiting for him to go to sleep? Do you sit next to his crib? Do you go out of the room?

YANBU at all! Baby sleep is an utter mystery to me. 8/9 month sleep regression possibly? I have no ideas, just sympathy. DD was an absolute nightmare with sleep at 8 months. I was on my knees with it. Similar story, I couldn't get her to settle, she would wake at some ungodly hour in the middle of the night and party for 3 hours, then conk out for 2 hours and be up for the day. It drove me mad. BUT, like a light switch, she started sleeping through at about 9 months, and still does minus the usual teething/illness nights. So I can only give you some hope.

I found regular naps helped, at about 8 months she dropped to 2 naps at around 10am and 2pm. Getting there was another story, but it did help.

Coffee, and much finger crossing for you that it settles soon!

Another thought- can you try bringing bedtime forward a bit? I eventually realised that if bedtime was too late, even half an hour, she got hyper and wouldn't sleep through being overtired. Sometimes a slight tweak of bedtime can make a huge difference.

Thank you nutty fingers tightly crossed that one day soon he will just go to sleep and stay asleep! Glad your lo sleeps better now.

Owl I try different things. I usually end up either bringing him downstairs where he writhes on my lap, rubbing his eyes and arching his back, or lying next to him and ignoring his whinges and whines except to occasionally replace his dummy.

Ok, well first of all it might just be that this is the way he is for now but that doesn't mean it'll be this way forever. I know how hard it is OP, I really do. Don't give yourself a hard time and remember that there are so many other people going through this too.

I'd make sure he wasn't in pain, I know some people don't agree but when my DS is chewing on his hands and drooling I give him calpol. It works for him, he settles much better with it. So check he's not too uncomfortable first and rule that out.

I work on the notion that 'sleep breeds sleep' and an 8 month old should be having 2 naps a day. The routine I use is:

7.30 bottle followed by porridge which is made up using his formula milk.
9-9.45am nap
10 am snack and water - yoghurt, banana or toast
11.30am lunch and water
12-1.30pm nap
2pm bottle
4.30pm tea, dessert and water
6pm bath
6.30pm bottle
7-7.30pm bed

Can you try giving him a bath first and then give him his meal? Have found baths stimulate DS and bathing him first and then feeding him make him sleepier. He was a terrible sleeper at that age as well. When the teething pain was very bad I gave him nurofen or mixed Weleda chamomile drops in his milk.

Is he the same with his dad?

What time are you trying to get him to bed? Is he crawling yet? Sleep for both mine was horrific just before they started crawling.

Agree with pp that altering bedtime can help. For mine bedtime too early at that age would result in going to sleep much later than they would if put to bed later iyswim.

You have my sympathy though. I was a complete wreck at that age. It does get better though.

Thank you all. I think I need to maybe start the bedtime routine earlier. He always seems knackered from 5pm but that seems way too early? I guess I could aim to put him down between 6/6.30. Bath before food is a good idea as he does seem very tired after his tea.

He is the same with dad unfortunately. Although dad has got him to sleep a couple of times lately when I've lost my patience

No, he's not crawling yet. I've been trying to put him down between 7.30 and 8.30.

Teething pain is awful for some babies. My daughter had a dreadful time.

My top tip would be regular calpol throughout the day when teething is at its worst. Nurofen when you go to bed.

If (ha ha who am I kidding...) when my daughter woke I eventually broke the waking by lying in her room saying 'shhh shhhh sleepy time' in between cries. As soon as she stopped crying I would say it. Basically it reassured her that I was there. It took quite a while but we had improvement within a week. After a few months she was going down at 7.30/8 and wouldn't wake until 7am. This was after a prolonged period of waking up multiple times every night. Oh, I also made sure she had just one special teddy in her cot which she still uses now to get to sleep.

it is the utter pits I know. My daughter slept through at eight weeks and it all went to pot at six months with teething. She is now almost seven and is a great sleeper. Hang in there, it does pass.

Try looking at the baby whisper website or books, she had some very good advice about routines. It's not a strict schedule, but about reading your baby's cues. My son was feeding to sleep and couldn't self settle and I tried the shush pat at about 4 months. It took less than a week to change his habit. You never leave them with the shush pat, and comfort straight away, so I felt comfortable with it.

Your situation sounds different, but it still might give you some answers about why he's not settling.

Not too early at all. If he's tired at 5ish go with it, start the bath and tea routine then and see what happens.

My son did not sleep through until he was 18 months (up until then it was pretty much every 2-3 hours) and even now at nearly three he wakes a few times a week so you are not alone. Naps were irregular and always in the car / buggy / carrier or on me. I think he has slept in his cot during the day maybe twice.

