to think that if you send a letter from a school that might go public - you check for comma splices

[katmanwho]

School said it would give pupils bread and butter if they didn't have money.
Parents complain. Goes national in the news.
School retracts.

The letter is here:

www.albanacademy.org/assets/schoolmealsletterretraction-1.pdf

Part of it:

Following a number of parental concerns regarding the recent school
meals letter we have decided to rethink our policy and will not be
introducing the new system outlined in that letter.
I apologise if this has caused any offence, this was not our intention.

The letter itself was intended to explain the situation and trial a policy
that has been successfully adopted by other schools

Actually - commas seem lacking in the first sentence as well.

This is not a chatty letter. This is an official retraction.

Could do better

Jesus. I'm an arseache, am I? Charming. There is no need for name calling, and that's actually quite hurtful. I bet in real life you wouldn't say I was an arseache, would you?

I started the comma splice thread a few weeks ago - and sorry to everyone who says it's a matter of style; it isn't.

It's just wrong in UK English.

It may be acceptable in informal writing or fiction (if the author knows what they're doing), but it's not acceptable in formal writing.

Some comments on here haven't been very nice. I don't understand why someone would get so upset and start name calling on a thread like this.

One of the links I posted had it right - it looks amateurish. This is a school which has gained media attention. If I was the Head and I knew that the media was interested in my school, I would want to make a good impression - despite the initial cock up.

That letter - with missing commas, comma splice and poorly constructed sentences does not give a good impression. It is not a school I would want DS to go to - I think standards matter and impressions count. A head teacher should know how to compose a professional apology to parents - or should check it if it was dictated.

Oh fuck off with your fucking comma fucking splices

I think you need some commas in there

Oh, fuck off with your fucking comma, fucking splices?

Oh ,fuck off with your fucking, comma ,fucking splices?

It's the 3rd fucking that's confusing me.

My mum (an English teacher in Scotland) taught be about comma splices - so it's not unheard of in Scottish education.

She used to mark "O" grade (later, Standard grade) and Higher papers. She used to get really annoyed about the prevalence of comma splices and told me that the marking guidelines were that the use of a comma splice meant an automatic fail. Now, I don't know if that was only in the Higher paper or if it was just in a particular part of the exam (and I can't ask her any more ).

Nevertheless, it left a lasting legacy and I am always very conscious of comma splices. Dh is guilty of using them frequently (and I always correct them if I am proof reading his work), whereas I probably over-use colons and semi-colons in compensation.

Jesus. I'm an arseache, am I? Charming. There is no need for name calling, and that's actually quite hurtful. I bet in real life you wouldn't say I was an arseache, would you?

Probably not. But then I bet you don't conduct lengthy conversations about sodding comma splices at parties or on the bus. So we are all square.

The main reason that I am on MN is to talk about stuff I don't talk to people at parties about. Speaking of which, the signer of that dads and lads letter signed his title, I see. There was a lengthy thread about that a while back, as I recall.

I'm grateful to the person who started the previous comma skills thread. I'd never heard of a comma splice before I read that thread. It turns out I was guilty of that mistake a lot.

I've never heard of 'comma splicing'....

Speaking of which, the signer of that dads and lads letter signed his title, I see. There was a lengthy thread about that a while back, as I recall

I was taught it's bad form to award oneself a title.

You answer the phone with "Smith or John Smith " if you are John Smith or " "Jane Smith" if female. Letter are signed J or John or Jane Smith.

You always introduce yourself as John Smith / Jane Smith with no title.

Actually, Compos, it would have been better if you had apologised for the insult than to justify it.
The first insult could be taken as accidental twatishness, but justifying it, well, justifies that impression.
There is simply no need for either and people are certainly free here to discuss whatever they want. Just not to insult or personally attack others.

I don't think it's something I would get worked up over. Does it really matter?

In this instance isn't the purpose of the letter more important than a comma splice?

not that i had to google comma splice

Yawn.

Comma splices apart, I do there's an issue here and it's around the way that respect for teachers has diluted in the last few generations. A head teacher is responsible for literacy for an entire school community. If the head teacher can't communicate in a way that is grammatically correct and with clarity it undermines the competence of that teaching community and the profession generally. If teacher's can't communicate to the highest standards orally and I writing there has to be an impact on the quality of their teaching.

I agree about the title too. It's called equality and I think schools are quite hot on equality and diversity. He's pompous.

I have called my children's last few form teachers by their first name and they have used mine. They are great and both times I've just said "please call me Beaufort". My doctor, who is very much Dr Jones has been pulled up for using my first name - because it's an equality issue.

Many apologies if there are any typos above. It's a quick post off my phone; not a formal letter.

I sometimes sign myself as Dr G. Lan because I'm curious to see if people will assume I'm male. Often they do. I also use my title at work but generally only when someone (usually a man) talks to me as if I'm about 12.

I'm more concerned that the head claims that that policy has been successfully adopted by other schools. Frankly, I don't believe it.

I'm with the pp who said that they couldn't find fuck to give.

And a letter home to parents isn't "formal academic" document. It's a letter.

I think you might need to unclench a bit op

Gabilan that's absolutely fine providing you refer to the patient, if they are the subject of your letter, as Mrs B Belle I received a copy from a doctor who signed herself off as Dr x x who put my first name, surname (no title) at the top and referred to me throughout as her and she. I had a dreadful experience in that clinic and the letter was the icing on the cake vis a vis embedded disrespect for the patient. My impression of that lady Dr because of it was that she was a self important ignoramus I'm afraid.

And a letter home to parents isn't "formal academic" document. It's a letter.

I don't understand this rationale. It's a head teacher writing a letter to be sent home with every child in the school. Surely this is the time to make an earnest attempt at perfect English?

Perfect English should be like breathing to a head teacher, really.

And a letter home to parents isn't "formal academic" document. It's a letter

And if a year 6 child - who had just done a SPAG test and had corrected comma splices - had questioned it, would they have been told "it's just a letter, grammar's not important".

Kind of defeats the teaching, doesn't it? DS is learning all about complex SPAG for his test. Learning about noun phrases, modal verbs, determiners, semi colons, conjunctions etc. If the Head wrote a letter to parents that was poorly punctuated, what message does that send to the children who are having SPAG drummed into them?

Yes. But the comma splices are the least of the grammar worries aren't they?

Op said comma splices are only unacceptable (as opposed to a stylistic choice) in formal academic writing. I don't consider a letter to parents to be either formal or academic. So I expect them to be written clearly and grammatically correctly but I couldn't give a damn about comma splices in them.

Does that make more sense?

I didn't say grammar is not important in a letter op. I said comma splices aren't important in a letter since I don't consider it to be a formal document as such. Does that make it clearer ffs!

Op said comma splices are only unacceptable (as opposed to a stylistic choice) in formal academic writing

No - OP said it was formal writing. Not formal academic writing. I did ask whether people thought a letter was formal or informal.

I think it's formal - not chatty. You don't think so.

No, I don't think so. You are so self righteously indignantly determined to be so bloody right about this that you have put words in my mouth.