AIBU to focus on what he doesn't do rather than what he does do?

[Joolsy]

My OH is not particularly 'hands on' with out LOs (12 and 6). He never really plays with them, might play the odd game here & there, does a bit of reading with DD2 and reads her a bedtime story sometimes. He does chat with them alot though and is interested in what they've been doing at school etc. This gets my goat however as it's usually down to me to think of things to do with them, think of places to go etc, although he will come along too. He tends to sit around on the sofa rather than engage with them, or if he does, it's on his terms. However, he is very hard working, very generous (pays all the bills plus most other stuff) and I trust him 100%. Should I focus on what he does well and stop giving him a hard time about what he doesn't do? I can't actually remember either of my parents playing with me much but I always felt loved

At 12 I would have hated either of my parents wanting to "play" with me! Like a pp I don't really remember either of them doing it much when I was younger either, whereas I can still remember in great detail all the weird games I played with my friends. We used to chat at teatime and generally hang about the house doing our own things secure in the knowledge that the family was around us, my Dad did teach me to ride a bike and we used to go together to buy the Christmas tree. That's about it really. Didn't feel neglected, did very well at school and am a fairly balanced person I reckon. Maybe you need to relax a bit more with DH?

TBH with a 12 year old child, could they do stuff like gardening (obviously not cutting hedges etc' but weeding, digging?) or housework (hoovering etc) - learning through doing. Helping out. It would model the idea that parents aren't there just to 'put stuff to do' there/spoonfeed, and would give both parents a helping hand.

I think if you are the one out working you're less atuned to what they might like to do/play, just simply because you're with them less. Also that whilst some people are great at playing with dc, others aren't. DH is far better at playing than I am. He enjoys it more than I do. For example they can spend a whole week barging each other wearing cardboard boxes, whereas I really don't want to do that. I could try and go through the motions but I would find it hard to enjoy it. Whereas he thinks it's hilarious fun. But I'll probably be the one doing their music practice with them. If workloads are generally fairly even, I'd just consider it that he's probably less atuned to what they'd like to play and may not be very good at playing. It seems to come naturally to dh and I wonder if it's because he had a younger brother to entertain.

My parents didn't play with me and I certainly don't play with mine. I actually hate playing and I do think they should be able to entertain each other and themselves for long periods of time.

However I am very engaged with my children and the weekends are a time for us to be together, do stuff together, hang out together. Even if that means doing errands together or cooking dinner together.

I work FT and am a single parent so I don't get any down time and that might be extreme in itself. But I do wonder about these parents who devote their weekends to themselves because they have been working hard all week ...

But I do wonder about these parents who devote their weekends to themselves because they have been working hard all week ...

...YY. And I stick to my guns that it's usually the guy who gets more leeway in the press and general public consciousness. Exceptions apply but it's a prejudice we need to be aware of and challenge, not stumble into repeating.

Full time working mums and single mums rarely get the 'she's been at work all week breadwinning, give her an afternoon off." Plenty say it about husbands when both work, and those without partners rarely get a look in.

It really doesn't sound like he's shirking, FT, gardening, diy etc, he talks to them. At 12 and 6 can't they entertain themselves.

Don't organise stuff to do and see what happens.

How much of the things you decide to do are because you want to get out and about.

Don't organise stuff to do and see what happens.

OK... but the 'let it lie' solution can cause problems in itself.
Using a more extreme version (if someone was actually being lazy) would be 'stop tidying up- see how long before he notices'. Of course even if he does mend his ways, the woman has been placed in a position where for a while her life is uncomfortable/different, she must compromise/lose out because the silent assumption/allowed dialogue means she can't just say it and be respected.

In this case it won't be as unpleasant. However, why not speak to the kids and ask them? Speak as a family? Rather than 'going without and seeing what happens' which is very passive.

I don't think it is very clear what you are complaining about, OP. I was never any good at playing with my dd, but like your husband read her stories and chatted to her a lot. One plays to one's strengths.

Do you feel that you are doing the lion's share of work in your house and with the children? If that is the case, you need to have a chat with him.

But the children might be quite happy to not do as much.

It's all speculation until the OP comes back and clarifies the issues.

I am not sure if the issue is division of labour. That the OP gets stuck with certain jobs because he doesn't think about it. Would she like to do diy and less washing for example.

Or the interaction with the children.

If it's down to the children it really depends on his general relationship with the kids. There is no hint they are unhappy.

how would you react if he complained about all the bills and expenses you don't pay and ignored everything else?

Do parents really play with their children? OK, my toddler DS I do - but beyond the age of 3 I can't really imagine it. I don't think my parents ever played with me. Wouldn't it be really boring? I remember having really intricate role-playing type games with complex rules about what people 'had to' do. I don't think I'd liked to be sucked into one of them now...

I think that if you end up devising outings and generally occupying them yanbu. But equally hinbu if his idea of occupying them is 'go and read a book' or whatever. Definitely both of you should get equal child-free leisure time - and he shouldn't be able to escape childcare by gardening (unless you are really not keen for gardening). Maybe approach it from an equality of labour-time perspective rather than the perspective of "when you do spend time with the kids, you do it wrong" perspective - it seems like the division of labour thing is important.

So, he works full time, pays all the bills 'plus other stuff', does all the DIY and gardening, and is a fairly hands on dad?