I would suggest trying a bath early (or have it during the day) as any water seems to over excite him and having tea just before bed so he has a nice full tummy. Try an earlier bedtime as sometimes they can be overtired but this does not always work. Even now to get him asleep we have to sit in his room. I use this time to catch up on Facebook/ mumsnet so sort of me time (just silent and in the dark.....) thankfully my daughter sleeps much better.......

I will confess now, I had DS sleep with me in my bed.
(Before anyone throws their hands in the air and calls Social Services, I wasnt stupid. I got rid of the pillow and had the duvet down beneath my elbow, and had my arm over him. I was a light sleeper. I didnt ever roll on him and he survived.
anyway I'm pretty sure that what we used to do centuries ago.)

It was the only way I got any bloody sleep. He was a total limpet, didnt nap in the day and slept for about four hours a night.
By the time he was about 2 he had his own bed.

Until then if I wanted a shower I strapped him into the pushchair and let him cry. Being walked or wheeled around was literally the only way to get him to stop crying. I pushed him around the streets at 1am more nights than I care to remember.

6 m o DS is still rocking and rolling here at ten past eleven. He is not tired; he's never tired in the evenings, and it's pointless putting him in bed as he will either laugh or cry but certainly not sleep.

Commiserations to those of you that have or are going through similar although I am secretly relieved it's not just me.

titclash I have him in bed with me too. As you say, anything to maximise sleep. Only, it doesn't seem to be working really

DD is/was a night owl. Only when she started school did bedtime ever have an 8 in it (and even then she is sometimes awake at gone 9pm). As a baby she would wake most nights for exactly 2 hours. (There's been some research recently that suggests none of us should be sleeping for 1 long stretch every night, but 2 shorter stretches with a break in the middle. It's only societal constructs that mean we work 9-5 nowadays.)

I just went with it, to be honest. Path of least resistance. We co-slept and I slept when she did during the day (DH worked away during the week).

Doesn't seem to have caused any long term damage.

There's fuck all wrong with co-sleeping/bedsharing, BTW. We don't expect adults to sleep alone, so why do we expect young babies to do it?

Well I agree there's nothing wrong with bed sharing if that's what you feel comfortable with. Not every body does, and adults are expected to sleep alone really, until they have a partner.

I think that separation anxiety can make them a bit anxious to be left at night at this age.

I used to lie with DS until he fell asleep and then I'd sneak off and leave him with a monitor. I had him in bed too :)

As a nanny and night nanny, I would say it could be just his teeth waking him, it can go on for weeks/months! He could be having a growth spurt and waking up hungry.

What is your daily routine?

I would say he needs another short nap about 4pm, just 30-45 minutes. As a PP mentioned, sleep breeds sleep, the more that have, the more they need.

My 8 month old routine is -

7am - wake and a milk feed
8am - breakfast cereal, milk and fruit. 1/2 a slice of toast.
9am - nap 45-60 minutes.
10am - wake, wash and dress.
10:30 - snack (rice cake, fruit, cheese, bread, etc) activity. Class to stimulate, playing/reading at home or in the garden, swimming.
11:45 - lunch (main meal) and pudding (fruit or yoghurt)
12pm - nap for 2 hours.
2pm - milk. Playtime!
4pm - nap 45-60 minutes
5pm - tea, lighter meal, try to avoid protein as this is difficult to digest and may wake him.
6pm - bath with lots of fun play if he's happy to splash about.
6:30 - milk (and a story) with lights low, calm soothing tones!
7pm - into bed awake and leave to self settle.

It does just seem that all you are doing is feeding, changing and getting them to nap but I really do believe routine helps, they learn to expect what is coming and is comforting to them.

I have had 23 charges, all slept through 7-7 (or 7:30-7:30 depending on what routine my employers prefer)

I have been a night nanny to and sleep trained over 50 children with various methods adapted to the parents and they all had 12 hours at night (mostly! Bad dreams, illnesses or wet beds excepted)

I believe it is al down to routine.

You can of course switch the routine to suit you, especially if you have older children, just try to do things at the same time, in the same order every day, once settled into a routine, you can drop the routine for the odd day and they'll slip right back into it again.

It has never taken me longer than 5 days to train the children (it can take longer to train the parents though!!)

Oh and absolutely nothing wrong with co-sleeping, whatever works for you, however, I would advice getting one of those bedside cots (or taking the side off his present cot and butt it up to your bed), if only so you get a decent nights sleep with out worrying about him at all.