What a cunt. LTB.

Good question airba. Op works part time but doesn't contribute anything to the household bills. I notice she and her supporters on here are not complaining about that little aspect of the arrangement. Funny, that.

It sounds as if you want your DH to parent like you, OP. Yet you are 2 different people. He doesn't sound distant or disengaged from you and the children. Im not for DCs having constant activities planned, nor using number and frequency of outings as a measure of how good a parent one is. If your partner works full-time, does gardening DIY and engages with your DCs (albeit not exactly in the way you would like) then I can't quite see the issue here, do you want him to spend all weekend heavily focused on the DCs and planned activities and outings, because he works a lot during the week?

& nothing in your post says you don't get down time yourself. You work part time, your DCs aren't babies they're at school. That isn't to say you don't have a full days work yourself, doing the morning and evening organising. But how hands on do you really have to be with a 12 year old and a 6 year old?

Sounds to me as if you both parent your children but, in different ways. Is that really so bad? If it is then work out what more you want your DH to do and tell him. Just make sure you're being fair

Weekend don't always have to be super entertaining. Get them to take them swimming on Saturday morning whilst you have some rest. Then on Sunday everyone goes out for walk or something together. Rest of ten time they can play by themselves.

how would you react if he complained about all the bills and expenses you don't pay and ignored everything else?

1. She works part time so presumably contributes proportionally and doesn't run off and spend it all on sweets?
2. I think 99.9% of women not in the 1950s don't believe in the 'if a man works outside the home he can slack off at home'.

3. She's not calling him LAZY - she's talking about how they're both in their ruts of 'their' jobs and need some give and take. It's quite clear from the OP that this is the case.

Squizita, just because in some households the work isnt fairly distributed, doesn't mean that's the case in the OP. In fact the OP has said nothing to suggest that her DH doesn't 'pull his weight' in terms of contributing to the household, in fact it sounds like he does his fair share.

I'm not sure why you keep talking about 'full tine working women' when the OP works part time with 2 school age kids?

Another poster talked about the DH 'escpaing childcare' by doing the gardening? Would you refer to doing the laundry as escaping childcare? Why are things like gardening and DIY seen as 'down time'? I would be interested to know why it's the OPs DH who does those jobs? Is it because he insists on doing them to get out of childcare, even though the OP has told him countless times that she can do it? Or is it because (like in my house) the OP is crap at stuff like that andnif he didn't do it it wouldn't get done?

I have no idea what the OP contributes but she says he pays all the bills plus most other stuff

So what if he concentrated on that rather than all the stuff she does do?

Until the OP comes back and clarifies it's difficult to judge.

But if overall your partner is a good partner and parent, focusing on what they don't do isn't healthy. If you aren't happy with the set up then it needs changing, that's fine.

Focusing on someone's weaknesses and not at all on the good stuff they do is unfair. No one is perfect.

Your posting history seems to have a particular focus on threads where the wife could be viewed as 'gold digging' or has criticised her husband (honestly this reply surprised me in it's slightly old-fashioned take) - with a bit of a 'women are unreasonable' tone in a few.

That's really bad form

Highsteaks it was in reference to us 'supporters' apparently all happy with a 'man earns it all' situation when it suits us. I am making the point that in fact the 2 main 'supporters' don't have that set up so it's not what we mean.

As I keep saying, what comes across here (and a few people seem to have picked up on) is that this isn't about total work done. Nor cash. It's about how they both seem stuck in ruts/roles - she doesn't like this and it's reached a stalemate. I've seen many of these over the years on MN- and it's an issue that a lot of blogs and social media stuff is focusing on at the moment.
No one is calling him lazy.
It's this situation where one partner (almost always the wife) does "the thinking" so although the other partner works hard, all the 'emotional labour' falls on them in a way that's hard to evidence but leads to huge resentment.

People then keep coming back again and again saying 'don't call him lazy!' and 'he pays for everything!' and they're both straw dog arguments. Also, the 'he pays for everything' one has been used to keep women silent across so many homes and in our culture over the years I will always challenge it.

Katenka Searching posting history is normal practice if the poster is unfamiliar and posting something that could be seen as stirring up. We all know that 'mens rights' people come to MN to goad and be anti feminist and these things need to be reported: in this case Irishdad79 is a genuine poster with a history but I do think it is relevant that - based on a MN search - there seems to be a pattern.

Is it because he insists on doing them to get out of childcare, even though the OP has told him countless times that she can do it? Or is it because (like in my house) the OP is crap at stuff like that and if he didn't do it it wouldn't get done?

YY: this is what we need to know.

My take is, if it was the latter why would she be feeling so resentful?

...re the 'time away from the kids' - the "tired parents" cartoons MN has started linking to sums it up quite well. I know a lot of parents who DO view going to tesco, gardening etc as 'a break from the kids' - there are even FB memes about it with kids under 10.
I would of course wonder why they need to be that hands on with a 12 year old though.

It's this situation where one partner (almost always the wife) does "the thinking" so although the other partner works hard, all the 'emotional labour' falls on them in a way that's hard to evidence but leads to huge resentment.

To be fair, when you frequent a mainly women only website, where its mainly women who post about their situations, of course this is the impression you are going to get. You only ever get one side of the story in here. How on earth do you know what her DH 'thinks'?